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Author
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Topic: Help Lizard Breath Save Bush from Hurricane Katrina
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arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1365 days) Posts: 9069 From: god's waiting room Joined: 05-21-2004
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Message 37 of 205 (241078)
09-07-2005 2:16 PM
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Back on 911 where we had video footage of a man freezing up like a deer caught in the headlights at the most crucial moments in our recent history, whoa whao whoa. in comparison, 7 minutes is damned near instantaneous. This message has been edited by arachnophilia, 09-07-2005 02:22 PM
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| Replies to this message: | | | Message 38 by Yaro, posted 09-07-2005 4:20 PM | | arachnophilia has replied |
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arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1365 days) Posts: 9069 From: god's waiting room Joined: 05-21-2004
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Message 43 of 205 (241164)
09-07-2005 9:16 PM
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Reply to: Message 38 by Yaro
09-07-2005 4:20 PM
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arach, your being a bit too harsh! I mean, bush was nice enugh to take a whole 2 days off from his 5 weak vacation! I mean, seriously, he's a busy man. We can't bother him with trifeling matters. honestly, i think people are a bit harsh on bush, more so than other presidents. i think the "7 minutes to respond!" and "OMG he's on vacation!" are just silly rabble-rousing michael moore lines. true vacations aren't that common anymore. you think the leader of the free world doesn't have a cell phone? or he isn't constantly surrounded by advisors of some kind? in the modern world, how hard do you think it is to work from a remote location? those "vacation" days count way more than they should. they're just counting days out of the whitehouse, including public appearances. don't get me wrong, i'm no bush supporter. i've protested nearly everything the man has done. i just care more about actual action and policy than where the president chooses to spend his time. i don't think that he's doing enough for nola and miss, but i don't think the vacation claims are exactly fair either. This message has been edited by arachnophilia, 09-07-2005 09:17 PM
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| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 38 by Yaro, posted 09-07-2005 4:20 PM | | Yaro has not replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 45 by Silent H, posted 09-08-2005 6:09 AM | | arachnophilia has replied | | | Message 54 by Tal, posted 09-08-2005 8:58 AM | | arachnophilia has replied |
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arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1365 days) Posts: 9069 From: god's waiting room Joined: 05-21-2004
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Message 44 of 205 (241165)
09-07-2005 9:24 PM
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Reply to: Message 40 by Tal
09-07-2005 4:37 PM
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You lefties keep it up. You aren't winning people over with your ideas, mainly because you don't have any, and bush is not winning people over with his actions, either. mainly because he hasn't had any. tal, the country is starting to wake up and smell the bullshit, finally. that "liberal" media that's been without a spine for 5 years is growing one. democrats are questioning the administration -- even republicans apparently. approval ratings are dropping like mad.
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| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 40 by Tal, posted 09-07-2005 4:37 PM | | Tal has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 46 by Tal, posted 09-08-2005 7:26 AM | | arachnophilia has replied |
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arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1365 days) Posts: 9069 From: god's waiting room Joined: 05-21-2004
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Message 113 of 205 (241494)
09-08-2005 7:33 PM
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Reply to: Message 45 by Silent H
09-08-2005 6:09 AM
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Wait a minute, were you seriously punking on my comment regarding Bush's failure to act after receiving news that a second plane had hit the WTC? yes, i am seriously punking on that comment. i don't think it's a fair evaluation of the situation.
When Pearl Harbor was attacked, would it have been acceptable for any of the men, especially the leaders, to wait 7 minutes as the attack went on? if i recall, the pearl harbor attack took a lot longer than 7 minutes. look at it like this. bush is essentially a figurehead, like any other president. he has power over the armed forces -- but: they don't need his authorization to scramble jets in protection of us airspace. what do you HONESTLY expect to happen in times of disaster? did you expect him to stand up in front a gradeschool class and say "i have to go, the country is under attack" ? what would he do when he left? tell the military to keep doing what they're doing? a good analogy is reflex action. bush is the brain (shudder) in control of a very advanced system of command, like a spinal column. but if you touch something hot, the signal doesn't go to the brain. that takes too much time. instead, there is an immediate reaction lower in the chain of command. at the point bush found out, there should have been fighter jets in the air -- some say they shot down the flight over pa. the response was already going on. the job of the president is to read to gradeschool classes. hug people in need. shake hands with important people. pose in front of trees and in flight suits. think about this honestly for a second. we know the sort of intelligence this guy has. would rather him commanding the military, or reading to school children? i'd rather he stay in the classroom and let the structures designed to run the country in times of crisis actually work.
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| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 45 by Silent H, posted 09-08-2005 6:09 AM | | Silent H has replied |
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arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1365 days) Posts: 9069 From: god's waiting room Joined: 05-21-2004
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Message 115 of 205 (241497)
09-08-2005 7:37 PM
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Reply to: Message 46 by Tal
09-08-2005 7:26 AM
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Keep thinking that. i will. especially now that it's right.
Yeah, that's why he and republicans have been winning by ever increasing margins. Win some elections before you make this claim. Last time I checked, you lost the Presidential election (by a wider margin) and you lost more seats in the house and the senate despite an incumbant President (which isn't the norm). we're talking current approval ratings, as of right now, tal. not the elections 5 years ago and last year.
Oh you mean the forged docuements at CBS and the made up Koran flushing story? You are correct, the media doesn't have a spine. They will have a spine when they start reporting the truth, instead of the "if it bleeds it leads" mentality it currently has so that it can sell more commercials. no. i'm talking about things like what i saw the other day. someone was questioning the head of fema, and asking why they took so long to respond to the disaster. mike brown said they had just learned of it. the interviewer cut him off, and said something to the extent "excuse me, what? you just learned of this TODAY? isn't this your job?" he just repeated what he said about just learning of it that day. and the interviewer said the obvious: "don't you guys own a tv?" sorry, but the bullshit is pretty obvious to most of the country now.
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| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 46 by Tal, posted 09-08-2005 7:26 AM | | Tal has not replied |
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arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1365 days) Posts: 9069 From: god's waiting room Joined: 05-21-2004
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Message 116 of 205 (241498)
09-08-2005 7:39 PM
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Reply to: Message 54 by Tal
09-08-2005 8:58 AM
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I have a new found respect for you arach. because i suddenly appear to defend bush? make no bones about it, i'm not bush defender. i think there's a lot of stuff he should legitimately be criticized for, and maybe even impeached for. but 7 minutes to respond vs a few days? and this vacation bullshit? nah, i'm after him for his poor economic planning, who he appoints to offices (like michael brown of fema), the shoddy war planning, lies, and just general ineptitude.
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| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 54 by Tal, posted 09-08-2005 8:58 AM | | Tal has not replied |
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arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1365 days) Posts: 9069 From: god's waiting room Joined: 05-21-2004
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Message 118 of 205 (241548)
09-08-2005 10:31 PM
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Reply to: Message 117 by crashfrog
09-08-2005 9:03 PM
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I don't know if you remember, but that's what he did. His first media appearance after the attack was him, right there in the school with the children, saying "we have been attacked." alright, point withdrawn. bush is just an idiot, then.
I repudiate Bush's leadership because of what he does. If he were the kind of guy that sprang into action to lead a military response - keeping in mind that there were still two planes in the air - he'd probably be the kind of leader I wouldn't mind in charge of the military. right, but he's not. and when he DOES pre-emptively spring into action, he does entirely the wrong thing. i want this guy as far away from the military as possible.
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| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 117 by crashfrog, posted 09-08-2005 9:03 PM | | crashfrog has not replied |
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arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1365 days) Posts: 9069 From: god's waiting room Joined: 05-21-2004
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Message 126 of 205 (241956)
09-09-2005 6:12 PM
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Reply to: Message 121 by Silent H
09-09-2005 8:42 AM
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I would expect my FIGUREHEAD to SET A GOOD EXAMPLE OF WHAT TO DO IN AN EMERGENCY. I put those in caps so you can clearly see how they go together. A leader would immediately excuse himself from the photo op, no he doesn't have to say why, and leave to a place where he can be seen taking charge of the situation. Creating a solid command and control area, so he knows what is going on and can respond at the proper level. i agree, this would have been better.
That is a different subject altogether. And he did show his intelligence as well as backbone. He did not have the nerve or the common sense to act as a leader during an emerging national crisis no, agreed.
The problem was that this was not simply a small isolated incident. The ramifications of this went well beyond what first responders can handle all on their own, or at least far beyond what they should be handling. He needed to be getting info in a timely basis, and getting people notified so that they could prepare for new events which could arise. As I said, as soon as I found out what was happening I began contacting those I knew so that we could all be up to speed. His role as CIC is to do the same damn thing with the military, intel, law enforcement, and emergency communities. They are not all tied together, and in sync with what to do next (or expect could happen). While planes are scrambling what should those others do? How do you get them up to speed so that you know they are up to speed and making the proper preps? It isn't even so much that he had to be giving orders, as much as he should have been interested in creating a communications structure and getting up to date info (rather than waiting for aides to interrupt his photo op). what would an appropriate response time be?
Unfortunately there is no such thing as a Nationwide "structure" which responds and stays coordinated at that level to a surprise attack from an enemy. at that time, supposedly, fema was that structures. of course, we're seeing now how vastly inept they are at actually coordinating state, local, and federal actions in times of crisis -- and how slow THEIR response is.
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| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 121 by Silent H, posted 09-09-2005 8:42 AM | | Silent H has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 134 by Silent H, posted 09-10-2005 4:18 AM | | arachnophilia has not replied |
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arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1365 days) Posts: 9069 From: god's waiting room Joined: 05-21-2004
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Message 127 of 205 (241959)
09-09-2005 6:14 PM
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Reply to: Message 123 by Silent H
09-09-2005 9:49 AM
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Re: this is weird, but should also settle the matter.
How about this latest entry? Bush signs exec order so that people hired to clean up and rebuild in those areas can be paid less than the prevailing wage. One wonders if there will be a cap on the amount of profit allowed to any of these contracting orgnizations? dear god, wtf.
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| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 123 by Silent H, posted 09-09-2005 9:49 AM | | Silent H has not replied |
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arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1365 days) Posts: 9069 From: god's waiting room Joined: 05-21-2004
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Message 129 of 205 (241961)
09-09-2005 6:33 PM
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Reply to: Message 122 by nator
09-09-2005 8:48 AM
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Re: this is weird, but should also settle the matter.
omg. i couldn't believe that. so i checked. it's accurate. that is downright scary. added by edit:
quote:
On Monday, Aug 29, Bush issued another declaration, which again declares "a major disaster in the State of Louisiana," and this time does include all the coastal and NO-area parishes. But the specifics of this declaration deals only with making federal relief funds available to individuals and state and local governments, not coordinating relief efforts. Chris Floyd - Empire Burlesque - High Crimes and Low Comedy in the American Imperium
This message has been edited by arachnophilia, 09-09-2005 06:58 PM
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| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 122 by nator, posted 09-09-2005 8:48 AM | | nator has not replied |
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arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1365 days) Posts: 9069 From: god's waiting room Joined: 05-21-2004
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Message 130 of 205 (241962)
09-09-2005 6:40 PM
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it's not all bad afterall
quote:
On Friday, Brown, who became director of FEMA in 2003, was relieved of his duties handling the Katrina response and was replaced in that role by Coast Guard Vice Adm. Thad W. Allen.
Page not found | TIME of course, he probably deserves a little worse than that, but what can you do. (also, the clip of a protester telling cheney "go f--- yourself" on national live televsion was kinda cool)
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arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1365 days) Posts: 9069 From: god's waiting room Joined: 05-21-2004
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Message 132 of 205 (241965)
09-09-2005 7:03 PM
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Reply to: Message 131 by jar
09-09-2005 6:53 PM
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Re: it's not all bad afterall
one can only hope that's true. it's not exactly a fair tradeoff by any means, but i'm glad people are looking into bush's cronyism and fraudulent appointment practices regarding vastly underqualified officials (coughcoughrobertscough)
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| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 131 by jar, posted 09-09-2005 6:53 PM | | jar has not replied |
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arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1365 days) Posts: 9069 From: god's waiting room Joined: 05-21-2004
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Re: it's not all bad afterall
you know, for some reason "relieved of duties" sounded like "fired" to me. but apparently they're just sending him back to washington. this dude needs to lose his job, at the very least.
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| Replies to this message: | | | Message 140 by Cthulhu, posted 09-10-2005 9:25 PM | | arachnophilia has not replied |
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arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1365 days) Posts: 9069 From: god's waiting room Joined: 05-21-2004
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Message 152 of 205 (242793)
09-13-2005 12:06 AM
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Reply to: Message 150 by Monk
09-12-2005 10:30 PM
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Re: LB, Monk, Tal, and other Bush defenders
I doubt that Bush was overly concerned about this any more than he would be concerned about earthquakes in California or another major terror attack on US soil. you heard it here first, folks. bush has little to no concern about terrorism either. which doesn't really suprise anyone, given how he ignored cia intell just like he ignored noaa intell here. starting to see a pattern?
Don’t they have TV’s on Air Force One? Wasn’t there anyone on that plane that could possibly discern the gravity of the situation by watching the friggin’ TV? what, you honeslty think the president believes that nasty liberal media?
And we are not speaking of minutes or hours, we are speaking of DAYS. I can understand minutes or hours. But days!!!? yeah, i think that says it all. 7 minutes? forgivable in hindsight. but what did we really expect? what was he going to do? show up and have pictures taken? it's not like he's gonna hand out water or pull people from submerged homes.
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| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 150 by Monk, posted 09-12-2005 10:30 PM | | Monk has not replied |
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arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1365 days) Posts: 9069 From: god's waiting room Joined: 05-21-2004
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Message 178 of 205 (291505)
03-02-2006 1:53 PM
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Reply to: Message 177 by Tal
03-02-2006 1:45 PM
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...oh wait
yeah. that's about as logical as voting bush to stop terrorist attacks. ...oh wait.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 177 by Tal, posted 03-02-2006 1:45 PM | | Tal has not replied |
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