Proposed New Topic 100529
Subject: Professional Debate: Scientific Evidence for/against Evolution Any Takers?
A recent topic in the Free For All forum was introduced by Zenmonkey. The thread
Ignorant, stupid or insane? (Or maybe wicked?) argued for various clinical or moral judgments of the inferred personal flaws inherent in those who do not believe that evolution is factual. Although Zenmonkey didn’t specify how the term evolution is used in his thread, it is assumed within the context to mean neo-Darwinism or the belief that all organisms are descended from a common ancestor; or perhaps more technically, change in allele frequency that results in newly functioning organs, features, or capabilities (e.g. brain, heart, kidney, liver, feathers, sonar, intercontinental navigation) resulting (at least in part) in progressively more advanced types of organisms within a population over time.
In the opening post of Zenmonkey's thread, he quotes Dawkins:
Richard Dawkins writes:
It is absolutely safe to say that, if you meet somebody who claims not to believe in evolution, that person is ignorant, stupid or insane (or wicked, but I'd rather not consider that).
Then:
Zenmonkey writes:
If we follow Dr Dawkins's schema above, it appears that Dr Adequate is arguing for ignorant and/or stupid, while I appear to be arguing for the unsavory choice of wicked. Insane is up for grabs.
I would like to see this particular line of thought developed more fully and substantiated in a professional manner against neo-Darwinian deniers in a formal written debate. The written format allows for carefully crafted arguments and rebuttals along with appropriate illustrations.
The proposal for this thread is to establish who among the intelligent and educated EVC proponents of universal common descent (neo-Darwinism) would represent evolution in a formal written debate exclusively regarding the scientific evidence. The debate would occur outside the confines of EVC Forum and would be publishable.
Knowledgeable individuals who have expressed #1 and/or #2 below are the ideal folks to engage the debate.
#1) Neo-Darwinism is unequivocally true and scientifically verified fact - essentially proven by the evidence for all practical purposesand/or
#2) People who do not believe neo-Darwinism (to be a valid mechanism for universal common descent) are ignorant, stupid, deluded, irrational, insane, or wicked
A single individual or an entire team of EVC folks could participate and collaborate in written responses on behalf of evolution - but at least one team member should be qualified with a Ph. D. in a technical field (to offer bona-fide credibility for potential publishers). The debate would be moderated by a mutually agreed upon moderator and would include only presentation, analysis, and critique of physical concepts and evidence — no philosophy or religion. Strictly excluding philosophy and religion should qualify this debate for use in any educational setting.
I believe there would be much interest in this. It could certainly create a lot of exposure for EVC Forum and, if successfully published, could help educate the majority of Americans who (according to polls) do not believe in neo-Darwinian evolution. Perhaps even Rachel Maddow would feature the publication on her MSNBC show (Geek Week)! I know this is getting way ahead of the game but perhaps any potential share of proceeds could go to EVC Forum or the charity of Percy's choice.
This thread will generate the list of individuals among the folks at EVC Forum who have sincerely expressed #1 OR #2 above, and who would be willing to commit to a debate of this nature - apart from EVC Forum. For those not willing to commit, I'm also interested in each person’s reason for declining. Therefore, I request a reply from each of the individuals who participated in Zenmonkey’s thread referenced above. In addition, any others with either of these sincerely stated beliefs are encouraged to respond and commit.
So this thread topic is narrowly defined. The question is:
Are you willing to engage in a professionally moderated publishable debate on behalf of evolution?
After a qualified individual or team is committed to represent evolution, we can hopefully locate and secure a commitment from a worthy debate opponent (individual or team) and begin the process of defining the format and identifying a moderator. Assuming the quality is high, potential publishers would then be sought.
If this topic is promoted by an EVC moderator, I respectfully request that respondents to this thread maintain the narrow focus (basically "in" or "out" and if "out" then why). New threads could be started for analysis and commentary on this proposal. For example, concerns about finding intelligent opponents or threats to rip new ass holes in idiots may be more appropriate in the "Free For All" forum (according to the EVC Guidelines).
I will not be involved in the debate for EVC as I don’t ascribe to #1 or #2 above. However, I'd be highly interested in the results. I'm a busy guy and occasonal lurker but will be checking in as often as possible to see where the commitments stand. Suggestions for a worthy opponent (if any) are welcome.
This could take weeks, months, or more - but (assuming this topic is promoted) we'll take it one step at a time.
I’ll end this similar to one of Zenmonkey’s posts:
Any Takers?
Gotta Love EVC Forum — What a Resource!
Thanks — and Question Everything! Respectfully,
Eye-Squared-R
™ Version 4.2