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Author Topic:   Abortion questions...?
macaroniandcheese 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3928 days)
Posts: 4258
Joined: 05-24-2004


Message 52 of 403 (332187)
07-16-2006 11:31 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by LudoRephaim
06-29-2006 12:51 PM


sorry been out of town (still am, gave in).
Nearly lost Brennakimi as a freind in it (we made up later
i don't remember this at all.
1. Is Partial birth abortion murder? I am asking this because some say that a fetus isn't human until after it is born. If the fetus/baby is born halfway, is it human or not??
i first want to clear a few things up.
quote:
The procedure is usually performed during the fifth month of gestation or later. The woman's cervix is dilated, and the fetus is partially removed from the womb, feet first. The surgeon inserts a sharp object into the back of the fetus' head, removes it, and inserts a vacuum tube through which the brains are extracted. The head of the fetus contracts at this point and allows the fetus to be more easily removed from the womb.
ok. the procedure is called a dilation and extraction. they are very rare.
quote:
This is a topic that is rarely discussed during public debates:
bullet 1st Trimester: D&Xs are not performed during the first three months of pregnancy, because there are better ways to perform abortions. There is no need to follow a D&X procedure, because the fetus' head quite small at this stage of gestation and can be quite easily removed from the woman's uterus.
bullet 2nd Trimester: D&Xs are very rarely performed in the late second trimester at a time in the pregnancy before the fetus is viable. These, like most abortions, are performed for a variety of reasons, including:
bullet She is not ready to have a baby for whatever reason and has delayed her decision to have an abortion into the second trimester. As mentioned above, 90% of abortions are done in the first trimester.
bullet There are mental or physical health problems related to the pregnancy.
bullet The fetus has been found to be dead, badly malformed, or suffering from a very serious genetic defect. This is often only detectable late in the second trimester.
bullet 3rd Trimester: They are also very rarely performed in late pregnancy. The most common justifications at that time are:
bullet The fetus is dead.
bullet The fetus is alive, but continued pregnancy would place the woman's life in severe danger.
bullet The fetus is alive, but continued pregnancy would grievously damage the woman's health and/or disable her.
bullet The fetus is so malformed that it can never gain consciousness and will die shortly after birth. Many which fall into this category have developed a very severe form of hydrocephalus.
In addition, some physicians violate their state medical association's regulations and perform elective D&X procedures - primarily on women who are suicidally depressed.
There appears to be no reliable data available on how many D&X procedures are performed for each of the above reasons.
The physician is faced with two main alternatives at this late point in pregnancy:
bullet a hysterotomy, which is similar to a Cesarean section, or
bullet a D&X procedure
despite what you might think, most "partial birth" abortions are based on life and health reasons. let me tell you precisely how much i want to wait eight months through a pregnancy to have the precious joy of stabbing something in my body and sucking the life out of it like the pro-life camp would have you believe. these are rare and occur under serious circumstances. and they can be done long before the fetus is viable (can survive on its own).
most abortions take place within the first one or two months... generally as soon as a woman discovers she is pregnant which is usually the first missed period.
do i think it is murder? i don't know.
do i think hat a woman and her doctor should be permitted to decide that a 'baby' is not going to achieve consciousness or that the woman is litterally out of her mind over this pregnancy and will quite possibly kill herself and it should be ended?
a resounding YES.
the point of my opinion isn't really "is it wrong". the point of my opinion is that we have personalized healthcare in this nation. we also have laws protecting idividual rights. who am i to decide for every woman and every pregnancy what is and is not acceptable?
in my personal and biblical opinion, a fetus becomes a baby when it breathes on its own. generally, historically, the point was 'quickening' which is usually around five months i think. most elective abortions are done far before then.
2. If a baby is halfway born (partial birth), is it called a "fetaby" or a "betus"??
is a 4 month old fetus that is the size of an avocado a baby when it is removed from the body?
there is no magical point halfway through the birth canal at which one becomes a baby. that's ridiculous.
3. Hypothetically, if it is proven beyond a shadow of a doubt that a fetus, all the way to an embryo, is a human being, would you still support a woman's right to choose?
prior to fertilization, a poential fetus is human. after fertilization, a zygote is human. before the layers form, it is human. after the layers form, it is human. when it still has a tail, it is human, after the legs split, it is human. and so forth.
it has human dna, it is human. is it a baby? is it alive? is it a separate entity from it's mother?
if it were proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that is is a baby and it has feelings and hopes and fears and whatnot, yes, i would still support a woman's right to choose.
4.If your loveable dog is pregnant with puppies, but you dont want them and cant support them with your finances, would you abort the puppies, or give away or sell them to a family that has a desire for 'em?
if that someone else is willing to pay to take care of my dog if the pregnancy damages her health, sure. but i'm smart and i have had my dog fixed. however, if my dog is pregnant with something other than puppies, i want to wait and find out what they are.
5. If a Fetus is not human, would it be regarded as an animal, and if so, subject to animal rights?
it is human. it is not a human. it is an animal because all humans are animals. this is a silly question.
6. If a baby is a baby after it comes out of the womans birth canal, then if a guy is making love to a woman, would he be a little less than human?
men are generally a little less than human.
perhaps when a man is making love to a woman, he is actually fully human.
7. If it was made legal to end the life of a 1-10 year old kid if the parent/parents make that choice, would you be for or against it?
depends on the extenuating circumstances. will they be charged with neglect if they just leave the kid somewhere for someone else to care for (like an emergency room). what if the kid has developed an untreatable condition? what if the kid is incoridgably evil? what if it's the 666 kid?
the problem is the difference here between killing and abusing. if i can kill my 1-10 year old kid, why can't i beat it? i think it's too dangerous. and a 1-10 year old kid (sorry, 0-10) can breathe on its own and be fed by someone else. if someone wants to start investigating the potential for fetus transplants from someone who doesn't want it to someone who does and is willing to pay for the procedure, then fine.
also. the idea behind abortion isn't the right to kill someone. it's the right to not be pregnant. it's the right for a woman to have more say in her use as a reproductive vessel than her husband. you do understand that concept right? it's an extension of the idea that a woman is not the property of the men in her family to do with as they please. the point is, my husband can't just knock me up whenever he feels like it. i have absolute control over my own medical care INCLUDING my uterus.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by LudoRephaim, posted 06-29-2006 12:51 PM LudoRephaim has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 60 by LudoRephaim, posted 07-22-2006 6:58 PM macaroniandcheese has replied
 Message 62 by LudoRephaim, posted 08-03-2006 1:33 PM macaroniandcheese has not replied

  
macaroniandcheese 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3928 days)
Posts: 4258
Joined: 05-24-2004


Message 53 of 403 (332189)
07-16-2006 11:42 AM
Reply to: Message 18 by rgb
06-29-2006 3:11 PM


Re: good response
Have you seen god? If so, how extensive was your study if HIS anatomy?
does this mean it's okay to abort boys with pencil dick genes? because god clearly has a very large penis. and jesus was hung like this (hold arms out like cross).
sorry. couldn't help myself.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 18 by rgb, posted 06-29-2006 3:11 PM rgb has not replied

  
macaroniandcheese 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3928 days)
Posts: 4258
Joined: 05-24-2004


Message 54 of 403 (332190)
07-16-2006 11:44 AM
Reply to: Message 19 by ringo
06-29-2006 3:23 PM


i eat meat, because i refuse to make a distinction between animals and plants. they are both alive and i have no choice but to eat both. besides. there are loads of carnivorous species and they don't seem to have any problems with this shit. particularly sharks and baby seals. i wanna eat me some baby seal. i wonder if it'll still feel cute in my tummy?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 19 by ringo, posted 06-29-2006 3:23 PM ringo has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 57 by ramoss, posted 07-16-2006 3:51 PM macaroniandcheese has not replied

  
macaroniandcheese 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3928 days)
Posts: 4258
Joined: 05-24-2004


Message 55 of 403 (332191)
07-16-2006 11:50 AM
Reply to: Message 33 by LudoRephaim
06-29-2006 7:16 PM


Re: Vanillia Ice Cream
bluebell ice cream and my cousin. the only good things to come out of texas.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 33 by LudoRephaim, posted 06-29-2006 7:16 PM LudoRephaim has not replied

  
macaroniandcheese 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3928 days)
Posts: 4258
Joined: 05-24-2004


Message 56 of 403 (332192)
07-16-2006 11:53 AM
Reply to: Message 39 by bob_gray
06-29-2006 9:21 PM


Re: Necessity of partial birth abortions
i found those statistics as well and and quite aware of the problem. i have a friend with it, but i think she developed it after she was born. ask arach. he knows her better than i.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 39 by bob_gray, posted 06-29-2006 9:21 PM bob_gray has not replied

  
macaroniandcheese 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3928 days)
Posts: 4258
Joined: 05-24-2004


Message 59 of 403 (333867)
07-20-2006 11:01 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by LudoRephaim
06-29-2006 12:51 PM


bump for ludo
just in case you didn't notice my reply.
and i still have no idea what you were talking about.
my apologies to everyone else.
Edited by brennakimi, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by LudoRephaim, posted 06-29-2006 12:51 PM LudoRephaim has not replied

  
macaroniandcheese 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3928 days)
Posts: 4258
Joined: 05-24-2004


Message 61 of 403 (334372)
07-22-2006 7:03 PM
Reply to: Message 60 by LudoRephaim
07-22-2006 6:58 PM


oh right. yeah. bad form mate
looking forward to your return and response.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 60 by LudoRephaim, posted 07-22-2006 6:58 PM LudoRephaim has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 63 by LudoRephaim, posted 08-03-2006 1:36 PM macaroniandcheese has not replied

  
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