Rahvin and I were discussing God the singularity and the Big Bang in another thread, He thought we were getting too far off topic and suggested I start a thread where we could discuss it.
In http://
EvC Forum: Creator of God, Big Bang -->
EvC Forum: Creator of God, Big Bang to randman Rahvin said:
Rahvin writes:
Again, this is special pleading. The Universe could not possibly have always existed, but your god can? Even the Big Bang does not suggest that there was a point "before" the Universe existed - only that it existed as the Singularity at the beginning of the expansion we now see.
In http://
EvC Forum: Creator of God, Big Bang -->
EvC Forum: Creator of God, Big Bang I comented on Rahvin's statement:
ICANT writes:
You are saying I must believe the singularity came from an absence of anything and you don't call that special pleading?
In http://
EvC Forum: Creator of God, Big Bang -->
EvC Forum: Creator of God, Big Bang Rahvin responded:
Rahvin writes:
I'm not saying that the Singularity came from anything at all. In fact, Im saying quite the opposite. We know that the Singularity existed, and that asking about "before" the Singularity is a nonsense question. We also know that matter and energy can neither be created nor destroyed - there is no special pleading, because we know that the Universe exists. There is no evidence of god, and thus he is an extraneous entity.
In http://
EvC Forum: Creator of God, Big Bang -->
EvC Forum: Creator of God, Big Bang I responded:
Rahvin writes:
We know that the Singularity existed,
ICANT writes:
Could you site your references for this statement.
In http://
EvC Forum: Creator of God, Big Bang -->
EvC Forum: Creator of God, Big Bang I was told:
Rahvin writes:
Try every paper ever written concerning the Big Bang. The Singularity is simply the single point from which the Universe expanded at the Big Bang. We know it existed by extrapolating the expansion of the Universe backwards.
The Singularity does not, however, imply that the Universe did not exist at some point, as you seem to believe. Matter and energy can neither be created nor destroyed - the Singularity is simply the state of the Universe as it began expanding. Creationists are the ones who claim the Universe did not exist at some point.
I have read quite a few but I was wanting one that said "We know that the Singularity existed," as I had never seen one.
In http://
EvC Forum: Creator of God, Big Bang -->
EvC Forum: Creator of God, Big Bang to Rahvin :
qs=RahvinThe Singularity does not, however, imply that the Universe did not exist at some point,
ICANT writes:
Make up your mind.
The big bang theory supposedly proved the universe had a beginning.
Now you are saying it never had a beginning.
Rahvin writes:
the Singularity is simply the state of the Universe as it began expanding.
ICANT writes:
If there was no space.
If there was no time.
If there was no energy.
If there was no matter.
That sounds like an absence of anything to me.
Therefore there was no singularity.
At the instant of the Big Bang, the universe was infinitely dense and unimaginably hot. Cosmologists believe that all forms of matter and energy, as well as space and time itself, were formed at this instant. Since "before" is a temporal concept, one cannot ask what came before the Big Bang and therefore "caused" it, at least not within the context of any known physics.
In this topic I would like to discuss which is the best explanation for the origin of the universe. God or the Singularity including the Big Bang.
I will reference the Bible.
I will reference scientific papers.
"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."
™ Version 4.2