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Author Topic:   Pat Robertson on natural disasters
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 286 of 302 (256222)
11-02-2005 11:07 AM
Reply to: Message 279 by Asgara
11-02-2005 9:56 AM


Re: Bashing Robertson
Asgara writes:
Buz, I've asked you before. Please give me a "LINK" to your NOAA data so I can verify it for myself.
My sincere apologies, madear. I had intended to enter it and forgot. I've edited it in. here it is, as well.
http://www.webpennys.com/hurricane_frequency_study/
Asgara writes:
Read the stats on landfall major hurricanes since 1948, for example. Nearly all of them since 1900 were after 1948
Your list is not from the NOAA's The Most Intense Hurricanes in the United States 1900-2000...
It is not from the NOAA's The Thirty Deadlist Mainland US Tropical Cyclones 1900 - 2000 ...
Nor is it from the NOAA's Costliest U.S. Hurricanes 1900-2000
Buz, I am NOT saying you are definately wrong, I haven't seen where you are getting your information from. I AM saying that you haven't shown anything yet.
It is none of the above. It's the major landfall ones since 1900 and updated to include 1905 by the website publishing it, since it had not included the ones of the last few years.
This message has been edited by AdminJar, 11-02-2005 10:11 AM

The immeasurable present is forever consuming the eternal future and extending the infinite past. buzsaw

This message is a reply to:
 Message 279 by Asgara, posted 11-02-2005 9:56 AM Asgara has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 298 by Asgara, posted 11-02-2005 5:30 PM Buzsaw has replied

PaulK
Member
Posts: 17815
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.1


Message 287 of 302 (256223)
11-02-2005 11:07 AM
Reply to: Message 285 by jar
11-02-2005 11:01 AM


Re: Bashing Robertson
I think that Buz's idea of carefully reading the Bible is carefully NOT reading any bit of it that might say something that Buz doesn't like.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 285 by jar, posted 11-02-2005 11:01 AM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 288 by jar, posted 11-02-2005 11:15 AM PaulK has not replied
 Message 289 by Buzsaw, posted 11-02-2005 11:22 AM PaulK has replied

jar
Member (Idle past 384 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 288 of 302 (256225)
11-02-2005 11:15 AM
Reply to: Message 287 by PaulK
11-02-2005 11:07 AM


To the heart of the matter
I think that Buz's idea of carefully reading the Bible is carefully NOT reading any bit of it that might say something that Buz doesn't like.
Amen Brother, Testify!
This is the heart of the issue with Pat Robertson, Jerry Falwell, Dobson, Phelps, and so many of the televagelists.
They LIE.
They pull stuff out of context.
They distort.
They preach intolerance.
The preach ignorance.
And it time for other Christians to shine the full light of the Gospel upon them.

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
 Message 287 by PaulK, posted 11-02-2005 11:07 AM PaulK has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 291 by Buzsaw, posted 11-02-2005 11:32 AM jar has not replied

Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 289 of 302 (256230)
11-02-2005 11:22 AM
Reply to: Message 287 by PaulK
11-02-2005 11:07 AM


Re: Bashing Robertson
PaulK writes:
I think that Buz's idea of carefully reading the Bible is carefully NOT reading any bit of it that might say something that Buz doesn't like.
I've read it intensely, carefully and regularly daily for 60 years since I became a Biblical fundamentalist Christian at age 10, honeing in on the prophecies when these things way back began to come into focus and Israel became a nation, watching them along with world events through the decades. There was no Israel on the map until I was a teenager. I've also observed the incidence of natural disasters in person as their frequency has relatively steadily increased. How about you, PaulK? Aparantly, from your apparant lack of understanding and insight on Biblical fundamentals, you've a lot of homework to do before considering yourself an authority on the subject at hand.

The immeasurable present is forever consuming the eternal future and extending the infinite past. buzsaw

This message is a reply to:
 Message 287 by PaulK, posted 11-02-2005 11:07 AM PaulK has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 290 by jar, posted 11-02-2005 11:24 AM Buzsaw has replied
 Message 293 by PaulK, posted 11-02-2005 11:36 AM Buzsaw has replied

jar
Member (Idle past 384 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 290 of 302 (256232)
11-02-2005 11:24 AM
Reply to: Message 289 by Buzsaw
11-02-2005 11:22 AM


Re: Bashing Robertson
I've also observed the incidence of natural disasters in person as their frequency has relatively steadily increased.
Increased in relation to what?

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
 Message 289 by Buzsaw, posted 11-02-2005 11:22 AM Buzsaw has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 292 by Buzsaw, posted 11-02-2005 11:34 AM jar has replied

Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 291 of 302 (256238)
11-02-2005 11:32 AM
Reply to: Message 288 by jar
11-02-2005 11:15 AM


Re: To the heart of the matter
Jar, me deluded friend, your obvious hatred and disdain for good patriotic American Christians like Falwell and Dobson, who've done so much good and helped so many, including the poor and destitute does nothing but make you look bad. When are you going to get off this meanspirited hateful bashing of good people and learn to be nice as we discuss things here. It would make the place a much more pleasant place to discuss and debate the issues.

The immeasurable present is forever consuming the eternal future and extending the infinite past. buzsaw

This message is a reply to:
 Message 288 by jar, posted 11-02-2005 11:15 AM jar has not replied

Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 292 of 302 (256239)
11-02-2005 11:34 AM
Reply to: Message 290 by jar
11-02-2005 11:24 AM


Re: Bashing Robertson
Reread thoughtfully, prayerfully and objectively!

The immeasurable present is forever consuming the eternal future and extending the infinite past. buzsaw

This message is a reply to:
 Message 290 by jar, posted 11-02-2005 11:24 AM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 297 by jar, posted 11-02-2005 11:54 AM Buzsaw has not replied

PaulK
Member
Posts: 17815
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.1


Message 293 of 302 (256242)
11-02-2005 11:36 AM
Reply to: Message 289 by Buzsaw
11-02-2005 11:22 AM


Re: Bashing Robertson
If you look at the NASB the section starting with Ezekiel 37:15 is even subtitled "Reunion of Judah and Israel".
Here are the verses.
15 The word of the LORD came again to me saying,
16 "And you, son of man, take for yourself one stick and write on it, 'For Judah and for the sons of Israel, his companions'; then take another stick and write on it, 'For Joseph, the stick of Ephraim and all the house of Israel, his companions.'
17 "Then join them for yourself one to another into one stick, that they may become one in your hand.
18 "When the sons of your people speak to you saying, 'Will you not declare to us what you mean by these?'
19 say to them, 'Thus says the Lord GOD, "Behold, I will take the stick of Joseph, which is in the hand of Ephraim, and the tribes of Israel, his companions; and I will put them with it, with the stick of Judah, and make them one stick, and they will be one in My hand."'
20 "The sticks on which you write will be in your hand before their eyes.
21 "Say to them, 'Thus says the Lord GOD, "Behold, I will take the sons of Israel from among the nations where they have gone, and I will gather them from every side and bring them into their own land;
22 and I will make them one nation in the land, on the mountains of Israel; and one king will be king for all of them; and they will no longer be two nations and no longer be divided into two kingdoms.
If you had actually read ALL these verses there is no way you could have missed the references to the lost tribes of Israel.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 289 by Buzsaw, posted 11-02-2005 11:22 AM Buzsaw has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 295 by Buzsaw, posted 11-02-2005 11:48 AM PaulK has replied

Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 294 of 302 (256244)
11-02-2005 11:40 AM
Reply to: Message 284 by NosyNed
11-02-2005 10:50 AM


Re: Greater beings?
NosyNed writes:
Other than those who think the creator of the entire universe takes us as being special and "in His image" I don't think anyone was claiming any such thing. Those of us with a real interest in the real universe are very interested in the notion that there might be others equal or greater than we.
But apparantly not interested enough to allow discussion of possible evidence on it as a scientific hypothetical or even theoretical possibility without being suspended or banned from science forums, and apparantly not interested enough in it to allow discussion in the schools of education.

The immeasurable present is forever consuming the eternal future and extending the infinite past. buzsaw

This message is a reply to:
 Message 284 by NosyNed, posted 11-02-2005 10:50 AM NosyNed has not replied

Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 295 of 302 (256246)
11-02-2005 11:48 AM
Reply to: Message 293 by PaulK
11-02-2005 11:36 AM


Re: Bashing Robertson
PaulK writes:
If you had actually read ALL these verses there is no way you could have missed the references to the lost tribes of Israel.
Why not? Read carefully who's doing the regathering the scattered ones from the nations.
Gotta run. My business being on hold with much to do and this nice day passing quickly here in upstate NY. Have a good one and will talk again, Lord willing.

The immeasurable present is forever consuming the eternal future and extending the infinite past. buzsaw

This message is a reply to:
 Message 293 by PaulK, posted 11-02-2005 11:36 AM PaulK has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 296 by PaulK, posted 11-02-2005 11:54 AM Buzsaw has not replied

PaulK
Member
Posts: 17815
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.1


Message 296 of 302 (256250)
11-02-2005 11:54 AM
Reply to: Message 295 by Buzsaw
11-02-2005 11:48 AM


Re: Bashing Robertson
quote:
PaulK writes:
If you had actually read ALL these verses there is no way you could have missed the references to the lost tribes of Israel.
Why not? Read carefully who's doing the regathering the scattered ones from the nations.
Who is doing the gathering does not change who is being gathered. As I said it is about the reunification of the two ancient kingdoms of Judah and Israel and that has not happened. You chose to deny this even though the verses I quoted are quite clear on the subject.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 295 by Buzsaw, posted 11-02-2005 11:48 AM Buzsaw has not replied

jar
Member (Idle past 384 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 297 of 302 (256251)
11-02-2005 11:54 AM
Reply to: Message 292 by Buzsaw
11-02-2005 11:34 AM


Once again evasion and failure to address the question
Natural disasters are increasing in relation to what?
It's a simple question buz.

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
 Message 292 by Buzsaw, posted 11-02-2005 11:34 AM Buzsaw has not replied

Asgara
Member (Idle past 2293 days)
Posts: 1783
From: Wisconsin, USA
Joined: 05-10-2003


Message 298 of 302 (256313)
11-02-2005 5:30 PM
Reply to: Message 286 by Buzsaw
11-02-2005 11:07 AM


Re: Bashing Robertson
Buz, thank you for providing the link.
Your NOAA list is by no means definitive, and it doesn't claim to be. It claims to be A list of major storms...not the list of ALL major storms. You can look at my links to NOAA's most intense, most deadly, and most costly storms and you have many storms missing from your list that are on various ones of mine.
Picture a list of cars that you saw pass your house today compared to the list of all cars that passed your house this same day.
I have to agree with PaulK here, your webpenny site didn't do much research into what it was printing. That same page lists the 2004 hurricanes as all being at least cat 3 at landfall...Frances was only a cat 2. Your site is discussing US hurricanes and at least three on their list did NOT make US landfall, Iris falling WELL short.
All the report links on your webpenny page go back to the same NOAA page that they are using deceptively.
Once again hun, not saying you are definately wrong, but you have YET to show us anything.
Meteorologists DO expect the storms to increase in number...
Max Mayfield, director of the National Hurricane Center in Miami, told a Senate subcommittee on Tuesday that we're in a period of heightened hurricane activity that could last another decade or two.
"The increased activity since 1995 is due to natural fluctuations (and) cycles of hurricane activity driven by the Atlantic Ocean itself along with the atmosphere above it and not enhanced substantially by global warming," he testified.

Asgara
"I was so much older then, I'm younger than that now"
select * from USERS where CLUE > 0
http://asgarasworld.bravepages.com
http://perditionsgate.bravepages.com

This message is a reply to:
 Message 286 by Buzsaw, posted 11-02-2005 11:07 AM Buzsaw has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 299 by Buzsaw, posted 11-02-2005 7:34 PM Asgara has replied

Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 299 of 302 (256352)
11-02-2005 7:34 PM
Reply to: Message 298 by Asgara
11-02-2005 5:30 PM


Re: Bashing Robertson
Asgara writes:
Buz, thank you for providing the link.
Your NOAA list is by no means definitive, and it doesn't claim to be. It claims to be A list of major storms...not the list of ALL major storms. You can look at my links to NOAA's most intense, most deadly, and most costly storms and you have many storms missing from your list that are on various ones of mine.
It's major landfall ones, which are the ones relative to the op of this thead, i.e. natural disasters They need to make landfall to do the disastrous damage in most cases. That so many are making landfall seems to indicate that things are changing quite rapidly meterologically.
Asgara writes:
Your site is discussing US hurricanes and at least three on their list did NOT make US landfall, Iris falling WELL short.
The three are on the NOAA list, aren't they?
Asgara writes:
Once again hun, not saying you are definately wrong, but you have YET to show us anything.
I repeat: I've still shown that the frequency of all natural disasters of all kinds together has been on the rise in recent decades, according to a number of websites. Also, even if you discount your three hurricanes from the NOAA list, you still have a significant increase in natural disasters from them.
Asgara writes:
Meteorologists DO expect the storms to increase in number...
Max Mayfield, director of the National Hurricane Center in Miami, told a Senate subcommittee on Tuesday that we're in a period of heightened hurricane activity that could last another decade or two.
"The increased activity since 1995 is due to natural fluctuations (and) cycles of hurricane activity driven by the Atlantic Ocean itself along with the atmosphere above it and not enhanced substantially by global warming," he testified.
Yes, and I've already stated that to be the case, so for you to say I've shown nothing is just not right.

The immeasurable present is forever consuming the eternal future and extending the infinite past. buzsaw

This message is a reply to:
 Message 298 by Asgara, posted 11-02-2005 5:30 PM Asgara has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 300 by Asgara, posted 11-02-2005 8:12 PM Buzsaw has not replied
 Message 301 by NosyNed, posted 11-02-2005 8:12 PM Buzsaw has not replied

Asgara
Member (Idle past 2293 days)
Posts: 1783
From: Wisconsin, USA
Joined: 05-10-2003


Message 300 of 302 (256361)
11-02-2005 8:12 PM
Reply to: Message 299 by Buzsaw
11-02-2005 7:34 PM


Re: Bashing Robertson
It's major landfall ones, which are the ones relative to the op of this thead, i.e. natural disasters
Buz that NOAA list does not say what the criteria is for being on that list... your webpenny page doesn't either. It is a list not the list. It does not list all the major landfall hurricanes since 1900.
The three are on the NOAA list, aren't they?
The three are on YOUR list of some major hurricanes...they are NOT on the NOAA list of The Most Intense Hurricanes in the United States 1900-2000
That is my point buz, your list is not a list of either most intense, most deadly, or most costly US landfall hurricanes.
I've still shown that the frequency of all natural disasters of all kinds together has been on the rise in recent decades, according to a number of websites.
You have given us some half-assed quotes from unlinked websites saying what you want to hear. I can find all kinds of websites saying Christianity is bunk, does that automatically make YOU wrong? I have given you official NOAA links with non-ambiguous titles for their lists.
Yes, and I've already stated that to be the case, so for you to say I've shown nothing is just not right.
Buz you are making a mistake here. I never said you were wrong, and the fact that you may have some things right does not mean YOU have shown it. Your posts have not shown anything yet.
You have claimed that global warming is producing an unprecedented increase in natural disasters since 1948 in concordance with prophecy, a claim you have failed to back up. What we are saying is that any increase is cyclical, and has been happening for many centuries, and has NOT only been happening since 1948.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 299 by Buzsaw, posted 11-02-2005 7:34 PM Buzsaw has not replied

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