Creationist Admins

I think a lack of background knowledge in science definately has a part in creating the perception of persecution, but mostly I think it is just raw arrogance or an irrational reaction to arguments that directly or indirectly undermine their own confidence in what they believe.I think anyone who is humble enough to realize his own limitations and is willing to try and learn from another person should not be limited by his lack of background knowledge in science and logic.This message has been edited by Hangdawg13, 11-15-2004 03:26 PM

Dawg,Thanks for your reply. You have more experience on the creo side and I see the value of your views. I think I was trying to find a way to soften the impact but arrogance is sometimes quite obvious.lfen

TO: PercyYou, Percy, wrote:

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Kendemyer and John Davison are in Boot Camp because they'd rather rail at the people who work so hard to make EvC Forum the success it is today.

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Percy, have you been through the science related forums at ? If so, how many tumbleweeds did you have to dodge in those ghost towns called forums? I suppose you could say the meager discussion going on in these forums is of such a high calibre that it is one of America's greatest undereported success stories. I hope you do not believe your own press, however.Your Percy also wrote:

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They'd rather make broad unsupported assertions and avoid actually discussing them.

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Did you notice that Adminmooseus could not support his creationist irrationality assertion. Adminnosy's attempt to defend Adminmooseus fell flat didn't it? For some unknown reason the cat somehow got Adminnosy's tongue when he was asked if mental health is associated with rationality. I suppose if the social science data were more flattering to professed atheists and less flattering to theists Adminnosy might have been more talkative. Please see the psychological studies on theist/professed atheists at: "Psychology Examines Atheism And Theism Plus....." at: http://www.christian-forum.net/index.php?showtopic=369 I think your moderators have been very uncharitable to believers but given the charitable contributions given by believers versus the less and non-religious according to the social science literature perhaps that is not so surprising (please for details: http://www.christian-forum.net/index.php?showtopic=369 ).You Percy also wrote:

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Dissent or disagreement is met with evasion and ridicule rather than dispassionate discussion. They'll stay in Boot Camp until they break the habit or go away.

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It seems to me that the professed materialists can dish it out but they cannot take it. Perhaps, the opposers of God here have a problem with pride. Could that be the issue? Perhaps, we should ask the very vocal evolutionist Mr. Dawkins who is actively pushing his "Bright" campaign! (see: The Brights' Net - Who are The Brights? ). LOL It seems the evo admins are thin skinned plus they cannot stand the fact when the creationist debate with even a little more liberty that the evos fare rather badly. Your "free for all" forum is great evidence of that isn't it? Where is the status of your "free for all" forum? It was such a great success for the creationists that no new topics are being allowed! LOLThis message has been edited by kendemyer, 11-15-2004 04:05 PM

For the record, the message he was replying to was message 41 of this topic.Rationaliy comes in degrees. Sometimes it comes and goes completely. Sometimes my general perception of creationist rationality is tainted by certain extreme examples.I continue to rationalize that your messages are worthy of reply.In general, the blather content of your message is a testiment to your irrationality. I am open to opinion from other members, regardless of the side of the debate they are on, that my judgement is incorrect.Stop your whining.Adminnemooseus

I agree completely.

I think I know what is going on. Ken has been using the link Forums Summary rather than All Topics. Because of this, he can't keep track of the up-to-date topics that are being actively discussed. For example, if you look at Dates and Dating, you will see that it does indeed seem like a ghost town.The biggest clue to indicate that this is happenning is what Ken said earlier. This is a very common mistake that new users make. This is why sometimes we see newbies replying to messages that are a year old. Heck, I did it once when I first joined.

Yes and I'll be the first to admit I have been quite arrogant at times posting here, but even when I first started posting here I recognized that most of the people I was debating had much more knowledge than I did about the subject. I also did not have a very good understanding of debate and how to present a logical argument, but I think I have learned quite a bit through it all.Also, when I first started posting here, I felt outnumbered, outgunned, and outclassed. I would never say I felt persecuted because I intentionally brought the testing upon myself. That's just what happens when you debate somebody.Whining is just dumb. A Christian with a martyr complex is wasting his time here.And though I felt like the underdog I never once felt like the Admins were being unfair. I can't remember being rebuked more than twice in all my postings here.

If only every creationist and fundy have the same attitude.

TO: AdminmooseusInstead of your whining about how completely irrational creationists are in your vague blathering, perhaps you could give something more substantial than your ad hoc personal and subjective opinion. I provided data from the social sciences from Mayo clinic and others in regards to mental health or factors associated with mental health in regards to religious, less religious/non-religious people. I did the same for charitable giving. Where is your evidence? Please do not respond to this message unless you have a scientific study. I suggest other professed materialist do the same. I want a blather free response to this message or silence.This message has been edited by kendemyer, 11-15-2004 07:01 PM

you took irrational the wrong way. stop being so offended by everything. religion (especially creation) is based upon the supernatural. rationality (see rational numbers) is the easy, the observable, the countable. science is the study of those rational things... those witch make up the NATURAL universe. religion is irrational because it involves the supernatural. just as infinity is irrational (well not precicely.. it's undefined... pi is irrational though and it exists). the point is that religion and those who follow one are irrational because they are concerned with things that cannot be explained in nature. and now i'm questioning the rationality of this entire board, too *snickers*.

TO: Lamre: evcforum, science forum ghost townsThe forum "Biological evolution" has not had a post in about 3 days.When I went into the forum needless to say the tumbleweeds outnumbered the posting in the last three days.In the "Great debate" forum the first thread has a last post date of 11-06-04 and it wasn't even a debate but some user by the name of "rookie" asking questions. The second thread has a last post date of 7-18-04! I guess there are not a lot of great debates going on at ! It takes two to tango though and from what I have seen the evolutionist often do not debate without their evo admin meddlers saving their butt! Hiding behind admins though is no substitute for truth is it?I heard rumors that was picking the "tumbleweed" as their official mascot by the way!I almost feel like singing a song. The song of course is:See them tumbling down
Pledging their love to the ground...
Drifting along with the tumbling tumble weed
Cares of the past are behind
Nowhere to go but I'll find
Just were the trail will wind
Drifting along with the tumbling tumble weed
I know when night has gone
That a new world's born at dawn
I'll keep rolling along
Deep in my heart is a song
Here on the range I belong
Drifting along with the tumbling tumble weed
I know when night has gone
That a new world's born at dawn
I'll keep rolling along
Deep in my heart is a song
Here on the range I belong
Drifting along with the tumbling tumble weed- Tumbling TumbleweedThis message has been edited by kendemyer, 11-15-2004 07:47 PM

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...perhaps you could give something more substantial than your ad hoc personal and subjective opinion.

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Well, if you insist.Adminnemooseus

Honestly, y'all, this was actually funny. Ken, you're crazy as a bat, but you made me laugh. Gotta give you some props.Ben

There you go ragging on about how bad the science forums here are, and how hopeless the poor scientists on this board are at debating. However, you have AS YET failed to respond to my earlier challenge - pick a non-philosophic, non-religious topic in science and I will gladly hand you your butt without ANY moderator assistance. Put up or shut up. Your childish "nyah, nyah, nyah" is getting boring.Edited to add: Awww, *&#$@#$@))#%#@Q(*^&*%&!!!. The SOB got suspended. Why is it that none of these clowns dares actually debate the science? They seem to immediately self-destruct when they get to anything remotely substantive. They appear totally willing to blather on in babble or metaphysics threads - probably because there's no right answer - but meltdown into a pool of goo rather than debate something interesting. I REALLY HATE it when that happens.This message has been edited by Quetzal, 11-16-2004 08:16 AM

This topic actually started out as a pretty good discussion of the problems of having creationist admins at this forum (See page 1 for a review).I certainly don't hold Ken DeMyer as being representative of all creationists. Members like Ken actually might be one of the greatest reasons why having a creationist admin would be nice. The "AdminCreo" might feel freer to come down on the likes of Ken, earlier and/or harder than an evo side moderator.Per the earlier mentioned idea of a "Buz/Moose" "Great Debate" - As was the case with the never happened "Frog/Moose" "GD", I'm not really looking for a real hard core debate. Rather, the "GD" format would permit a nice calm one on one discussion of the creationist admin issue. I Think I will put the idea on the back burner for now, unless Buz really likes the idea.In general, I've tried to push the idea of more "Great Debates". The "GD" format restrictions would be the one sure way of preventing "pile on the creo".Adminnemooseus