AdminNosy banned?

I think this is verging on the needlessly messianic.They will be missed in their absence, but I shouldn't await their return as the second coming.TTFN,WK

Don't worry its fallout from the 'Big bang' thread, somewhat ironically.TTFN,WK

Quite right. It's a sad day when people are asking Percy to step aside for wanting people to discuss things in a rational and scientific way in the science fora. As far as I can see the recent 'exodus' seems more like a melodramatic hissy fit simply because percy stuck to his guns.An All those going on anout what NWR's real deep and relevant point was should probably reaquaint themselves with his Criticizing neo-Darwinism thread where exactly the same thing happened. NWR makes a claim to skepticism over the utility of neo-darwinism and then proceeds to make a number of arguments straight from the creationist/ID playbook. When called on this and asked to provide some actual scientific support for his position he started disowning his own statements and his only real argument was that he didn't find neo-darwinism 'persuasive'.TTFN,WK

You don't seem to read too good Buz. I don't see anywhere where Percy said that the goal of EvC was to refute that statement. He said the purpose was to consider it.Now there may be members here who do come here specifically to refute IDist creationist claims, I would probably number myself as one, but I think it would be very unfair to suggest that we don't consider a lot of those claims as well.Except for in the cases of the most simplistic restatements of over recycled creationist arguments a lot of the positions of ID/creationist posters require some study and analysis if one is to hope to refute them with anything other than slander and ad hominems and I hope that most of us do aspire to a proper reasoned refutation.The only thing to stop 'the other side' engaging in debate in the science fora would be if they don't have any scientific evidence to substantiate their positions. That is the only 'legal' bar.SOmething which has to be said in Randman's favour, and in favour of our recent short term poster Eggasai, is that they often based their premises on actual extant scientific literature rather than talkingpoints off creationist websites or literature from other creationist sources.TTFN,WK

Poor Nosy, you have been supplanted in your own thread.What is the world coming to.TTFN,WK

Are the creationist on this board often excluded from scientific fora or restricted to one forum, yes.Are they excluded because of Percy's prejudice against them, no.They have excluded themselves by failing to adhere to the forum guidlines.If you don't think that Randman's current citizenship status in second class then why is he stuck in Showcase?The answer is that he consistently ignored the forum guidelines. Percy has made controversial efforts to provide a forum where those who persistently flaunt the guidelines to the extent of being permanently uspended previously may have their say on their own terms.These peoples status is not determined by categorisation as creationist by the admins but by categorisation as frequent transgressors of the forum guidelines.The correct analogy is not to racial descrimination in the south but to a system of criminal punishment where infringements can lead to the loss of certain rights and privileges and frequent infringements can lead to permanent loss of those rights and privileges.In my opinion both sides are, roughly, treated equally with regards to these. The fact that most of those with limited access are creationist is more due to their readiness to return and their frequent infringements than to a pro-evolution bias.Can you point out to us a thread on the science fora where a creationist has made a solid and convincing scientific argument supporting their position, or even in real life? If not then when it comes to scientific debate it is always going to be knives to a gunfight until the creationists/IDists make an effort to have a solid scientific basis for their hypotheses.Maybe such a basis has already been developed, but I've never seen any evidence of it here on EvC and I haven't seen any evidence of it in the wider world either.TTFN,WK

Well it seems that my opinion of the class divide is not in sync with Admin's. I still stick by mine.There are 2 classes here, the working class and the 'criminal' class; the creationists are overrepresented in the latter.TTFN,WK

I guess you can do a lot of damage even at a gunfight with a knife, provided you are crazy enough.TTFN,WK

So when you say 'ID folks' you mean creationists, its good to know we are all on the same page.TTFN,WKp.s. If you think the rendition of 'Randman's greatest hits' currently being played in Showcase is a substantial and scientific debate then you have clearly never come across an actual substantial and scientific debate.Edited by Wounded King, : No reason given.

The best of luck with overcoming whatever problems have come your way Holmes.We will miss you in your absence.TTFN,WK