100 Categories of Evidence Against Noah’s Flood

anglagard writes:1. Angular unconformities - Angular unconformities are where sediments are laid down in layers, then tilted and eroded, then new sediments are deposited on top. How does a global flood simultaneously deposit, tilt, and erode in the same exact place?2. Radiometric dating - All common forms of radiometric dating, including C14, K-Ar, Ar-Ar, Rb-Sr, Th-Pb, U-Pb, and fission track. The dates derived from these diverse methods, when properly interpreted rather than intentionally misapplied, show that all but the very most recent deposits in the geologic column is vastly older than any postulated flood.3. Fossil Sorting - The sorting of fossils in the geologic record is consistent with evolution and geology across all formations worldwide. There are basically no fossils of dinosaurs found with modern mammals, even when such dinosaurs could fly. There are no flowering plants in the Cambrian, no grasses, no mammals, and no birds. The overall sorting does not show any evidence consistent with a flood or settling in water.4. Varves - How does one create 20 million annual layers, each layer which would have taken at least a month to settle due to hydrodynamics as is observed in the Green River Formation? How does one explain seasonal of pollen grains found in the layers?5. Sedimentation rates - Why would there be Precambrian rocks below ones feet in the Canadian Shield area, yet the entire geologic column in the Williston Basin in North Dakota? Why would a global flood scour down to the Precambrian in one place yet at the same time deposit tens of thousands of feet of sediment in another when it is exactly the same process? Giant post-pyramid ice ages are not an explanation as there is no written record or other evidence of increased historical glaciation to the extent needed to scour the Canadian Shield down in the last 4500 years, not to mention such Precambrian rocks elsewhere on Earth like South Africa.6. Lava layers with ancient soils between flows - How could lava forms which only exist with a land surface interface create interbedded deposits with paleosoils?7. Ice sheets - Ice caps can’t reform in the time allotted since any global flood of 4500 years ago.8. Ice core data with correlated known volcanic events - Ice cores can be dated back by multiple methods nearly a million years, yet show no evidence of a global flood.

The expanse or firmament of Genesis 1:7 may be......
........The rainbow was the perfect object for....................This pre-flood canopy probably consisted of....... water vapor........Water vapor is clear, unlike clouds or steam. A little experiment........THE GREENHOUSE EFFECT.......With a water-vapor canopy, heaven and earth system #1 would be............Scientists have found tropical forests and coal deposits in Antarctica. Ninety-foot plum trees which were..............In these frigid zones many trees, some fossilized and some quick-frozen, have been found.............The water vapor canopy may have more than doubled atmospheric pressure........

[1] For more information about "Hyperbaric Therapy" see: J. C. Davis, "Hyperbaric Oxygen Therapy," Journal of Intensive Care Medicine, 4 (1989), 55-57. Also: Textbook of Hyperbaric Medicine, ed. K. K. Jain (Toronto: Hogrefe and Huber Pubs., 1990), p. 492. Also: Hyperbaric Oxygen Therapy: A Committee Report (UHMS PUB 30 CRHOB), ed. J. T. Mader (Bethesda: Undersea and Hyperbaric Medical Society, Inc., 1989), p. 90. [2] Most of my comments about the effects of the vapor canopy came from Dr. Joseph Dillow's excellent discussion of the effects of the vapor canopy in The Water's Above: Earth's Pre-Flood Water Vapor Canopy (Moody Press, 1982). [3] Petersen, Unlocking the Mysteries of Creation, pp. 28,29. [4] For more information about Glen Rose and the human footprints, contact: Dr. Don R. Patton at the Metroplex Institute of Origin Science, Inc. (MIOS), P.O. Box 550953, Dallas, TX 75355-0953 and Dr. Carl E. Baugh at the Creation Evidences Museum and Archaeological Excavations, P.O. Box 309, Glen Rose, Texas 76043 (817) 897-3200. [5] In Genesis 7:11, the flood began on the seventeenth day of the second month and in the seventh month on the seventeenth day (five months later) as recorded in Genesis 8:4, the ark rested on Ararat. According to Genesis 8:3, these five months included 150 days -- 150 days divided by five months = 30 days in a month; 30 days x 12 months = 360 days in an Old Testament year. [6] The Institute for Creation Research is most helpful and has several different publications dealing with dating techniques. Every family should subscribe to the I.C.R. monthly newsletter, Acts and Facts, Institute for Creation Research, P.O. Box 2667, El Cajon, CA 92021 (619) 448-0900.

PaulK writes:I notice that your quotes miss out any reference to the Bible. If the Bible REALLY implied the existence of the mythical "vapour canopy" then that would not be the case. THe page tat you quote is trying to harmonise a "literal" reading of Genesis with an erroneous view of science.
The "waters above the firmament" are not described as vapour, nor is there any reason to assume that this is what the author of Genesis meant.

PaulK writes:Genesis 2:6 is part of a creation account and does not claim that this state lasted until the Flood. If the author of Genesis meant to sat that this situation persisted to the time of the Flood, then why is it not explicitly stated ? Likewise, the rainbow is said to be a miracle, not something which occurred naturally as a consequence of a "change" in "weather systems". And we must ask, what does the "vapour canopy: have to do with the absence of rain ? Surely the presence of more water vapour in the atmosphere would be unlikely to prevent rain.

leged evidence of a "greenhouse effect" caused by the vapour canopy is equally lacking. The alleged "ninety-foot plum tree" is an error (obviously the author is relying on creationists rather than scientific sources). And the alleged benefits of hyperbaric chambers are still controversial. (It is also worth noting that there is no attempt to estimate the extra pressure resulting from the alleged canopy).

PaulK writes:The section on dinosaurs is also inaccurate. For a start it is quite likely that dinosaurs were warm-blooded. And certainly there were predators among them. It is a stretch to say that the prohibition on meat-eating (itself inferred) applied to any species but humans (and according to Genesis even humans sacrificed animals).

PaulK writes:There is an interesting question here. Why would someone who genuinely revered the Bible create an error by insisting on a strained reading ? Surely putting a falsehood in God's mouth is blasphemous to any Christian.

PaulK writes:But I am not assuming a major change in the atmosphere. Nor do I accept your assertion that the Flood indicates such a change.

teen4christ writes:Buzsaw, I have a question. If the pre-flood atmosphere was saturated with water vapour, does it mean that people back then never had much sunlight?

anglagard writes:And your water canopy 'hypothesis' does not explain angular unconformities, fossil sorting, varves, ice layering, simultaneous volcanism, simultaneous meteoric impacts, the evolution of languages, human history, or the engineering challenges of any leaky vastly undersized wooden barge filled to capacity with eating, breathing, crapping animals, insects, fish, and bacteria and so on.

It is interesting that scientists who would not subscribe to the water vapor canopy theory described above, have published articles that lend credence to portions of that theory. "Using evidence collected in South America and New Zealand, an international team of researchers has determined that climate changes - both warming and cooling patterns - during the late Pleistocene occurred rapidly and were global in scale. As giant iceberg armadas flooded the North Atlantic, alpine glaciers were simultaneously advancing across the Chilean Andes and Southern Alps of New Zealand. Thomas Lowell, associate professor of geology at the University of Cincinnati, and his colleagues published their findings in the September 15, 1995, issues of Science. ...So, what did cause the climate changes? Lowell admits that he and his colleagues have no quick and easy answers. Possibly water vapors played a role. ”A lot of water vapor in the atmosphere leads to a warmer climate,’ he states. ”If there’s less vapor, temperatures become colder. Amounts of water vapor can change quickly, and the geological record indicates that climate changes could be very fast.’" (Anonymous, "Were Climate Changes Global During Ice Ages," Geotimes, vol. 41, 1996, p.7, as cited in Morris, 1997, p. 305.) Additionally some scientists have been quite surprised to find water vapor in the freezing atmospheres of Jupiter, Uranus, Neptune and Saturn. (Dayton Daily News, April 8, 1998, p. 12A)The water vapor canopy hypothesis would neatly explain yet another observed anomaly...too much water in Earth’s upper atmosphere. NASA satellites have confirmed far more hydroxyl in the hydrosphere than current models predict. The parent molecule of hydroxyl (OH) is water (H2O). Because ultraviolet radiation from the sun breaks down water in Earth's upper atmosphere into hydroxyl and hydrogen, a large amount of water must have previously existed. Some have proposed a constant influx of mini-comets as a source for the mysterious water, but that theory has been strongly criticized as unworkable. (Matthews, Robert, New Scientist, July, 1997, pp. 26-27.)Another interesting feature of the early earth atmosphere was enhanced oxygen. "The Earth’s atmosphere 80 million years ago contained 50 per cent more oxygen than it does now, according to an analysis of microscopic air bubbles trapped in fossilized tree resin. The implications of the discovery - if confirmed by more experiments - are enormous. One implication is that the atmospheric pressure of the Earth would have been much greater during the Cretaceous era, when the bubbles formed in the resin. A dense atmosphere could also explain how the ungainly pterosaur, with its stubby body and wing span of up to 11 meters, could have stayed airborne, he said. The spread of angiosperms, flowering plants, during the Cretaceous era could have caused the high oxygen levels reported by Berner and Landis, scientists said last week." (Anderson, Ian, "Dinosaurs Breathed Air Rich in Oxygen," New Scientist, vol. 116, p. 25. Cited in The Modern Creation Trilogy by Morris) Some have even suggested that without such an atmosphere the relatively small lung capacity in certain dinosaurs could not have supplied their massive tissue with the needed oxygen.

In October 2006 Science Daily publicized a study led by Arizona State University staff entitled "Giant Insects Might Reign If Only There Was More Oxygen In The Air." The article claims, "The delicate lady bug in your garden could be frighteningly large if only there was a greater concentration of oxygen in the air, a new study concludes. The study adds support to the theory that some insects were much larger during the late Paleozoic period because they had a much richer oxygen supply, said the study's lead author Alexander Kaiser. The Paleozoic period...was a time of huge and abundant plant life and rather large insects -- dragonflies had two-and-a-half-foot wing spans, for example. The air's oxygen content was 35% during this period, compared to the 21% we breathe now, Kaiser said." This research concurs with the biblical model of the early earth.Some object strongly to using the scriptures to gain scientific insight into the natural world. While the Bible is not a science text, there are several lines of evidence that the Bible is God's Word. If God's word is truly inspired, it speaks accurately to all areas of knowledge: historical, political/economic, sociological, scientific, etc.

bluejeans writes:I know you know. And I agree, unless we magically add water to the system, then subtract it. What I was trying to think up was a way for a flood to become global for a year without addition or subtraction of water to the system. So, the earth would have to be smooth and ocean covered except for one low lying piece of land. Imagine Holland sticking above the surface. Then the earth warms enough to melt the ice caps, then cools during the year to re-form them.However, thinking about it, there would also have to be bumps at the poles, because it is only ice on land that significantly raises sea levels. There would also have to be more ice than there is at present, presumably, as the Greenland and Antarctic ice is worth (I think) about a 400 foot rise in sea levels if it melts now, but in my scenario the ocean has a much larger surface area.Even if this is possible, it doesn't seem to be much use to creationists, as the post flood tectonic plate movement necessary to give us the present lay of the land poses even more problems than the flood. They might take up the idea, though, because the rapid warming of the earth might cause lots of evaporation and rain from above, and the ice melting very quickly might account for the waters from below mentioned in the Bible. Also, just one piece of land makes it much easier for Noah to get all the animals on the Ark.

Rahven writes:Then please provide the mechanism by which a billion years worth of tectonic activity and the raising of mountains and the deepening of oceans is caused by a flood over a period of a year without sterilizing the planet.Saying "a flood can do that" is blatantly false unless you can demonstrate that a local flood has been observed to create similar structures on smaller scales, or at least provide a plausible mechanism by which 40 days of global rain and a massive global flood can do so.