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Author Topic:   Soul
PurplyBear
Junior Member (Idle past 4908 days)
Posts: 20
From: Indianapolis, Indiana
Joined: 02-17-2008


Message 1 of 46 (466324)
05-14-2008 1:43 PM


What is my soul made of?
Prior to entering my body where does my soul live?
At what time does a soul enter my body?
Why is the soul not x-rayable (is that a word) or show up on a MRI?
When in my body where is my soul?
How much does a soul weigh?
------
Upon exiting the body:
I must eat food to keep living. What 'powers' a soul?
My brain allows me to hold memories. What allows a soul to remember?
My legs allow me to move around. What allows a soul to move around?
I have eyes to see. How does my soul see?
What point does a soul exit my body?
Do souls goto the bathroom?
Do souls have human desire?
Where do souls go? Isn't it crowded?
-------

How do you know?
-------

My kid asked me these questions - she is 10. I told her they were great questions! However, I pointed out religion is childish, and she need not waste her time with childish things. I explained the soul is a made up story by irrational adults. Therefore since the soul does not exist her questions are meaningless (like questions about Santa I told her).

Possibly, I am mistaken. If anyone can help me with her questions I will take your answers back to her. I am open to meeting anyone in Indianapolis as well - you can explain this to my daughter. It is difficult for me to do so.....

Thanks,


People are not stupid, religion is.

Replies to this message:
 Message 3 by AZPaul3, posted 05-14-2008 3:13 PM PurplyBear has responded
 Message 4 by New Cat's Eye, posted 05-14-2008 5:30 PM PurplyBear has responded
 Message 10 by Coragyps, posted 05-14-2008 8:48 PM PurplyBear has not yet responded

  
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Message 2 of 46 (466330)
05-14-2008 1:52 PM


Thread moved here from the Proposed New Topics forum.

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 6204
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 6.2


Message 3 of 46 (466341)
05-14-2008 3:13 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by PurplyBear
05-14-2008 1:43 PM


Things might be helpful if someone could define what "soul" means.

Where, how, why does the concept of "soul" exist? Not the "soul" per se but the concept. Where did that come from?

Is it merely consciousness? Awareness of past and present self with expectation of the immediate future? How would "soul" differ from this and how could one tell?

The answers are likely to be the usual metaphysical, non-emperical, supernatural slop leading to the usual caustic discussions and, ultimately, accomplishing nothing.

But great fun anyway.

Edited by AZPaul3, : Attempted clarification ... failed.


This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member


Message 4 of 46 (466347)
05-14-2008 5:30 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by PurplyBear
05-14-2008 1:43 PM


since the soul does not exist

How do you know?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by PurplyBear, posted 05-14-2008 1:43 PM PurplyBear has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 5 by PurplyBear, posted 05-14-2008 6:52 PM New Cat's Eye has responded

  
PurplyBear
Junior Member (Idle past 4908 days)
Posts: 20
From: Indianapolis, Indiana
Joined: 02-17-2008


Message 5 of 46 (466357)
05-14-2008 6:52 PM
Reply to: Message 4 by New Cat's Eye
05-14-2008 5:30 PM


quote:
since the soul does not exist

Let's discuss it. Let's start with intelligent answers to my questions. They were taken from the mind of a 10 year old female. So, if you feel it necessary to change them up a little feel free.


People are not stupid, religion is.

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
 Message 7 by Perdition, posted 05-14-2008 6:57 PM PurplyBear has responded
 Message 14 by New Cat's Eye, posted 05-15-2008 9:53 AM PurplyBear has not yet responded

  
PurplyBear
Junior Member (Idle past 4908 days)
Posts: 20
From: Indianapolis, Indiana
Joined: 02-17-2008


Message 6 of 46 (466358)
05-14-2008 6:55 PM
Reply to: Message 3 by AZPaul3
05-14-2008 3:13 PM


quote:
Things might be helpful if someone could define what "soul" means.

I am not sure what the hell it is. It seems to be an invisible indestructible part of a human that spends forever in a happy place far far away(like in Shrek 2) with Jesus. I believe the bible suggests God breathed a soul into a man made from dirt.

Edited by PurplyBear, : deleted useless information


People are not stupid, religion is.

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Perdition
Member (Idle past 2350 days)
Posts: 1593
From: Wisconsin
Joined: 05-15-2003


Message 7 of 46 (466359)
05-14-2008 6:57 PM
Reply to: Message 5 by PurplyBear
05-14-2008 6:52 PM


Philosophically, I'd say there are two options:
1) Souls don't exist
2) Souls don't matter

If a soul is immaterial (not physical) you have to come up with a mechanism whereby the soul can affect a material object (ie. your body). Even were you to be able to do that, it should be possible to point to a process that is going along following material laws, and then changes course by no possible means. As far as I know, that has never been shown to happen.

If a soul, then, cannot affect the material body (or interract in any way at all), then it becomes irrelevant. It's entirely possible that we all walk around with invisible, massless goblins on our shoulder, but since they have no affect on us, does it make any sense to worry about them?


"Of course...we all create god in our own image" - Willard Decker, Star Trek: The Motion Picture

http://perditionsgate.bravepages.com


This message is a reply to:
 Message 5 by PurplyBear, posted 05-14-2008 6:52 PM PurplyBear has responded

Replies to this message:
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PurplyBear
Junior Member (Idle past 4908 days)
Posts: 20
From: Indianapolis, Indiana
Joined: 02-17-2008


Message 8 of 46 (466360)
05-14-2008 6:59 PM
Reply to: Message 7 by Perdition
05-14-2008 6:57 PM


See above. The soul does matter. It is the part of us the bible says, so I believe, that spends eternal happiness with jesus in heaven.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 7 by Perdition, posted 05-14-2008 6:57 PM Perdition has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 9 by Perdition, posted 05-14-2008 7:08 PM PurplyBear has responded

  
Perdition
Member (Idle past 2350 days)
Posts: 1593
From: Wisconsin
Joined: 05-15-2003


Message 9 of 46 (466361)
05-14-2008 7:08 PM
Reply to: Message 8 by PurplyBear
05-14-2008 6:59 PM


In your OP you said:

My kid asked me these questions - she is 10. I told her they were great questions! However, I pointed out religion is childish, and she need not waste her time with childish things. I explained the soul is a made up story by irrational adults. Therefore since the soul does not exist her questions are meaningless (like questions about Santa I told her).

Now you say:

See above. The soul does matter. It is the part of us the bible says, so I believe, that spends eternal happiness with jesus in heaven.

So I'm a bit confused. Either way, you're left with the 2 options I mentioned, unless you can come up with a way for a nonmaterial thing to interact with a material thing. And then, once you have a way, you need to show any evidence of that actually happening.

I'm not going to rule out the possibility of an immaterial entity residing within our body that can be called a soul, but if it can't interact with your body, it can't hold memories from your brain, and could therefore be written off as being part of "you" (meaning the person people would describe you as).


This message is a reply to:
 Message 8 by PurplyBear, posted 05-14-2008 6:59 PM PurplyBear has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 11 by PurplyBear, posted 05-14-2008 11:25 PM Perdition has responded
 Message 16 by New Cat's Eye, posted 05-15-2008 10:17 AM Perdition has responded

  
Coragyps
Member
Posts: 5553
From: Snyder, Texas, USA
Joined: 11-12-2002


Message 10 of 46 (466374)
05-14-2008 8:48 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by PurplyBear
05-14-2008 1:43 PM


I must eat food to keep living. What 'powers' a soul?

Neck bones, chitlins, collard greens, and sweet potato pie? :D

{I find the above quite amusing, and I probably find self-described (I believe) "old fart" Corygyps generally to often be quite amusing, but this little quip is off-theme for this topic. If anyone replies to this quip, it should be a side comment to a reply to the following material. As most always, no replies to this moderator message, unless you wish to risk a 24 hour (or possibly longer) suspension. - Adminnemooseus}

And we can add to your questions ones like do chimpanzees have souls? Do anencephalic babies? How about human gastrulae that have no nervous tissue yet, let alone brains?

Talking about something for which no evidence exists, like "souls," seems rather futile to me. Though I'll admit I bought into that stuff for many years.

Edited by Adminnemooseus, : Blue blocked text.


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PurplyBear
Junior Member (Idle past 4908 days)
Posts: 20
From: Indianapolis, Indiana
Joined: 02-17-2008


Message 11 of 46 (466401)
05-14-2008 11:25 PM
Reply to: Message 9 by Perdition
05-14-2008 7:08 PM


I am confused
I am confused too, Brother. So, souls are not real? Then why do Christians, and other religions insist they are? That sounds stupid - obviously the person who believes this crap is not stupid, I would never dare say that..... Just the belief in a soul is stupid if it ain't real.

Souls don't eat chicken - BTW, can't fool me.

I am still really confused.... Then when I die what part of me, do Christians believe, spends forever & ever with the holy of holy kings?


People are not stupid, religion is.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by Perdition, posted 05-14-2008 7:08 PM Perdition has responded

Replies to this message:
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Perdition
Member (Idle past 2350 days)
Posts: 1593
From: Wisconsin
Joined: 05-15-2003


Message 12 of 46 (466404)
05-14-2008 11:32 PM
Reply to: Message 11 by PurplyBear
05-14-2008 11:25 PM


Re: I am confused
Christians and Muslims and many other religions past and present believe in a soul. As to why, you'd have to ask them, but I think it comes down to a couple things. On one hand, people look at their rich internal lives (thoughts, emotions, fears, desires, morals, etc) and have a hard time believing those things are chemical/electrical effects in the brain. They hold up those things as proof that there is something immaterial.

I think another strong reasoning is the desire for there to be "something" after death. I admit, the fear of ceasing to exist is a strong one in me. And while its obvious that our physical bodies decay and stop working, if there could be a non-physical aspect that doesn't decay, that would be a huge relief.

I don't think it's that people are stupid, far from it. They just choose to believe what makes them feel better.


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Larni
Member
Posts: 4000
From: Liverpool
Joined: 09-16-2005


Message 13 of 46 (466469)
05-15-2008 6:52 AM
Reply to: Message 11 by PurplyBear
05-14-2008 11:25 PM


Re: I am confused
PurplyBear writes:

Then why do Christians, and other religions insist they are? That sounds stupid - obviously the person who believes this crap is not stupid, I would never dare say that.....

This seems like a question you have stuck in your head. People will beleive anything if they conclude it is true.

People will conclude things are true if they assess the evidence as evidence of truth.

This assessment is always biased (unless methods are put in place to marginalise or incorporate bias) by the emotional and cognitive baggage we all have rattling around our bonces's.

The best you can do to get rid of this bias is to do science.

Most people don't do this: they just jump to conclusions, wrap 'em up as being part of their self esteem and stick with it in spite of any contradicting evidence.

Some people still think the Earth is flat: stupid?

I should say so.


This message is a reply to:
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New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member


Message 14 of 46 (466487)
05-15-2008 9:53 AM
Reply to: Message 5 by PurplyBear
05-14-2008 6:52 PM


Let's start with intelligent answers to my questions.

The only intellegent answer to your questions is: "We don't know."

Anything else is pointless speculation.

Like your assertion that the soul doesn't exist...


This message is a reply to:
 Message 5 by PurplyBear, posted 05-14-2008 6:52 PM PurplyBear has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
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Larni
Member
Posts: 4000
From: Liverpool
Joined: 09-16-2005


Message 15 of 46 (466488)
05-15-2008 10:08 AM
Reply to: Message 14 by New Cat's Eye
05-15-2008 9:53 AM


I think it's fair to say there is no evidence that the soul exist, though.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 14 by New Cat's Eye, posted 05-15-2008 9:53 AM New Cat's Eye has responded

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