That humanist attitude includes the notion that everybody has the right to free speech. Now, I understand that Ray being permanently banned from these forums would not impact his freedom of speech in the sense that he could continue to post at alternative forums, but it would impact the humanist attitude of the EvC forum in showing that our reaction to a dissenting, annoying, maddening voice is to shut it up.
Percy has made it clear that he considers EvC elitist, and wants to constantly raise the bar. It is not that Ray's voice is dissenting or annoying, it is that he draws threads off topic and then insults those that are of differing opinion to him.
Free speech issues in US law of course only apply to Congress, not private citizens. And speech is still moderated even then. No incitement to violence/terror and no shouting fire in crowded theatres etc.
If the moderator team here is Congress then we avoid silencing those that simply disagree with us - eg NJ (we even get them in congress!). However we take steps to prevent some members disrupting the service when they are being disrespectful or drawing things off topic.
In this case 'Congress' has allowed Ray to set up his own 'nation' within this 'nation' where he makes up the moderation procedures, but prevented him from {entering theatres and yelling fire} or {running into a school and screaming obscenities} (or going off topic and being disrespectful in main debate threads). We still allow him to petition the 'Government' for a redress of grievances (see this thread).
I do not know much about the background of this argument. But I must say that if I were to be confined to a "special" forum described as a "sandbox" as though I were a child, I would not post here again.
Ray, randman et al have the option of ceasing posting. Before the Showcase they did not have that option (it was forced upon them). Now they have the choice of posting or not. This gives them an opportunity to demonstrate a change in ability to follow the rules they were once breaking. This shows a belief in the ability of people to become productive citizens (which is humanism at its best!)
I agree with Ray that a permanent restriction to the "sandbox" forum is unfair and does not reflect well on the "liberal thinking" of the moderators.
Some people were prepared to sacrifice productive debate to tackle randman, Ray et al. However, it would be unfair to allow those members to disrupt the debates others were having where they did not want to make that sacrifice.
There is then few solutions which would be completely fair in a sense. We have effectively allowed them to have their own forum to post their views, whilst actually being banned from the main board. This is like giving prisoners with a public interest a newspaper column with which to air their controversial opinions without fear of further prosecution.
We are open minded enough to entertain the idea that us evil Darwinists banned them because we know their arguments are irrefutable. Rather than censor them outright we allow them to say as much and to post their arguments for those who are interested.
As Percy says, it is not a perfect system, and there may be a better one. Suggestions welcomed.
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