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Author Topic:   The predictions of Walt Brown
JonF
Member (Idle past 254 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 196 of 260 (179599)
01-22-2005 9:26 AM
Reply to: Message 181 by simple
01-21-2005 8:20 PM


Still no evidence
If then the stsrting temperature for the water below was much more normal, perhaps the steamed hotdog type analogies are of no real value. Not that I say it is for sure all wrong, as you know, we'd have to have some evidence for saying that.
OK, where is it? All you've posted so far is ungrounded speculation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 181 by simple, posted 01-21-2005 8:20 PM simple has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 199 by johnfolton, posted 01-22-2005 2:58 PM JonF has replied
 Message 202 by simple, posted 01-22-2005 3:57 PM JonF has replied

  
JonF
Member (Idle past 254 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 197 of 260 (179600)
01-22-2005 9:29 AM
Reply to: Message 188 by simple
01-21-2005 10:03 PM


Re: get down to it
In the context of this thread, loosely based on ideas from Walt, I gave a possible cause already to where heat in the top area of the crust would be a result of this hydroplate sliding. ...
So far, I have simple proposed Walt's mechanism of continental movement as an alternative source for heat.
Yup. and you have not posted any evidence. It's still just a fairy tale.

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 Message 188 by simple, posted 01-21-2005 10:03 PM simple has not replied

  
JonF
Member (Idle past 254 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 198 of 260 (179601)
01-22-2005 9:32 AM
Reply to: Message 193 by simple
01-22-2005 12:39 AM


Re: more specificity
This is good, no one got too uptight at another explanation for heat near the surface.
You've numbed us with your ceaseless spewing of fantastic (in the old sense of the word) and downright silly opium dreams.
Your "explanation" is valueless and of no interest without EVIDENCE.

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 Message 193 by simple, posted 01-22-2005 12:39 AM simple has not replied

  
johnfolton 
Suspended Member (Idle past 5677 days)
Posts: 2024
Joined: 12-04-2005


Message 199 of 260 (179681)
01-22-2005 2:58 PM
Reply to: Message 196 by JonF
01-22-2005 9:26 AM


Walts Theory is Awesome!
JonF, Your missing the obvious, the Hydroplate Theory has the waters erupting out of the seams of the Mid-Ocean Ridges. The Heat was escaping as super sonic steam laterally upwards, and this was the force that what was driving the plates on the cushion of steamed waters. This is why he calls it the HydroPlate theory, because rock would be separate from the basalt layer below the the steamed water that was erupting.
The hot water was continually erupting the heated waters above the earth's atmosphere. So No, it would not be frying the inhabitants in the ark. But likely coming back as snow, rain and ice. The heat would of been dissipated into outer space, as each water molecule heat was sucked out by the cold vacuum of space within and above the erupting fountains of the deep. The bible says he opened the "windows of heaven" so the atmosphere being rolled back (the cold temperatures of the vacuums of space was what the water were erupting within). The intensity of the steam erupting laterally upwards and outwards is what was causing it to recondense and fall back over the entire earth as rain ice, snow and water. This is how the glaciers formed within those 40 days suddenly.
The amount of water given up from under the earth caused the oceans floor to settle to accomodate up to 1/2 mile, this settling also caused an initial rising of the mid-ocean ridges, and as the tecktonic plates separated from the continents formed the trenches as these fractured rocks were sucked inward as the steamed waters recondensed and the mid-ocean ridges rose, causing the trenches to form. (much like an empty mountain dew bottle collapses in a refrigerator.
This extra space under the oceans floor from all the waters that had vacated, allowed the steamed waters under the mantle to recondense back into super pressurized water slowly and as smooth as moving a refrigerator on a pad of compressed air.
Noah had fresh water to drink, cause rain could only come back to the earth as fresh water.
The Ark was never toasted because the erupting waters only erupted upwards, and according to Walt as this granite mantle eroded away, exposing the softer more malleable basalt layer below. The mid-ocean ridges rose upwards and are rising to this day. You can see the plates floating outward in Greenland, as the earth seeks to equalize itself in all the divers places.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 196 by JonF, posted 01-22-2005 9:26 AM JonF has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 200 by DrJones*, posted 01-22-2005 3:25 PM johnfolton has replied
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DrJones*
Member
Posts: 2293
From: Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
Joined: 08-19-2004
Member Rating: 5.5


Message 200 of 260 (179691)
01-22-2005 3:25 PM
Reply to: Message 199 by johnfolton
01-22-2005 2:58 PM


Re: Walts Theory is Awesome!
The hot water was continually erupting the heated waters above the earth's atmosphere. So No, it would not be frying the inhabitants in the ark.
Your wording is weird but you seem to be saying that the plumes of steam started at the ocean floor and ended outside the Earth's atmosphere, is this a correct interpretation?
If it is then you and Walt are still wrong.
  • The steam starts at the bottom of the ocean
  • As the steam travels upwards through the water it will lose some heat to the ocean
  • the ocean gets hotter
  • The steam gets to the surface of the ocean and starts to travel through the atmosphere
  • As it travels through the atmosphere it loses heat to the air
  • The air gets hotter
  • Noah fries
There is no way to ensure that the only time the steam plume loses heat is when it escapes the atmosphere. It will lose heat during the entire distance it travels, Noah will Die.
This message has been edited by DrJones*, 01-22-2005 15:26 AM

*not an actual doctor

This message is a reply to:
 Message 199 by johnfolton, posted 01-22-2005 2:58 PM johnfolton has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 203 by johnfolton, posted 01-22-2005 5:11 PM DrJones* has replied

  
JonF
Member (Idle past 254 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 201 of 260 (179694)
01-22-2005 3:33 PM
Reply to: Message 199 by johnfolton
01-22-2005 2:58 PM


Re: Walts Theory is Awesome!
Laterally upwards, hum?
You'll believe anything that agrees with your prejudices.
Supersonic steam erupting from anywhere on Earth would not just squirt out of the atmosphere. But, pretending for a moment that it would, you're back to the energy dissipation problem of the vapor-canopy-outside-the-atmosphere. The water way up there has much more potential energy than the water returned to Earth. That energy gets dissipated as heat in the atmosphere as the water re-enters. Frying everything.
This is why he calls it the HydroPlate theory, because rock would be separate from the basalt layer below the the steamed water that was erupting.
Tell your pal cosmo. He's proposing that the heat in the Earth today was caused by friction as the continents danced around.
so the atmosphere being rolled back
You still propose that the atmosphere was removed and life survived that?
The intensity of the steam erupting laterally upwards and outwards i
Ah, so you do realize that the steam would erupt laterally too, killing everything.
The amount of water given up from under the earth caused the oceans floor to settle to accomodate up to 1/2 mile
Causing earthquakes that would make the recent one that caused the tsunami look like a kitten's hiccup.
This extra space under the oceans floor from all the waters that had vacated, allowed the steamed waters under the mantle to recondense back into super pressurized water slowly and as smooth as moving a refrigerator on a pad of compressed air.
Nope. The behavior of water and steamis one thing we understand extermely well. It doesn't spontaneously condense like that. It requires a colder reservoir.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 199 by johnfolton, posted 01-22-2005 2:58 PM johnfolton has not replied

  
simple 
Inactive Member


Message 202 of 260 (179699)
01-22-2005 3:57 PM
Reply to: Message 196 by JonF
01-22-2005 9:26 AM


crystal gyro
quote:
OK, where is it? All you've posted so far is ungrounded speculation
I'm looking at the evidence, such as that we do have heat at least in the top area of earth. Such as waves that travel through the earth. In trying to determine if the evidence may have been interpreted wrong so far, regarding the center of earth. I haven't proposed any theories here. To get knowledge and understanding through discussion doesn't mean we can't test our assumptions and findings, as to why we think it is hot. If it is true, and well based, that should become evident even if one puts it under a little scrutiny. Why get mean about it? Must seismic waves affected a certain way as they go through the center of the earth mean it is hot? I couldn't dare say it doesn't mean that. I can see if our current explanations are the only ones, or the best ones. Same with the magnetic field, must our 'gyro' be in temperatures hotter than the sun down there?
quote:
There's a giant crystal buried deep within the Earth, at the very center, more than 3,000 miles down. It may sound like the
latest fantasy adventure game or a new Indiana Jones movie, but it happens to be what scientists discovered in 1995 with a
sophisticated computer model of Earth's inner core. This remarkable finding, which offers plausible solutions to some
perplexing geophysical puzzles, is transforming what Earth scientists think about the most remote part of our planet.
"To understand what's deep in the Earth is a great challenge," says geophysicist Lars Stixrude. "Drill holes go down only 12
kilometers, about 0.2 percent of the Earth's radius. Most of the planet is totally inaccessible to direct observation." What
scientists have pieced together comes primarily from seismic data....!
http://www.psc.edu/science/Cohen_Stix/cohen_stix.html

This message is a reply to:
 Message 196 by JonF, posted 01-22-2005 9:26 AM JonF has replied

Replies to this message:
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johnfolton 
Suspended Member (Idle past 5677 days)
Posts: 2024
Joined: 12-04-2005


Message 203 of 260 (179723)
01-22-2005 5:11 PM
Reply to: Message 200 by DrJones*
01-22-2005 3:25 PM


Re: Walts Theory is Awesome!
DrJones,
Your wording is weird but you seem to be saying that the plumes of steam started at the ocean floor and ended outside the Earth's atmosphere, is this a correct interpretation?
No, I consider it ended above the earths atmosphere and recondensated downward thru the atmosphere. Were talking hundreds of miles to disperse to cool before recondensating. It won't get hotter raining down from hundreds of miles above the earth, because its pressing into the rain below. The air does not get hotter, because the heat has been dispersed out of the steam, blasting out above the earths atmosphere the heat collides with the cold. Then water, snow, ice forms to rain down thru the atmosphere with all the waters raining down. This is how the glaciers formed suddenly.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 200 by DrJones*, posted 01-22-2005 3:25 PM DrJones* has replied

Replies to this message:
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 Message 206 by DrJones*, posted 01-22-2005 5:31 PM johnfolton has replied

  
JonF
Member (Idle past 254 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 204 of 260 (179725)
01-22-2005 5:22 PM
Reply to: Message 203 by johnfolton
01-22-2005 5:11 PM


Re: Walts Theory is Awesome!
It won't get hotter raining down from hundreds of miles above the earth, because its pressing into the rain below.
Energy is conserved. If this presumed ejected water falls back to Earth, all the kinetic energy it originally had (which gets converted to potential energy at its highest altitude) is converted to heat during the fall. Half of today's oceans falling hundreds of miles! That's a alot of energy.
"Pressing intro the rain below", whatever that means, is irrelevant. The energy that started as kinetic energy has to go somewhere, and the only place it can go is into the atmosphere as heat.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 203 by johnfolton, posted 01-22-2005 5:11 PM johnfolton has not replied

  
JonF
Member (Idle past 254 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 205 of 260 (179726)
01-22-2005 5:23 PM
Reply to: Message 202 by simple
01-22-2005 3:57 PM


Re: crystal gyro
IOW, you have no evidence. As espected.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 202 by simple, posted 01-22-2005 3:57 PM simple has not replied

  
DrJones*
Member
Posts: 2293
From: Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
Joined: 08-19-2004
Member Rating: 5.5


Message 206 of 260 (179727)
01-22-2005 5:31 PM
Reply to: Message 203 by johnfolton
01-22-2005 5:11 PM


Re: Walts Theory is Awesome!
You're missing the point. As the steam travels up from the ocean floor it will heat the ocean and the atmosphere that it passes through. On it's way back down it follows the scenario JonF describes. The Earth is heated by the steam during both it's up and down voyages. Noah fries.

*not an actual doctor

This message is a reply to:
 Message 203 by johnfolton, posted 01-22-2005 5:11 PM johnfolton has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 207 by johnfolton, posted 01-22-2005 5:39 PM DrJones* has replied

  
johnfolton 
Suspended Member (Idle past 5677 days)
Posts: 2024
Joined: 12-04-2005


Message 207 of 260 (179730)
01-22-2005 5:39 PM
Reply to: Message 206 by DrJones*
01-22-2005 5:31 PM


Re: Walts Theory is Awesome!
DrJones, I see the waters erupting upward would of rolled back the oceans. Therefore not much of the ocean would of been heated as the supersonic steam erupts upward laterally. JonF is saying the water would be returning so fast without any atmosphere would become super heated. If the waters welled upwards above the atmosphere it would be raining downward thru the welled up waters. I agree though that the steam allowed the waters to well upwards as it cooled.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 206 by DrJones*, posted 01-22-2005 5:31 PM DrJones* has replied

Replies to this message:
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DrJones*
Member
Posts: 2293
From: Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
Joined: 08-19-2004
Member Rating: 5.5


Message 208 of 260 (179734)
01-22-2005 5:55 PM
Reply to: Message 207 by johnfolton
01-22-2005 5:39 PM


Re: Walts Theory is Awesome!
I see the waters erupting upward would of rolled back the oceans
even with the fictional rolling back of the oceans the steam would still have to pass through the atmosphere on its way up. The atmosphere wuld still be heated by the steam on the way up.
JonF is saying the water would be returning so fast without any atmosphere would become super heated.
No he's not. What he's saying is simple physics. The water outside of the atmosphere, due to its altitude, has potential energy. As the water falls back to earth, this potential energy is converted to kinetic energy. This kinetic energy is then converted into heat (due to air friction) as the water passes through the atmosphere and it is also converted into heat once the water impacts the earth.
As I said before the Earth is heated by the steam going up and coming down. Noah fries.
I agree though that the steam allowed the waters to well upwards as it cooled.
What do you mean you agree? I've never stated this. Who are you agreeing with?
This message has been edited by DrJones*, 01-22-2005 17:56 AM

*not an actual doctor

This message is a reply to:
 Message 207 by johnfolton, posted 01-22-2005 5:39 PM johnfolton has replied

Replies to this message:
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johnfolton 
Suspended Member (Idle past 5677 days)
Posts: 2024
Joined: 12-04-2005


Message 209 of 260 (179736)
01-22-2005 6:00 PM


I've got things to do, appreciate your spin, part of me want to continue to spin on your spin, but that would only support your need to spin, so I'm just going to spin on out of here. My significant other does not believe I'll actually spin on out of here. Got to prove her wrong.
Tom

  
johnfolton 
Suspended Member (Idle past 5677 days)
Posts: 2024
Joined: 12-04-2005


Message 210 of 260 (179738)
01-22-2005 6:08 PM
Reply to: Message 208 by DrJones*
01-22-2005 5:55 PM


Re: Walts Theory is Awesome!
DrJones, One last spin, the bible says the atmosphere was rolled back, it says the windows of heaven were opened. Given the atmosphere is rolled back there wouldn't be any atmosphere to be heated on its way up.
even with the fictional rolling back of the oceans the steam would still have to pass through the atmosphere on its way up. The atmosphere wuld still be heated by the steam on the way up.
Rain can only fall so fast in the atmosphere. I took it that JonF is saying rain fell out of orbit it would pick up such speed that when it hit the atmosphere it would generate heat. Were talking about water just welled up above the atmosphere, don't see this as a problem.
This kinetic energy is then converted into heat (due to air friction) as the water passes through the atmosphere and it is also converted into heat once the water impacts the earth.
This message has been edited by Tom, 01-22-2005 18:11 AM

This message is a reply to:
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