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Author Topic:   Poll; theist, atheist or agnostic
purpledawn
Member (Idle past 3539 days)
Posts: 4453
From: Indiana
Joined: 04-25-2004


Message 271 of 295 (342314)
08-22-2006 9:23 AM
Reply to: Message 263 by Phat
08-21-2006 7:40 AM


Deist
quote:
The definition of a deist, however, strikes me as concluding that God is an accepted concept within the parameters of human wisdom and that God is not mysterious or supernatural. The fact that Deists by definition base the origin of the concept of God within the human mind gives me cause to label them outside of strict theistic belief, which would see God (gods) as independant of human thought, reasoning, or definition.
I like your conclusion.

"Peshat is what I say and derash is what you say." --Nehama Leibowitz

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Hyroglyphx
Inactive Member


Message 272 of 295 (342341)
08-22-2006 10:26 AM


Updates again
THEIST
1. Nemesis Juggernaut
2. Faith
3. Mjfloresta
4. Catholic Scientist
5. Percy
6. Iano
7. Arachnophilia
8. Buzsaw
9. Phat
10. Jazzns
11. Trixie
12. Tal
13. GDR
14. Anglagard
15. Purpledawn
16. MitchellMckain
17. Obvious Child
AGNOSTIC
1. Creavolution
2. Omnivorous
3. Schrafinator
4. MangyTiger
5. Rail Bird
6. Rick JB
7. Inflixion
8. Tusko
9. Ekman
10. ReverendDG
11. U can call me Cookie
12. Wounded King
13. Fragallrocks
14. Codegate
15. Legend
ATHEIST
1. Robinrohan
2. Ramoss
3. Subbie
4. Annafan
5. Chronos
6. Corpagyps
7. Randy Feagley
8. Crashfrog
9. Mutty6969
10. CK
11. Chiroptera
12. Michael
13. Nighttrain
14. NosyNed
15. Jaderis
16. Parasomnium
17. Quetzal
18. NeuroCycle
19. Mick
20. Minnemouseus
21. Kalimero
22. Sidelined
23. TS
24. Kisimons
25. Beatle Addict
26. Ohnhai
27. TechnoCore
NONE OF OUR BUISNESS
1. DrJones
RINGO-- IN A CLASS BY HIMSELF
1. RINGO (there can only be one Ringo to rule them all)

arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1426 days)
Posts: 9069
From: god's waiting room
Joined: 05-21-2004


Message 273 of 295 (342478)
08-22-2006 7:38 PM
Reply to: Message 254 by ringo
08-20-2006 3:24 AM


Re: More updates
I prefer to march to my own drummer.
*is reminded of a scene in dead poets society*
anyways, ringo, there are only two kinds of people in this world. those who can be grouped into one of two kinds of people, and those who cannot.


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Heathen
Member (Idle past 1365 days)
Posts: 1067
From: Brizzle
Joined: 09-20-2005


Message 274 of 295 (342479)
08-22-2006 7:41 PM


Can we do a poll which outlined Creationist/Evolutionist/Undecided??
as has been pointed out many theists are not biblical literalists.

Replies to this message:
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1526 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 275 of 295 (342480)
08-22-2006 7:43 PM
Reply to: Message 274 by Heathen
08-22-2006 7:41 PM


Creationist should probably be broken down further to ID and YEC, and possibly others. Or maybe that's for the next poll.

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anglagard
Member (Idle past 918 days)
Posts: 2339
From: Socorro, New Mexico USA
Joined: 03-18-2006


Message 276 of 295 (342483)
08-22-2006 7:51 PM
Reply to: Message 274 by Heathen
08-22-2006 7:41 PM


Next Poll
quote:
Can we do a poll which outlined Creationist/Evolutionist/Undecided??
Seconded.
quote:
as has been pointed out many theists are not biblical literalists.
Of course not, some theists are not even Christian, Muslim, or Jewish.

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tudwell
Member (Idle past 6060 days)
Posts: 172
From: KCMO
Joined: 08-20-2006


Message 277 of 295 (342495)
08-22-2006 8:29 PM


agnostic.

Ben!
Member (Idle past 1480 days)
Posts: 1161
From: Hayward, CA
Joined: 10-14-2004


Message 278 of 295 (342657)
08-23-2006 4:04 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by Hyroglyphx
08-11-2006 2:09 PM


Re: Theist, Atheist, or Agnostic
Not to be an ass (but it does just come naturally), but while my head says "atheist", my actions say "theist" and my heart is numb at this point. It's like when you sit on your ass too long, and it's just painful to move or anything, your legs leave you... I'm just waiting out all the learning and growing to see what I'll feel when I've had time to settle into the new me.
Does that sound, then, like ... agnostic? Feel free to diagnose and tally as you see fit.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Hyroglyphx, posted 08-11-2006 2:09 PM Hyroglyphx has replied

Replies to this message:
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mitchellmckain
Member (Idle past 6505 days)
Posts: 60
From: Salt Lake City, Utah, USA
Joined: 08-14-2006


Message 279 of 295 (342668)
08-23-2006 6:19 AM
Reply to: Message 269 by ringo
08-21-2006 2:14 PM


Re: More updates
ringo writes:
Ding ding ding ding! You win the prize!
That's the first time I've actually been called an "atheist" at EvC.
Oh. I didn't know we were talking about you.
ringo writes:
Nonsense. It is the theist who is denying my experience.
I grew up in an utterly theist environment and I am telling you that I have the same feelings as every theist I have ever met.
I am just saying that I'm not convinced that those feelings were injected into me.
The theist simply experiences God. I never heard of anybody claiming to share what an atheist experiences and then claim that this is not the result of the fact that God does not exist. Of course that does not mean that you haven't. But accusing every theist of the same thing is wrong.
It is you that assume that you experience everything that I do, not me who assumes that I experience everything that you do. Thus you call my experiences delusions, but since I presume no knowledge of your experiences, then I would not make any comment about them.
But it does seem strange to me if you are claiming a experience of the non-existence of God. This is implied by your claim that the theist's belief in God is a denial of your experience. An experience of the non-existence of something does seem like a rather unusual claim to me. So even if I was claiming that your disbelief in God was a denial of my experience of God (and I am not), the situations are not equivalent.
ringo writes:
I am saying that the "experience" does have a basis in fact - but there is a possible disconnect between that fact and "God".
I was paying attention the first time. I just did not know we were talking about you. But now I can say now it is you who are playing games. The experiences in question are experiences of God, to deny the connection to God is to deny that they are experiences of God. And by assuming that everyone's experiences of God are delusions, you are most definitely an atheist.
Edited by mitchellmckain, : spelling

See my relativistic physics of space flight simimulator at Astahost.com

This message is a reply to:
 Message 269 by ringo, posted 08-21-2006 2:14 PM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 280 by ringo, posted 08-23-2006 10:23 AM mitchellmckain has replied

ringo
Member (Idle past 494 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 280 of 295 (342713)
08-23-2006 10:23 AM
Reply to: Message 279 by mitchellmckain
08-23-2006 6:19 AM


Re: More updates
mitchellmcKain writes:
I never heard of anybody claiming to share what an atheist experiences and then claim that this is not the result of the fact that God does not exist.
Too many "nots" in that sentence. As a physicist, I hope you're more precise with numbers.
I'm telling you: I have had the same "experiences" as every theist I know and I have reservations about attributing them to "God".
Thus you call my experiences delusions....
Of course I never said any such thing.
But it does seem strange to me if you are claiming a experience of the non-existence of God.
I don't know where you're getting that. I never said anything about "experiencing non-existence" - whatever the @#$% that means.
I'll type slower this time: I claim the same experiences as all the theists I know. Call it a "possession" by some celestial spook, if you like. I don't.
The experiences in question are experiences of God, to deny the connection to God is to deny that they are experiences of God.
Exactly. I deny that the experiences are necessarily experiences of God.

Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation.
Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC

This message is a reply to:
 Message 279 by mitchellmckain, posted 08-23-2006 6:19 AM mitchellmckain has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 281 by mitchellmckain, posted 08-23-2006 1:27 PM ringo has replied

mitchellmckain
Member (Idle past 6505 days)
Posts: 60
From: Salt Lake City, Utah, USA
Joined: 08-14-2006


Message 281 of 295 (342767)
08-23-2006 1:27 PM
Reply to: Message 280 by ringo
08-23-2006 10:23 AM


Re: More updates
ringo writes:
I'm telling you: I have had the same "experiences" as every theist I know and I have reservations about attributing them to "God".
Well that does sound more like an agnostic position. But my point was simply that by claiming to have the same experiences as other people, the judment you pass on those experiences have a quality of universal judgement.
ringo writes:
Exactly. I deny that the experiences are necessarily experiences of God.
And I deny that your experiences are necessarily the same as my experiences.

See my relativistic physics of space flight simimulator at Astahost.com

This message is a reply to:
 Message 280 by ringo, posted 08-23-2006 10:23 AM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
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Wounded King
Member (Idle past 114 days)
Posts: 4149
From: Cincinnati, Ohio, USA
Joined: 04-09-2003


Message 282 of 295 (342771)
08-23-2006 2:11 PM
Reply to: Message 281 by mitchellmckain
08-23-2006 1:27 PM


Re: More updates
If someone mentions the word qualia I might just scream.
TTFN,
WK

This message is a reply to:
 Message 281 by mitchellmckain, posted 08-23-2006 1:27 PM mitchellmckain has not replied

Replies to this message:
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Phat
Member
Posts: 18388
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003


Message 283 of 295 (342780)
08-23-2006 3:07 PM
Reply to: Message 270 by Legend
08-21-2006 2:51 PM


Re: Theist, Atheist, or Agnostic
Legend writes:
with regard to the Christian God I'm an atheist.
with regard to any other gods I'm an agnostic.
Lemme get this straight. In regards to the Christian God, to me, means that God is Spirit, is alive today and incarnated through Jesus Christ. You say that you definitely don't acknowledge that! Yet...any other gods means what? Gosh, Legend...you sure did add to the confusion!
and please don't bring up the I.P.U., Loki the trickster, or that darn spaghetti monster!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 270 by Legend, posted 08-21-2006 2:51 PM Legend has replied

Replies to this message:
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ringo
Member (Idle past 494 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 284 of 295 (342783)
08-23-2006 3:14 PM
Reply to: Message 281 by mitchellmckain
08-23-2006 1:27 PM


Re: More updates
mitchellmckain writes:
But my point was simply that by claiming to have the same experiences as other people, the judment you pass on those experiences have a quality of universal judgement.
The only way I can "judge" somebody else's feelings is by how they describe them and by how they behave. By that standard of "judgement", there is no discernable difference between my feelings and a theist's. Unless you can show us a better method of "judging" other people's feelings, you're going to have to accept my "judgement".

Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation.
Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC

This message is a reply to:
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Legend
Member (Idle past 5088 days)
Posts: 1226
From: Wales, UK
Joined: 05-07-2004


Message 285 of 295 (342800)
08-23-2006 4:24 PM
Reply to: Message 283 by Phat
08-23-2006 3:07 PM


Re: Theist, Atheist, or Agnostic
Phat writes:
In regards to the Christian God, to me, means that God is Spirit, is alive today and incarnated through Jesus Christ. You say that you definitely don't acknowledge that!
don't be surprised Phat. It's just that i've concluded that the Christian God, as defined in the Bible, doesn't exist, cannot exist.
As for other Gods, I don't know enough about them to make a decision either way, hence the agnosticism.
It's quite simple really!
P.S I was going to bring up Crom Cruaich, the Lord of the Mount, but you pre-empted me there!

"In life, you have to face that some days you'll be the pigeon and some days you'll be the statue."

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