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Author Topic:   Discrimination against homosexuals carried into the 21st century
arachnophilia
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Posts: 9069
From: god's waiting room
Joined: 05-21-2004


Message 25 of 313 (378020)
01-19-2007 10:40 AM
Reply to: Message 22 by Rob
01-19-2007 10:08 AM


Re: Descrimination...
Actually it was 'ish' and 'isha'... Might be a good one for Arachnophilia or Anastasia.

genesis 2, yes. "man" and "woman" are actually the same root, ish, and "woman" has the feminine ending, so ishah. what's the question?

20 Adam named his wife Eve,

as a side note, because it's interesting, "eve" is chavah, the causative form of chayim, "life."


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arachnophilia
Member
Posts: 9069
From: god's waiting room
Joined: 05-21-2004


Message 27 of 313 (378028)
01-19-2007 11:02 AM
Reply to: Message 26 by Rob
01-19-2007 10:59 AM


Re: Descrimination...
Yes... and her offspring would crush the head of the serpent ie. Jesus overcoming satan.

that does not seem to be the purpose of the text.


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arachnophilia
Member
Posts: 9069
From: god's waiting room
Joined: 05-21-2004


Message 29 of 313 (378032)
01-19-2007 11:11 AM
Reply to: Message 16 by Jaderis
01-19-2007 2:03 AM


genesis?
Yes, they were "equal" before sin, so what gave "Adam" the right to "give his wife a different name"

אדם adam - man, or more appropriately "mankind."

you're conflating two stories, i think. one in genesis 2, one in genesis 3. genesis 2 was written to give the hebrew marriage custom a traditional origin. genesis 3 was written to explain things like agriculture, pain in childbirth, snakes, etc.

if you are refering the name in genesis 2, "woman," "man" as a grammatically equall name.

איש ish - man, or more appropriately, "male."
אישה ishah - woman, or "female."

the bit about "called her woman, because she came from man" is simply establishing the origin of the grammatical relation between the masculine and feminine genders in the hebrew language. it's by coincidence that "man" and "woman" have three of the same letters in english, but the relationship is much more obvious in hebrew.

adam gives his wife a proper name only after the curse. the name he gives here is:

חוה chavah - "causes life."

and "rule over her?"

this is part of god's curse. it was probably written to explain the origin of patriarchal society, and the ancient hebrews often deeply misogynistic attitudes. they were equal before that point.

If they were equal, then "Eve" should still have as much rule over "Adam" as he does over her because they both "sinned" and aren't all sins equally egregious under the eyes of God?

each guilty party was given different curses. eve took charge and led her husband astray -- so her curse is to follow him. adam violate god's garden -- so he has to make his own. and the serpent spoke in contradiction to god -- so he has to eat dirt.

anyhow. really, to use the text as justification is circular, since the text was written to explain practices contemporary to the authors. all people are saying by quoting the bible as justification on this issue is "let's live in ancient israel."

Edited by arachnophilia, : No reason given.


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arachnophilia
Member
Posts: 9069
From: god's waiting room
Joined: 05-21-2004


Message 85 of 313 (378276)
01-20-2007 12:46 AM
Reply to: Message 45 by Rob
01-19-2007 6:51 PM


Re: Descrimination...
I see... another one of those pesky coincidences.

no, just a misreading. this is not the topic for this thread. perhaps you'd like to carry on elsewhere?


This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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arachnophilia
Member
Posts: 9069
From: god's waiting room
Joined: 05-21-2004


Message 202 of 313 (378819)
01-21-2007 10:59 PM
Reply to: Message 201 by crashfrog
01-21-2007 9:15 PM


Re: Poor Rob
crash, i think your sarcasm detector is broken.

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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arachnophilia
Member
Posts: 9069
From: god's waiting room
Joined: 05-21-2004


Message 204 of 313 (378838)
01-22-2007 12:01 AM
Reply to: Message 203 by crashfrog
01-21-2007 11:19 PM


poor crash
you ever tell someone a joke, but they don't laugh? it's pretty clear they don't get it, but they always try to pretend like the joke just wasn't funny afterwards.

yeah.


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