Stop Trying To Prove Gods Existence

Faith was never meant to be proven... Thats what Faith is... its believing in something without proof of its existence.You cannot teach people Faith so dont try!If your looking for Faith you dont have any and you never will!You can however give people hope if you want and you can also help keep world order by helping religions around the world use propoganda to teach people to be moral and not be scared to die...these are all noble reasons to preach things you cannot prove.

I've no problem if people have faith or not, but if anyone can really prove a god, then go for it. Do people really need religious propoganda to be "moral"? Is it noble that teaching people not to fear death has lead to many suicide bombings? Does this help keep world order?edit: to fix ubbcode[This message has been edited by Lindum, 03-12-2004]

Faith is not what you prove. Faith is based on things proven to be reliable. Jesus was born in fulfillment of OT Biblical prophecy. Jesus prophesied things coming to fulfillment in our day. Jesus performed scores of miracles and was raised from the dead so millions would not need to rely on blind faith in his messianic claims as folks like Muslims must rely on with their prophet/messiah. The spirit of Jesus, the Holy Spirit lives within bonafide Christians today witnessing to our spirits that we are God's children via faith in him, Jesus, our lord and saviour.Our faith in Jesus Christ is based on substantial evidence that he is the messiah prophesied long ago before he was born as well as all the above.We drive over bridges because we have faith in the reliability of them based on observance and based on the fact that they have been proven to be reliable.

There is not a person alive today who haas observed any world event that occured more then 126 years ago. So everything that occured before that point must be taken as Faith.Peoples ability to Lie... peoples ability to write fiction and peoples ability to be wrong all makes religious propoganda unproovable.Even if we find the Ark of the Covenenent it doesnt mean that God gave the world the stone tablets of the ten commandements.Even if we find the skeletal remains of Jesus it does not mean that he was the son of God.God never wanted to be found, God never wanted people to fight his corner as being the creator of the world... He just gave people the chance to have Faith in him. He gave noone the ability to teach others Faith... even Jesus failed to make people who did not already have Faith learn Faith... the person who he held closest denied he knew him 3 times for fear of death. You have Faith or you do not.And how many people today actually witnessed the resurection of Jesus? None so they hold there faith in a book! not the observation of resurection

It keeps more world order then making people believe once they are dead they will not continues to live.Making people fear being judged after death rather then death itself has help keep billions civalised and but a few fanatical bombers.

(Faith was never meant to be proven... That’s what Faith is... its believing in something without proof of its existence.)Belief in something that can not be proved sounds like a very stupid thing to do, you would compliment me if I was to believe in any one of the rainbow of imaginary Gods that have existed, however if I believed in an invisible flying tea cup that told me that I should worship it and spread the 'teacup gospel' I would be locked up and you would call me a psycho! To blindly be led will destroy you, you are ignorant to the truth, God can not be seen because he is simply not their!(If your looking for Faith you don’t have any and you never will!)Why? Who told you that was the truth? If you are going to state something like that then you should back it up; people fall for new religions every day! Just look at those Geranga's and JW's, they are recruiting hundreds all year round so there are obviously a lot of people searching for faith and finding it. Your statement is therefor trash.(You can however give people hope)Hope is a sickness, as a strong individual each human being must search to know, not hope. Hope is for the weak!(if you want and you can also help keep world order by helping religions around the world use propaganda to teach people to be moral and not be scared to die...)I am seriously worried about your mental state, have you ever heard that one mans terrorist is anthers freedom fighter? Are you stating that we should all follow intangible social and religious laws just because society tells us we should?! By sustaining a 'World Order' you are doing nothing but making sure that everyone ends up identical, irradiating individuality and promoting a herd that can be easily controlled and manipulated to the governments whim. You also think its a good thing to spread religious propaganda (LIES) to maintain 'morality', well, just what is this 'morality' that you speak of? Which moral laws should we follow, yours or mine? There is no definite moral code!!! There is no right or wrong, good or evil, they are all LIES. Morals are subjective to each and every one of us, no one person (or 'god') has the ability or right to impose them on us! Do you want us all to marry as virgins, never drink under the age of 21, go to church every Sunday, starve ourselves of all human emotion (such as pride, envy, hatred, lust, selfishness, gluttony etc), make homosexuality illegal, and all the other stunting and restricting laws and codes religion forces down our throats!?
Are you scared to die, I sure as hell am! Christianity is just one huge death cult, they don’t fear death, because they think they are going to heaven! RUBBISH!!! Heaven and Hell are stories made to scare people into believing all the churches crap, 'IF YOU DONT WORSHIP CHRIST YOU WILL ROAST IN HELL FOR ETERNITY!!!' And the gullible fools buy it! They use these stories as tools to manipulate you, your thoughts, and your lives, discard them because they hinder your growth as a REAL human being. Be afraid to die because life is the great indulgence and death the great abstinence, once you are dead that is it, there isn’t even any black because there is no lack of light for your brain to understand!!!(these are all noble reasons to preach things you cannot prove.)OK, I'll start my 'noble' invisible flying tea cup religion and see how long it takes for a religious person to say I’m psycho, mad, insane or stupid, but the thing is....my religion will have as much grounding and evidence as yours does. Religion is a lie and only the weak and foolish believe in lies.

If that's so, wouldn't you expect to see prisons composed of mostly atheists?Well, the exact opposite is true - atheists are underrepresented in prisons. That is, the percentage of prisoners who are atheists is much less than the percentage of regular Americans who are atheists.[This message has been edited by crashfrog, 03-13-2004]

Hi, A-D, and welcome! If your teacup will still let me drink coffee, I might join. Otherwise, I won't try to get you put in an asylum, but I'll call you a foul heretic.....

(There is no definite moral code!!! There is no right or wrong)You have just stated that child molesters, rapists and people who beat the crap out of young defenceless children may not be doing the wrong thing and dont have to answer for there actions. You have just released every prisoner in the world and bought the world to complete chaos. *claps* well done mate! (Why? Who told you that was the truth?)Who told you the sky was blue... and who told the person who told you and who told the person who told him.You dont need to be told something for it to be real!(Just look at those Geranga's and JW's, they are recruiting hundreds all year round so there are obviously a lot of people searching for faith and finding it. Your statement is therefor trash.)Faith is not a belief in something that somebody else tells you... it is a belief in something that you already know to be true without being told... religious teachers can never teach faith but they can maintain world order. Nobody would believe your flying tea cup waffle because they had no faith in it before yout told them....the same goes for religions... i dont believe in a lot religions say but i relate to some of the moral codes they bring up because i already had faith in such codes.(By sustaining a 'World Order' you are doing nothing but making sure that everyone ends up identical, irradiating individuality)only on some issues... wouldnt it be nice if noone raped women or noone beat a babies head in with a spade.... your an idiot if u dont want to take people rights away to do these things... and your more of an idiot to believe they maybe morally right...You said your scared of dying, well be thankful the world has religion and order to stop people killing each other every day in a chaotic world!!!!!Yours is the only statement that is complete trash!!!!

Yes, it's true: there is no absolute moral code.And, yes, it's wrong to hurt others.Once you figure out this nice little koan you will be another step closer to enlightenment.

What a non-comment!

Do you want to have a discussion on this, or any issue, or do you just want to post witty little one-liners?Maybe my point wasn't clear. Let me be more explicit.I made two comments:(1) There is no absolute morality.(2) It is wrong for someone to hurt others.Forgive me if I am reading too much into your post, but you seem to feel that there is a contradiction between these two statements. Please explain what the contradiction is.

there is a contridiction. you say that it is wrong to hurt people... so as a result you are saying that hurting people is part of an absolute moral code.Now even if the only thing on that moral code is that bashing a babies skull in with a spade is wrong...You cannot say somthing is wrong without by default saying their is an absolute morality.

I am a vegetarian, and I am a vegetarian for ethical reasons. I claim that it is wrong to kill animals for food. Is this also part of the absolute moral code? If there is an absolute moral code, then how do we demonstrate it's existence? How do we determine what is in it?

A man decides to beat a childs head in with a spade.... IF WE CANNOT DECIDE THAT THIS IS WRONG THAT MAN CAN WALK FREE!!!We decide what is in the moral code by concepts such a human and equal rights... Just because a lunatic decides it is morally correct to kill children does not mean that he shud be allowed to be free to commit such actions.