The Fact of Death

Me too...

I(sic) have. I was bitching to myself about my mother one time when POW!. A few minutes of something happening through me that wasn't from me. It manifested itself as Total, Complete, Overwhelming Love for my mother. Not love I was capable of, but me observing (being shown) just how lovable my mother is.It lasted a couple of minutes IIRC. Something similar a few months later w.r.t. my father though Less intense.I forgot about it as soon after it happened and carried on my not-so merry way.This message has been edited by iano, 08-May-2006 12:30 PM

To the measure one is prepared (or is driven) to self-examine, the more the window dressing is stripped away. The 'I' can get to see that it uses its thoughts, emotions and body to serve itself. If one observes closely enough (its hard because its not a pleasant sight) one will often notice that at the beginning of each "thought movie" there is an unannounced, unthought of instigating thought. Christianity would call that temptation. It comes out of the blue. Certainly not to be dismissed. As I say, the glimmerings of totally selfish ego are there for anyone who won't reject it. If the rock is pulled back a little then all that crawls underneath can be viewed. I would contend that all religions/philosophies suggest that "we must go beyond" (and I am interested in how aspect will pan out in the conversation with Lfen). I would also contend that Christianity is the only one where "we must be brought beyond"This message has been edited by iano, 08-May-2006 12:28 PM

I often feel that. But when I do, I remind myself that I used to feel exactly the same when I was 21. Even at that age I felt that I'd done certain things wrong in an irrevocable way, that I'd never be able to make up for it, that my life was a failure because of it. But sometimes I was wrong then, and maybe I'm sometimes wrong now.Some of the things I've done, some of the things I've lost, are irrevocable, but living longer won't help that. However long I live, there's no way back.How old are you, rr? Are you really too old to make up for some of the things you've done? Or are the things that bother you most, like the things that bother me, irrevocable? I'm a pretty lazy person. Given an eternity I'd probably do very little. It has been the deaths of people around me, and the subsequent intimations of my own mortality, that have motivated me to do the little I have done. And when I start to slip, it's the reminder that death is just around the corner that keeps me up to the mark.How about you. If you had the whole of eternity, would you do things differently? Once or twice I've tried to correct mistakes that I'd made several years before. The funny thing is, the things that weighed so heavily on me, didn't look the same to other people. They were only important to me.

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The true mystery of the world is the visible, not the invisible

I liked the author's idea about "gumption." That's mostly what I remember about that book.

57. Theoretically, I'm not too old, but practically speaking . . .

...there is no practical way to make up for those things (if I may be so bold as to complete your sentence). That they have slipped the grasp of your ability to cut through the brambles that encapsulate the the heart of the issues left unresolved.Knowing what needs to be resolved is not the same as being able to resolve you might agree. Joel speaks of restoration. Restoration is what we seek. Redemption from what we have done and can't put right. Its what He offers.This message has been edited by iano, 08-May-2006 03:08 PMThis message has been edited by iano, 08-May-2006 03:10 PMThis message has been edited by iano, 08-May-2006 03:10 PM

Like our kind generally, I enjoy taking risks. To even the greatest risk I can reply, yes, well, true, I might die doing this--but I'm going to pass in the blink of an eye, anyway: not much difference between half a blink and a blink, so...Geronimo!!!An eternal life would make our lives boring and dull. Why take any chances when what you are chancing is forever? Who would explore? Who would try anything new? Who would jump 21 school buses with a Harley? Who would choose death before dishonor?With forever on the line, life would become as safe as...tombs.We would devolve into wee frightened critters, holed up in our safe houses lest golf-ball sized hail or a germ cut our eternity short.I'd rather die.

A friend of mine once told me how he view death in a form of an acronym:
D - departure on
E - earth
A - arrival
T - to
H - heaven/hellHe got the point. Life has to end up for a new form of existence - spiritual. We have no definite idea what life is all about and it's only through spiritual enlightenment or philosophy where we can draw temporal answers. We have to experience death first before we can totally understand the meaning of life. But, is there anyone who really had died and returned to life and shared to us what's really there on the other side? None so far, except for the Lord Jesus Christ.I myself believe in predestinations. In the first place we did not choose to be born and we did not choose the spirit that will dwell in us and be our spiritual-ego. It is only when we attained physical and mental (as well as spiritual) maturity that we started asking questions like this. The level of our understanding and the kind of learning we have had made us so inquisitive about the meaning of life. But most of the things we knew are only based on what we have read or experienced thus we can not answer questions we don't really knew.In our real life sitaution, everything is almost in a matter of chance. We may have a very positive outlook in life but we don't know what will happen to us next. And, how about those who oftentimes devote themselves to their belief and pray 4 or 5 times a day and yet never respect the belief of others, or even spare their own lives for a very non-sense purpose(s) and proclaim themselves as heroes? Is that what you call the essence of existence?However, although we don't have the same level of material accomplishments (like material possessions and achievements) we can still be at the top of the essence of human existence by doing what is right and reasonable, and avoiding things destructive or unjust to others. The Lord Jesus Christ once told His Disciples "Do not do unto others what you do not want others done unto you." It is plain and simple and everything good will be given to you as reward.Be human enough to treat life as it is.

Is it a moral thing you're talking about, or an existential thing? Is it the wrongs you've done people that bothers you, or just the sense that you've wasted your life?

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The true mystery of the world is the visible, not the invisible

The only thing you forgot to take account in your forecast Omni is that for all the (acknowledged) thrill of risk taking , the actually consequences of the risk being taken was one about which you have no knowledge. Cease to exist is assumed.Your a bottle or two shy of a six-pack in your philosophy of life and death here. For want of a peek at death

robinrohan What the heck did you do that age would be a barrier to correcting?This message has been edited by sidelined, Mon, 2006-05-08 07:48 AM

According to Christianity, there exists person called Satan who desires your damnation. He works by using temptation, doubt, guilt and deceit. A real bag of worms altogether and far more powerful than us on our own.Its a sobering thought to come to realise that you have not actually been your own. That you have willingly and eagerly danced to the tune of another for so long.He's licking his lips at the prospect of your delivery at the moment Omni. "Carry on risk-taking" he is sure to be whispering to you "Don't consider what the actual consequences might be". Look out for it. You'll see it if you go looking.And if you do see it, perhaps at some point (given you ignorance about the actual risk you are taking) you might consider saying "Geronimo!". This time to life.A perfectly blissful existance precludes any notion of boredom. I'm an engineer and I enjoy concieving and desigining objects to fulfill a function. I enjoy overcoming the many constraints that stand in the way. The fun is in the constraints overcome. The risk.There is no reason not to suppose the enjoyment of constraint won't be a attribute of heaven. We would be taking up the position of children: and children, as we all know, are in need constraint.This message has been edited by iano, 08-May-2006 03:00 PM

Actually, no: I was addressing what I took to be the OP's premise of eternal life as we know it in this here and now, and I think the primary downside to that would be the rejection of even trivial risk to life and limb. Life would be tedious.I understand that you believe you know what is to come. I accept the fact of your belief but see no grounds to accept your beliefs as truth. I don't generally try to psychologize others' beliefs, but in this case I might make an exception and suggest that a peekaboo with death has chased you into a church. I might further suggest that the world suffers a great deal from being full of people with eyes on pie in the sky and backs turned to life here and now.But I won't I don't assume that I cease to exist at biological death. I'm truly agnostic about the issue. However, I'm fully convinced that I'm alive right here and now, and that is what I have willingly risked. The faithful have often courted death; the faithless may fear it or defy it; death makes adventurers of us all. Not sure what you mean here--I've had my share of peeks and then some, and I've no shortage of bottles in my pack. And don't assume you've seen my philosophy of life and death in a forum post.

Really, iano, I found those nursery scare stories laughable even as a child. Why do you think they would hold any sway with an adult atheist?

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The true mystery of the world is the visible, not the invisible