Register | Sign In


Understanding through Discussion


EvC Forum active members: 65 (9162 total)
6 online now:
Newest Member: popoi
Post Volume: Total: 915,815 Year: 3,072/9,624 Month: 917/1,588 Week: 100/223 Day: 11/17 Hour: 0/7


Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
Author Topic:   Are we really related to all living things?(Discluding Plants)
Whaitere
Junior Member (Idle past 2625 days)
Posts: 9
From: San Diego, CA
Joined: 01-13-2002


Message 1 of 15 (2030)
01-13-2002 9:56 PM


I recently watched a show on Evolution, and I heard something that rather shocked me. They said that we have the same DNA patterns as all living things.
(Discluding Plant Life). I have no experience in that area and am seeking someone to Shed light on the topic.

Replies to this message:
 Message 2 by nator, posted 01-13-2002 10:51 PM Whaitere has not replied
 Message 3 by mark24, posted 01-14-2002 3:55 AM Whaitere has not replied
 Message 6 by keenanvin, posted 01-14-2002 11:39 AM Whaitere has not replied

nator
Member (Idle past 2169 days)
Posts: 12961
From: Ann Arbor
Joined: 12-09-2001


Message 2 of 15 (2034)
01-13-2002 10:51 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Whaitere
01-13-2002 9:56 PM


Can you be more specific about what you mean by "DNA patterns"?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Whaitere, posted 01-13-2002 9:56 PM Whaitere has not replied

mark24
Member (Idle past 5195 days)
Posts: 3857
From: UK
Joined: 12-01-2001


Message 3 of 15 (2037)
01-14-2002 3:55 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by Whaitere
01-13-2002 9:56 PM


We have the same as plants, too.
------------------
Occam's razor is not for shaving with.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Whaitere, posted 01-13-2002 9:56 PM Whaitere has not replied

John Paul
Inactive Member


Message 4 of 15 (2057)
01-14-2002 10:25 AM


The TalkingPrimate, all living organisms (with the exceptions of viruses) are DNA based. Creationists use this as an inference for a Common Creator and evolutionists infer common descent.
------------------
John Paul

Replies to this message:
 Message 5 by gene90, posted 01-14-2002 11:29 AM John Paul has not replied

gene90
Member (Idle past 3822 days)
Posts: 1610
Joined: 12-25-2000


Message 5 of 15 (2068)
01-14-2002 11:29 AM
Reply to: Message 4 by John Paul
01-14-2002 10:25 AM


So, John Paul, if God likes DNA more than RNA, why did He endow some nice little virii (like HIV) with RNA?
Possible evolutionist answers: (1) RNA and DNA work equally well for a virus (2) Virii are polyphyletic.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4 by John Paul, posted 01-14-2002 10:25 AM John Paul has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 7 by Whaitere, posted 01-14-2002 4:07 PM gene90 has replied
 Message 11 by TrueCreation, posted 01-19-2002 2:55 AM gene90 has not replied

keenanvin
Inactive Member


Message 6 of 15 (2070)
01-14-2002 11:39 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by Whaitere
01-13-2002 9:56 PM


Firstly, I believe the proper form of saying something is 'not within the limits' is by the word "excluding"; Ex is Latin, meaning 'without'.
Secondly, We share DNA patters with plants as well. Not as high of a percent, but the relationship is still there. According to the single cell theory: A single self-replicating strand of RNA was the basis of life. Everything came from that one strand of RNA, as the replication allowed copies to be made, a more complex cell developed, which in turn clustered together and eventually formed specialized tasks. That, in turn, lead to complex organisms being formed, some groups of cells which photosynthesized food instead of actively gathering it, became the first "green" (or plantlike, photosynthesizing) bacteria, which in turn lead to plants of all sorts. This first cell could have come around by abiogenesis. When the earth cooled after being a spinning, spiraling ball of molten rock and free-floating chemicals, and when the water in the oceans was still in it's young age, some acids were still being mixed up at the bottom of the ocean near the heat vents. Those heat vents could have produced the heat to mix the acids (amino) that would have been required to form RNA strands that were self-replicating. Albeit, the chances were pretty high, (3.044x10^40, according to "Common misconceptions about Abiogenesis, and I think a similar article can be found at talkorigins) one must remember that there are literally millions of vents in the ocean floor. With that in mind, it seems very likely self-replicating RNA strands actually formed on their own, without the help of a creator. (minimum length needed to form self-replicating strands is 28 letters)
I hope this has helped.
-Kv
[Edited to include abiogenisis]
[This message has been edited by keenanvin, 01-14-2002]

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Whaitere, posted 01-13-2002 9:56 PM Whaitere has not replied

Whaitere
Junior Member (Idle past 2625 days)
Posts: 9
From: San Diego, CA
Joined: 01-13-2002


Message 7 of 15 (2094)
01-14-2002 4:07 PM
Reply to: Message 5 by gene90
01-14-2002 11:29 AM


Well, Gene, now your getting into a more religous conversation. I say this because, many people do not believe there is a God. ( I being one of them ). But also it seems that yes, if he exists he did endow a few little problems in the RNA, but it is still a more religous subject.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 5 by gene90, posted 01-14-2002 11:29 AM gene90 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 8 by gene90, posted 01-14-2002 7:23 PM Whaitere has replied
 Message 12 by TrueCreation, posted 01-19-2002 2:57 AM Whaitere has not replied

gene90
Member (Idle past 3822 days)
Posts: 1610
Joined: 12-25-2000


Message 8 of 15 (2110)
01-14-2002 7:23 PM
Reply to: Message 7 by Whaitere
01-14-2002 4:07 PM


I also think what you might be asking about conserved DNA patterns is the fact that the triplet code of DNA and RNA is conserved acrossed most living things. For example, the basepair sequence CTT in DNA is going to code for the amino acid glutamic acid in most living things on Earth, including people.
[This message has been edited by gene90, 01-14-2002]

This message is a reply to:
 Message 7 by Whaitere, posted 01-14-2002 4:07 PM Whaitere has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 9 by Whaitere, posted 01-18-2002 8:32 AM gene90 has not replied

Whaitere
Junior Member (Idle past 2625 days)
Posts: 9
From: San Diego, CA
Joined: 01-13-2002


Message 9 of 15 (2376)
01-18-2002 8:32 AM
Reply to: Message 8 by gene90
01-14-2002 7:23 PM


Well, I merely needed someone to shed some light on the subject, I don't know an awful lot about the DNA sequences. But I thank everyone for shedding some light.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 8 by gene90, posted 01-14-2002 7:23 PM gene90 has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 10 by TactcalLoco, posted 01-18-2002 11:42 AM Whaitere has not replied

TactcalLoco
Inactive Member


Message 10 of 15 (2403)
01-18-2002 11:42 AM
Reply to: Message 9 by Whaitere
01-18-2002 8:32 AM


Hello all,
My frist post here.
You all did such a really good job of outlining the basic connections of all living things that I'll just also suggest the library has many good popular science books for the layman.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by Whaitere, posted 01-18-2002 8:32 AM Whaitere has not replied

TrueCreation
Inactive Member


Message 11 of 15 (2457)
01-19-2002 2:55 AM
Reply to: Message 5 by gene90
01-14-2002 11:29 AM


"Possible evolutionist answers: (1) RNA and DNA work equally well for a virus (2) Virii are polyphyletic. "
--Possible answer (3) God Created viruses so they would work like they are suppost to, to regulate and control his creation and give it that 'circle of life' per se. Diseases have a good cause or no unwanted effects where it is suppost to be, untill some really sick people started playing with those green monkeys...
--------------

This message is a reply to:
 Message 5 by gene90, posted 01-14-2002 11:29 AM gene90 has not replied

TrueCreation
Inactive Member


Message 12 of 15 (2458)
01-19-2002 2:57 AM
Reply to: Message 7 by Whaitere
01-14-2002 4:07 PM


"Well, Gene, now your getting into a more religous conversation. I say this because, many people do not believe there is a God. ( I being one of them ). But also it seems that yes, if he exists he did endow a few little problems in the RNA, but it is still a more religous subject."
--Problems? What kind of problems does RNA have, it does what its supposed to do.
-------------
[This message has been edited by TrueCreation, 01-19-2002]

This message is a reply to:
 Message 7 by Whaitere, posted 01-14-2002 4:07 PM Whaitere has not replied

Ammarice
Inactive Member


Message 14 of 15 (2535)
01-20-2002 5:05 PM


What's RNA??? Someone can 'shed some light' on this too, right?

Replies to this message:
 Message 15 by mark24, posted 01-20-2002 6:23 PM Ammarice has not replied

mark24
Member (Idle past 5195 days)
Posts: 3857
From: UK
Joined: 12-01-2001


Message 15 of 15 (2539)
01-20-2002 6:23 PM
Reply to: Message 14 by Ammarice
01-20-2002 5:05 PM


quote:
Originally posted by Ammarice:
What's RNA??? Someone can 'shed some light' on this too, right?
RNA stands for Ribosenucleic acic (or I've seen it as Ribonucleic acid). Its very similar stuff to DNA, it uses four bases, like DNAs A,T,C,G (Adenine, Thymine, Cytosine, & Guamine). In RNA, the thymine is replaced with uracil.
Its used in ALL cells with DNA, short strands of RNA form alongside the "unzipped" DNA. These matched strands then move out into the cytoplasm where they are used to make proteins. It's a bit more complex than this, but you get the idea. Every protein in your body was manufactured in this way, with RNA acting as messenger between DNA & the cell.
The interesting thing about RNA, is its a self replicating molecule in its own right, & is thought to have been a prehistoric precursor of DNA. For DNA to replicate itself, a battery of enzymes is required. But RNA can catalyse reactions to itself. This discovery won the researchers, Cech & Altman the 1989 nobel prize in chemistry.
That's not to say RNA was the original self replicating molecule, just a potential "prototype".
I know, clear as muck!
Mark
------------------
Occam's razor is not for shaving with.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 14 by Ammarice, posted 01-20-2002 5:05 PM Ammarice has not replied

Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2023 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.2
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2024