Sin

I never said that God doesnt do anything...where do you get this from?

Phat writes: I never said that God doesnt do anything...where do you get this from?

You're taking the blame for everything bad that happens, aren't you?

You're taking the blame for everything bad that happens, aren't you?

No, but I play a part. Whether humans have "original" or inborn tendencies to "sin" or not, we are in fact responsible for our actions and reactions. If Jesus does in fact absolve us of our sins, it does not mean that we are passive observers. You may assert that lacking evidence of Jesus role in the process God becomes spiritually impotent --a valid argument for an atheist/agnostic, I suppose.

The bottom line, however, is that we become the decisions that we make.

To be fair, I dont take all of the responsibility for anything bad that happens in my life nor do I take all of the credit for the good that is produced.

Lets call it a communion. For me, it is between God and willing humanity. For you, it may simply be a communion among humanity.

perhaps you have never been "crushed" yet.

Phat writes: perhaps you have never been "crushed" yet.

Can't say that I have. But also I have no idea what being crushed is and what it's got to do with this god thing. Why would god allow someone to be 'crushed?'

Edited by Tangle, : No reason given.

Sin?

Fuggitaboutit, it's none of your business.

Phat writes: If Jesus does in fact absolve us of our sins, it does not mean that we are passive observers.

Doesn't it? Where's the "communion" if we make our own decisions and Jesus/God decides to forgive us? Seems like two separate processes to me.

I had to look up other peoples perspectives on this issue. In the final analysis, it is human consensus on whether or not God exists and our role as humans in the process of communion that takes place.
Faith Forum: Why does God let us make bad decisions?

Of course, the way that I learned was that God took the sins of the world upon Himself so as to absolve us of the consequences...which were out of hand from the beginning.
Critics (such as you) would argue that God caused the liability in the first place....almost like shooting someone and then becoming their Doctor to patch them back up! One could argue that no God is necessary in order for humans to experience challenges and setbacks in life...but the question then becomes whether or not God is ever actually necessary!

You seem to have concluded that there is no evidence that a God exists, then commenting on the nature and character of the God whom humans market---insisting that the book (should)be taken seriously in order to indict the God within its pages.

Phat writes: You seem to have concluded that there is no evidence that a God exists....

As I keep telling you, I see no evidence of a "communion". If God was important, why wouldn't there be some improvement in the people who think He's important?

Phat writes: ... insisting that the book (should)be taken seriously in order to indict the God within its pages.

Characters like Jesus don't even exist outside its pages. Why cherry-pick what you like and ignore what you don't?

ringo writes: Why cherry-pick what you like and ignore what you don't?

because the whole point (or idea) of a book is human interpretation and consensus of the topic within. What difference does it make if we interpret God the way we see Him today rather than simply go with the interpretation of thousands of years ago?

I'm not saying we are any closer to the truth, but no further from it either.\

Go ahead...give Him your best shot. Invent/describe a God Who created all seen and unseen, chooses to basically leave us alone and let us "grow up", and is not directly responsible for evil.

Characters like Jesus don't even exist outside its pages.

Perhaps not in your mind.
Remember, evidence cannot count in these cases since the character that we are seeking is for all practical purposes invisible.

Phat writes: Go ahead...give Him your best shot. Invent/describe a God Who created all seen and unseen, chooses to basically leave us alone and let us "grow up", and is not directly responsible for evil.

Why. Why give God a free pass?

Edited by jar, : appalin spallin

Phat writes: In the final analysis, it is human consensus on whether or not God exists

Eh? Cobblers. God exists or doesn't exist regardless of a human consensus or otherwise.

and our role as humans in the process of communion that takes place.

This is just religious gobbledegook. I never understand any of this in-house jargon and I suspect no-one does - you just get used to spouting it.

Edited by Tangle, : No reason given.

Just took a look at this thread and find you wrongly imputing a quote to me again, this time something Phat said. How does this happen? I don't even think I've ever posted to this thread.

Faith writes: Just took a look at this thread and find you wrongly imputing a quote to me again, this time something Phat said. How does this happen? I don't even think I've ever posted to this thread.

My apologies, I've changed the post.

Why does it happen? Probably because I'd just replied to a post you made and still have you in my head.

Phat writes: because the whole point (or idea) of a book is human interpretation and consensus of the topic within.

What consensus? That's the problem with making it up to suit yourself. No two people have the same interpretation.

Phat writes: Go ahead...give Him your best shot. Invent/describe a God Who created all seen and unseen, chooses to basically leave us alone and let us "grow up", and is not directly responsible for evil.

How is that possible? Isn't evil part of "all seen and unseen"?

Phat writes: ringo writes: Characters like Jesus don't even exist outside its pages. Perhaps not in your mind.

Not in reality.

Phat writes: Remember, evidence cannot count in these cases since the character that we are seeking is for all practical purposes invisible.

Evidence always counts.

But you're missing the point. You believe in Jesus but the only place Jesus exists is in the Book. You choose to believe that part of the Book, but you throw away the parts you don't like. On what basis do you believe in the Jesus of the Bible but not the God of the Bible?