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Author Topic:   Bible prophecy - Nothing compares
kendemyer
Inactive Member


Message 1 of 48 (89890)
03-02-2004 7:16 PM


PROPHECY: THE BIBLE HAS NO EQUALS
Foretelling the future was not the sole domain of the Jewish prophets. The Old Testament prophets instructed the Jews regarding doctrine and moral matters. Many times they were not well received due to people not wanting to turn from their error. In addition to this, they warned of future judgement or provided assurance to the Jewish people that God would take care of them. In this latter regard, foretelling the future played a part. Sometimes people listened to the prophets and judgement was avoided. Sometimes they did not and judgement came according to what the prophets foretold.
The law said if a prophet spoke words that were not doctrinally correct (worship another God) or if their prophecies did not come true they were put to death.
Many people are unaware that no book or person has ever remotely compared to the Bible in terms of foretelling the future in terms of specificity, numbers of prophecies, or accuracy of prophecy. We will take a look at non-Bible pyschics and mediums first and then show the amazing accuracy of Bible prophets (a true prophet is correct 100% of the time).
BIBLE PROPHETS VERSUS NON-BIBLE MEDIUMS/PSYCHICS
Brookside Church in Ohio states the following regarding the Bible's laws regarding prophets and the accuracy of modern day psychics as reported by a recent study:
"A true prophet is correct 100% of the time. A test of a prophet was whether they prophesied an event that did not come to pass. Prophets whose predictions failed to come to pass were stoned [It should be said that some prophecies were conditional. For example, if a certain people did not repent then they would suffer judgement.] Some prophecies w. People would think twice before revealing any kind of prophecy. Yet the Bible contains more prophecy about Jesus than any other book on any other founder of ancient religion.
Today there are people who claim to have psychic power. In 1975, The People's Almanac did a study of 25 of the best psychics. Out of 72 predictions, 66 (92%) were totally wrong. The remaining 8% could be explained away."
Taken from the following website: http://www.brooksidechurch.com/etw/jc7.htm
Norman Geisler on Nostradomus:
http://www.johnankerberg.org/Articles/theo...ry/TD1001W4.htm
An Article that discusses Jeanne Dixon and Nostradomus:
http://www.inplainsite.org/html/nostradamu...ward__vanp.html
GENERAL ARTICLE: PROPHECY AS A DEFENSE OF THE BIBLE
http://www.equip.org/free/DA151.htm
TYRE AND JERUSALEM IN PROPHECY
http://custance.org/old/hidden/3ch3.html
SOME PROPHECIES OF THE BIBLE
http://www.100prophecies.org/default.htm
http://www.christadelphian.org.uk/booklets/bprop1.html
MESSIANIC PROPHECY FULFILLED IN JESUS
[This message has been edited by kendemyer, 03-02-2004]

  
kendemyer
Inactive Member


Message 2 of 48 (89891)
03-02-2004 7:21 PM


I know that there are specialist in Bible prophecy. I have read more than some but I do not pretend to be a specialist in this area. I recommend the following resources though:
ANSWERS TO BIBLE QUESTIONS. USER FRIENDLY RESOURCES.
Bible Query - Answers to Bible questions (look up by verse)
http://www.tektonics.org/index2.html (extremely well organized )
A Christian Thinktank (allows lookup by topic or keywords )
Bible Search and Study Tools - Blue Letter Bible (excellent free commentaries)
Here are many online commentaries:
BibleGateway.com: A searchable online Bible in over 150 versions and 50 languages.: Eword
Sincerely,
Ken
[This message has been edited by kendemyer, 03-02-2004]

Replies to this message:
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1.61803
Member (Idle past 1504 days)
Posts: 2928
From: Lone Star State USA
Joined: 02-19-2004


Message 3 of 48 (89926)
03-02-2004 10:45 PM
Reply to: Message 2 by kendemyer
03-02-2004 7:21 PM


bible prophets verses psychics
Ok Mr. Ken are you saying any one on this board would challange Nostradamus Verse Noah? Man thats deep. LOL.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2 by kendemyer, posted 03-02-2004 7:21 PM kendemyer has not replied

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1.61803
Member (Idle past 1504 days)
Posts: 2928
From: Lone Star State USA
Joined: 02-19-2004


Message 4 of 48 (89927)
03-02-2004 10:55 PM
Reply to: Message 3 by 1.61803
03-02-2004 10:45 PM


Re: bible prophets verses psychics
Ken is it at all possible that the New Testament prophesy borrowed from the Old Testament in order to make the New Testament prohesy sound like they are being fulfilled?

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Amlodhi
Inactive Member


Message 5 of 48 (89928)
03-02-2004 10:59 PM
Reply to: Message 2 by kendemyer
03-02-2004 7:21 PM


Arguing by proxy
Ken,
If there's something you would like to discuss here, you are going to have to stop hiding behind links and arguing by proxy.
You seem to be under the impression that none of us are aware of the information you link to, but that is not the case for most of us. The situation is that you want to effortlessly slap out links to huge amounts of apologist literature, expect us to provide time consuming and detailed responses to a wide range of assertions, to which you then respond with "Nuh-uh, it's all true".
If you want to discuss biblical prophecy, pick one, detail when/where the prophecy was uttered and when/how it was subsequently fulfilled, and you will get reasonable responses.
It's either that or we can just effortlessly post a dozen links in rebuttal for you to read and respond to in detail. But then, this is supposed to be a discussion forum, not a recommended reading list.
Namaste'
Amlodhi

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PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 6 of 48 (89954)
03-03-2004 2:42 AM
Reply to: Message 2 by kendemyer
03-02-2004 7:21 PM


Since tektonics.org - one of your recommended sites - claims that Ezekiels prophecy against Tyre - a clear example of a failure - is one of the "flagship" examples of fulfilled prophecy, it is rather clear that there is no significant record of verifiable fulfilled prophecies from the Bible.
How does a record of failed prophecies help the Bible ?
(Oh and since you recently discussed Jonah you know full well that Jonah's prophecy against Ninevah was not fulfilled - which according to Deuteronomy 18:22 proves that Jonah was a false prophet and his message did not come from God).

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kendemyer
Inactive Member


Message 7 of 48 (90061)
03-03-2004 2:32 PM


TO: ALL
To: ALL
The Bible clearly says that if a people repents that judgement is not brought down on a people. Nineveh repented.
Please see:
[At what] instant I shall speak concerning a nation, and concerning a kingdom, to pluck up, and to pull down, and to destroy [it]; If that nation, against whom I have pronounced, turn from their evil, I will repent of the evil that I thought to do unto them. And [at what] instant I shall speak concerning a nation, and concerning a kingdom, to build and to plant [it]; If it do evil in my sight, that it obey not my voice, then I will repent of the good, wherewith I said I would benefit them. (Jeremiah 18:7-10)
A quick note: one of the Hebrew words can either be translated calamity or evil
I also offer this commentary:
"Then the word of the Lord comes to Jonah again, "Arise, go unto Nineveh, that great city, and preach unto it the preaching that I bid thee." (Jonah 3:2). Jonah then proclaims to Nineveh, "Yet forty days, and Nineveh shall be overthrown." (Jonah 3:4)
Was this prophecy fulfilled? Did it come to pass by forty days that Nineveh was overthrown? If not, was Jonah a false prophet?
In Strongs’s Concordance, the Hebrew word for overthrown is Haphak. It means to turn about or over. By implication to change, overturn, return, pervert: become, change, come, be converted. It also means to turn again, turn aside, turn back. Did Nineveh turn about or over? Was it converted?"
taken from: http://www.faithfellowshipchurch.com/Jonah2.html
The new city of Tyre is not built on the old but a little ways down. It also says fiserman will cast their nets on the bare rock. There is a fishing village but no rebuilt city.
The Tyre prophecy is a fortress.
If you have any other questions, please refer to the resources I gave.
Sincerely,
Ken

Replies to this message:
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kendemyer
Inactive Member


Message 8 of 48 (90065)
03-03-2004 2:37 PM


To: 1.61803
To: 1.61803
"Ken is it at all possible that the New Testament prophesy borrowed from the Old Testament in order to make the New Testament prohesy sound like they are being fulfilled?"
If you have not read much on the prophecy regarding the requirements that the Jewish Messiah would have to fulfill, I would suggest you read more on this matter and perhaps your opinion will change.
Lastly, I offfer you this link's commentary although I do not agree with 100% of what is said:
3: Belief and Action: Criteria for Responsible Decision « Living up to The Truth « Ohr Somayach
Sincerely,
Ken
[This message has been edited by kendemyer, 03-03-2004]

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1.61803
Member (Idle past 1504 days)
Posts: 2928
From: Lone Star State USA
Joined: 02-19-2004


Message 9 of 48 (90069)
03-03-2004 2:45 PM
Reply to: Message 8 by kendemyer
03-03-2004 2:37 PM


Re: To: 1.61803
"Shito ergo sum..I shit therefore I am." (written on the male bathroom wall in Vanderville University Tenn. ) I do not believe the Universe is 5 min old Ken. I read your link.

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Melchior
Inactive Member


Message 10 of 48 (90074)
03-03-2004 3:21 PM
Reply to: Message 7 by kendemyer
03-03-2004 2:32 PM


Re: TO: ALL
The story in itself is indeed consequent, but surely you cannot claim that the story of Jonah in itself is a measure of the accuracy of the bible in this matter? What outside evidence is there of these events?

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PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 11 of 48 (90097)
03-03-2004 4:15 PM
Reply to: Message 7 by kendemyer
03-03-2004 2:32 PM


Re: TO: ALL
So Jeremaiah also contradicts Deuteronomy, which makes no exceptions. Your answer then is that Deuteronomy is in error, and that God sometimes chooses not to fulfil prophecies.
As for Tyre, the book of Ezekiel itself (29:18) states that Nebuchadnezzar failed to conquer the city.
So I repeat the question. If there is such clear evidence of fulfilled prophecy in the Bible, why is a failure touted as a "flagship" example of a success ?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 7 by kendemyer, posted 03-03-2004 2:32 PM kendemyer has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 12 by kendemyer, posted 03-03-2004 5:18 PM PaulK has replied
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kendemyer
Inactive Member


Message 12 of 48 (90120)
03-03-2004 5:18 PM
Reply to: Message 11 by PaulK
03-03-2004 4:15 PM


Re: TO: ALL
To: Paul
http://www.tektonics.org/godchangemind.html
Sincerely,
Ken

This message is a reply to:
 Message 11 by PaulK, posted 03-03-2004 4:15 PM PaulK has replied

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Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 13 of 48 (90137)
03-03-2004 6:20 PM
Reply to: Message 11 by PaulK
03-03-2004 4:15 PM


Re: TO: ALL
As for Tyre, the book of Ezekiel itself (29:18) states that Nebuchadnezzar failed to conquer the city.
Ezekiel says no such thing. All he says here is that God hadn't yet rewarded him with wages for doing the city in, so God was giving him Egypt for wages.
1. Nebuchadnezzar destroyed the city in 573 B.C.
2. An island colony was left intact.
3. 240 years later Alex the Great built a causeway out of the debris from Nebuchadnezzar's previous destruction of Tyre's mainland and swept the colony clean to the bedrock, casting the rubble into the sea. He used the rubble from The mainland city destruction to build the causeway.
4. Fishermen spread their nets there today as the prophecy fortold.
5. The city of Tyre that exists today is not on the same site.
If you want a bonafide prophecy, there it is. If you don't want a prophecy atol, no matter how it was fulfilled you will find some way to deny it. Too bad you're not that skeptical about all the evo stuff you swallow hook line and sinker.
[This message has been edited by buzsaw, 03-03-2004]

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Replies to this message:
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PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 14 of 48 (90145)
03-03-2004 7:02 PM
Reply to: Message 12 by kendemyer
03-03-2004 5:18 PM


Re: TO: ALL
It doesn't deal with Deuteronomy.
It DOES illustrate Turkel's habit of not linking to the essays he is arguing against.

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PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 15 of 48 (90146)
03-03-2004 7:06 PM
Reply to: Message 13 by Buzsaw
03-03-2004 6:20 PM


Re: TO: ALL
Nebuchadnezzar DIDN'T destroy the city.
The "island colony" IS the city.
Alexander isn't mentioned in the prophecy.
So the prophecy failed.

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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