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Author Topic:   What Do You Believe?
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 1 of 26 (694329)
03-23-2013 11:33 PM


From time to time I wish the forum Profiles required us all to define our belief systems more clearly. There are people who call themselves Christians, for instance, who have different beliefs from my own, sometimes within what I would accept as Christianity, sometimes not. And there seem to be many shades of difference beyond that, shades of religious belief, from Deism and Unitarianism to a vague sort of Theism and beyond, of agnosticism, of atheism and whatnot. There are people who take the Bible seriously but don't regard it as inerrant and specifically object to certain parts of it.
So I thought I'd start a thread to ask everyone to define what they believe. It would be nice to have a clearcut list of relevant points but I haven't come up with one. I suppose we could always come back to our defining post and add information as we go.
I'd like to keep each statement of belief as brief as possible.
I'll just define myself:
I consider myself to be an orthodox Protestant Christian inspired mostly by the Protestant Reformation, believing in Christ Jesus as the Messiah promised from the beginning of the Creation to die for my sins and save me from eternal damnation.
I consider the Bible to be the inerrant word of God, and the sole authority in all things having to do with God and the Christian life.
I'm also a Young Earth Creationist, basing my belief in a 6000 year old Earth on the years that can be added up among the ages of the Patriarchs of the pre-Flood world, from Adam to Noah, in Genesis 5.
I also believe in the reality of a usually-invisible spirit world, both angels who serve God, and fallen angels or demons headed by a fallen archangel originally called Lucifer, now called Satan, the enemy of God and all humanity but especially God's people, as revealed in the Bible.
I'll add to this as issues come up and I hope others will join in to describe their own beliefs.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

He who surrenders the first page of his Bible surrenders all. --John William Burgon, Inspiration and Interpretation, Sermon II.
2Cr 10:4-5 (For the weapons of our warfare [are] not carnal, but mighty through God to the pulling down of strong holds Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God...

Replies to this message:
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Dogmafood
Member (Idle past 348 days)
Posts: 1815
From: Ontario Canada
Joined: 08-04-2010


(2)
Message 2 of 26 (694337)
03-24-2013 2:34 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by Faith
03-23-2013 11:33 PM


Stuff I believe
I believe that;
... if two systems are each in thermal equilibrium with a third system, they are also in thermal equilibrium with each other.
... the change in the internal energy of a closed system is equal to the amount of heat supplied to the system, minus the amount of work done by the system on its surroundings.
... the entropy of an isolated system never decreases, because isolated systems spontaneously evolve towards thermodynamic equilibriumthe state of maximum entropy.
... the entropy of a perfect crystal at absolute zero is exactly equal to zero.
... people should be as free as possible.
... water freezes at 32F.
... the earth is about 4.5 billion yrs old.
... all people should begin their lives with equal rights.
... we should treat others as we would be treated.
... homosexuals are not nearly as dangerous as you think they are.
... if we spent all of our collective military budgets on food and schools that there wouldn't be anything left to fight about.
... we have to stop breeding like flies.
... Neil Young plays a mean guitar.
... the rules of logic should be taught more thoroughly.
... the guy who shot John Lennon was a fucking asshole.
... tradition is no substitute for reason.
I could go on.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Faith, posted 03-23-2013 11:33 PM Faith has not replied

  
GrimSqueaker
Member (Idle past 3688 days)
Posts: 137
From: Ireland
Joined: 03-15-2013


Message 3 of 26 (694346)
03-24-2013 4:50 AM


I know we already discussed what I used to believe Faith - but I dig this topic, great idea, so;
-I do not believe anything
-I have hope, reasonable expectations, trust and desires - but belief is accepting something without evidence and I refuse to do that anymore
-the hand is quicker than the eye
-all life is sacred, if indeed anything is
-freedom is the right of all sentient beings
-manners don't cost anything
-one should take the time to stop and smell the roses
-the role of education is paramount to a healthy society
-oh and most importantly sex, drugs and rock'n'roll!!!!
Edited by GrimSqueaker, : No reason given.

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9489
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.9


Message 4 of 26 (694354)
03-24-2013 7:23 AM


I believe that in exactly the same way as the search for someone to blame will always be successful, so will the search for meaning. And it will have the same negative outcome.
Edited by Tangle, : No reason given.

Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android

  
Larni
Member (Idle past 164 days)
Posts: 4000
From: Liverpool
Joined: 09-16-2005


(1)
Message 5 of 26 (694355)
03-24-2013 7:46 AM


I beleive in a great many things but appropos to this thread: I'm not superstitious and so do not beleive in the supernatural.
So no gods or devils or spirits. The universe is slightly under 14 billion years old but like everything, new information may change that value.

The above ontological example models the zero premise to BB theory. It does so by applying the relative uniformity assumption that the alleged zero event eventually ontologically progressed from the compressed alleged sub-microscopic chaos to bloom/expand into all of the present observable order, more than it models the Biblical record evidence for the existence of Jehovah, the maximal Biblical god designer.
-Attributed to Buzsaw Message 53
The explain to them any scientific investigation that explains the existence of things qualifies as science and as an explanation
-Attributed to Dawn Bertot Message 286
Does a query (thats a question Stile) that uses this physical reality, to look for an answer to its existence and properties become theoretical, considering its deductive conclusions are based against objective verifiable realities.
-Attributed to Dawn Bertot Message 134

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22392
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 5.2


(1)
Message 6 of 26 (694357)
03-24-2013 8:19 AM


I believe there is always more than we already know. But while mystery therefore surrounds even the simplest things, real world observation and experiment is the still best pathway to knowledge and understanding.
--Percy

  
onifre
Member (Idle past 2951 days)
Posts: 4854
From: Dark Side of the Moon
Joined: 02-20-2008


(3)
Message 7 of 26 (694380)
03-24-2013 12:39 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Faith
03-23-2013 11:33 PM


Ignostic
I was born into a Catholic family, but by age 8 or 9 I had doubts that what I was being told about God, the Bible and the history of our existence from the PoV of Christianity was unevidenced and in direct conflict with what we were learning in school - science, geology, etc...
So by 10 years old I considered myself agnostic and stayed that way until high school where I just decided to call myself an atheist because I was tired of having to explain my agnoticism.
I joined EvC in '08 and through much debating and discussions here I now consider the question of "Is there a God" to be as vague as the many descriptions of God that one can come up with. With the help of CatholicScientist I now consider myself an Ignostic - which I had never heard that word before until CS showed me the definition.
Basically:
quote:
Ignosticism or igtheism is the theological position that every other theological position (including agnosticism and atheism) assumes too much about the concept of God and many other theological concepts.
It can be defined as encompassing two related views about the existence of God:
1. The view that a coherent definition of God must be presented before the question of the existence of God can be meaningfully discussed. Furthermore, if that definition is unfalsifiable, the ignostic takes the theological noncognitivist position that the question of the existence of God (per that definition) is meaningless. In this case, the concept of God is not considered meaningless; the term "God" is considered meaningless.
2. The second view is synonymous with theological noncognitivism, and skips the step of first asking "What is meant by 'God'?" before proclaiming the original question "Does God exist?" as meaningless.
It's actually been interesting, because most people I explain ignosticism to seem to relate much more to it than true atheism or agnosticism.
- Oni
Edited by onifre, : spelling was horrendous

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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CoolBeans
Member (Idle past 3614 days)
Posts: 196
From: Honduras
Joined: 02-11-2013


Message 8 of 26 (694453)
03-24-2013 11:08 PM


I dont believe inn a god but I wouldnt want to fall in having bias that bllinds me to evidence so if you have evidence, bring it.
But more importantly Arrested Development is back

  
dronestar
Member
Posts: 1407
From: usa
Joined: 11-19-2008


(1)
Message 9 of 26 (694535)
03-25-2013 11:55 AM


Not sure . . .
Not sure how my faith would be defined, let me try to explain . . .
I have a PERSONAL relationship with the Easter Bunny.
If you belong to a faith, getting to know the Easter Bunny through a personal relationship with him is THE most rewarding thing one can do. The Easter Bunny offers his friendship freely to all, but many people reject this because they think it means "religion". I feel sorry for those people. Having a personal relationship with the Easter Bunny is simple, just as any friendship should be. But once you have a personal relationship with Him, then you and your friends can know enough to prove the Easter Bunny is real for yourself and then bless the whole world with the Easter Bunny's Love.
quote:
For the Easter Bunny so loved the world that he gave his one and only son Bugs, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish but have eternal life AND lifelong chocolate" (Roger Rabbit 3:16)
Someday when I get this many years [holding up three fingers], I will get a tricycle for my birthday.

  
roxrkool
Member (Idle past 989 days)
Posts: 1497
From: Nevada
Joined: 03-23-2003


(2)
Message 10 of 26 (694537)
03-25-2013 12:08 PM


what I believe
I am an Atheist.
I believe that the supernatural is nonexistent. There is no god, no devil, no ghosts, no spirits. I believe that everything we see and experience, ultimately will have a rational, scientifically-valid explanation.
I do not believe in an afterlife and have little patience for Creationists, mystics, religious fanatics, superstition, and pseudoscience.
I don't hate religion or its followers, but I have no use for it personally and never have, even as a child.
At one point, many years ago when I was still young and stupid, I called myself "spiritual." But I'm not. I don't even know what that means. I was just afraid to call myself an Atheist.

Replies to this message:
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dronestar
Member
Posts: 1407
From: usa
Joined: 11-19-2008


(3)
Message 11 of 26 (694540)
03-25-2013 12:25 PM
Reply to: Message 10 by roxrkool
03-25-2013 12:08 PM


Re: what I believe
roxrkool writes:
I am an Atheist.
How sad for you. You obviously don't have the maturity or firm grasp on reality to have a PERSONAL relationship with a mythical and invisible being.
I'll pray for you.

This message is a reply to:
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ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


(1)
Message 12 of 26 (694541)
03-25-2013 12:25 PM


I believe that belief is a second-rate form of "knowledge". Belief gets in the way of really "knowing" things objectively. It is better to be fairly sure about something than to believe it.
I try to believe as little as possible.

  
ooh-child
Member (Idle past 344 days)
Posts: 242
Joined: 04-10-2009


(3)
Message 13 of 26 (694542)
03-25-2013 12:36 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Faith
03-23-2013 11:33 PM


Growing up, I was exposed to many different flavors of religion, but not raised as anything specific other than an occasional visit to the local Episcopal church.
Later, I drifted down the non-christian path, passed the various new-age stuff rather quickly & finally found the agnostic/atheistic cul-de-sac where I know live.
In school I was always turned on the most by math & science classes, and I find it puzzling why so many faithful are convinced the bible is 'right' when it comes to matters of geology, biodiversity, & the like. I could never go through my one life ignoring, or even actively arguing against, the millions of man-hours put into research & understanding how the world works.
My mother-in-law is a lot like Faith in her beliefs & worship of 'God'. But she would never have the amount of outrageous pride it takes to confront anyone in their particular area of scientific study, and I love her to pieces for that. She has shown me that it is possible to be grounded in one's protestant faith & not be a douche about it.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Faith, posted 03-23-2013 11:33 PM Faith has not replied

  
Jazzns
Member (Idle past 3911 days)
Posts: 2657
From: A Better America
Joined: 07-23-2004


(2)
Message 14 of 26 (694622)
03-26-2013 10:22 AM
Reply to: Message 7 by onifre
03-24-2013 12:39 PM


Re: Ignostic
Nice! I like that idea.
I used to be a Christian and when I dropped that I never felt like I became an atheist. I just look around at all the other stuff and said, "I don't care."
I will die long before I have exhausted my ability to learn all the real knowledge that humanity has uncovered over the generations. So its not so much that I am an atheist as I am a there-are-too-many-real-things-to-worry-about-imaginary-things-ist
I do still have a morbid facination with my former religion, but by doing so I have learned more about our world and our history then I ever TRIED to learn as a believer.

If we long for our planet to be important, there is something we can do about it. We make our world significant by the courage of our questions and by the depth of our answers. --Carl Sagan

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Stile
Member
Posts: 4295
From: Ontario, Canada
Joined: 12-02-2004


(1)
Message 15 of 26 (694650)
03-26-2013 12:49 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Faith
03-23-2013 11:33 PM


I believe in a thing called Love
I don't generally think it matters what others believe. I don't see a value in knowing if someone is a Christian, Buddhist, Old Olympian, Atheist or anything at all. What matters is what they can show to be true, and what they can enlighten us all with.
Such truth and knowledge can come from anyone, in any situation, believing in any theology (or none at all). Also, it's incredibly difficult to ascertain if someone's religious ideas are affecting their thoughts on any specific matter unless you ask them directly.
But, some folks may find value in getting an idea of someone's beliefs in order to gleam some sort of context before talking with the individual directly, so here's mine:
I believe in ideals.
Love.
Justice.
Honour.
Honesty.
Good.
Righteousness.
...
You know... all the pansy-words.
Ideals exist at some value, any child can see that. Can they exist in the "perfect" value? I don't care. Can we strive for the perfect value, and does such an aim make us better? I certainly believe that to be true. I have no proof ("better" is a very slippery term). But I do have evidence pointing in that direction.
Ideals exist whether they come from God, or humans.
Even if they come from God, the concept of a perfect ideal to strive for doesn't require His approval or disdain.
I don't believe in any specific facts of the universe such as it's age or whether or not this exists or that happened. Ideals supersede such trivialities for where my personal convictions are concerned.
I do trust facts, whenever they can be shown to be true. But I wouldn't say I believe in them. I certainly don't "believe" that I require air to breathe. I know that I require air to breathe because it can be shown to be true.
Gods, ghosts, demons, vampires, magic, imagination...
All interesting things.
Ideals exist regardless of the impact on reality of these interesting things (whatever it may or may not be).
Perfect ideals provide a purpose for me regardless of anyone else's thoughts on the matter, natural or supernatural.
Ideals are limited only by our imagination. Which makes them more powerful than (or at least as powerful as) any force from any source, existing or not, supernatural or not, written in a book or not.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Faith, posted 03-23-2013 11:33 PM Faith has not replied

  
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