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Author Topic:   Immaterial "Evidence"
mike the wiz
Member (Idle past 105 days)
Posts: 4755
From: u.k
Joined: 05-24-2003


Message 18 of 154 (519772)
08-17-2009 5:46 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by Straggler
07-26-2009 5:40 PM


Re: Why The
I have "evidence" that my prayers come true, because it follows that when I pray, usually their is an answer, and MOSTLY it is impressive by any person's criteria. People may deny it, but when confronted with answered prayer, I doubt they would dismiss this personal experience.
I have also felt the presence of God, the Holy Spirit. This should not "follow" given it is made up, and especially a powerful encounter. It should not follow that if I praise God in a commited way, that the Spirit should come upon me. it should not follow that I woke up one day with a different language going through my head. It should not follow that God obtained a brand new car for my sick parents when there was no hope whatsoever. (this was two days after the prayer request). It should not follow that when I had depression, the spirit of God came upon me, removed the depression, and went, in about 30 seconds. (I suffer from anxiety and depression, so it would be foolish to mention any things such as self-healing as I am well experienced in not having the power to do one bloody thing when I am depressed, other than fight off the urge to break my skull with a brick).
It should not follow that any of this FEW examples should follow if God is true.
If God is true, it should follow only if a personal God who requires the person to humble themselves before revelation, exists.
You can argue until blue in the face, but any man/woman who would reject a genuine experience, genuine prayer, genuine fellowship, is a very rare and strange person.
Kind regards, mike.
ps. All of these things, as the Gospel indicates, should follow. would you really believe that it would be a coincidence that only the things the Gospel mentions, happen to me, such as the gifts of the Spirit, fellowship, the Holy Spirit coming upon people, etc....
At times, infact even now, I would prefer no results whatsoever, in order so that I could decide for certain whether God exists or not - but guess what, there are even more testimonies than mine, and they are much more incredible, and they are true, but they are real in that they have physical consequences. You represent it as all in the mind but I tell you with 100% truth everything I have said has happened, and MORE, and can happen for you also. But God will never play it your way. Firstly, to God - you have the sinful nature, YOU must come before God, and repent, THEN you can experience this "coincidence" for yourself and see if you can reject it.
Why is it so hard to believe that if God exists, He could not get involved in His own creation, given WHO he is?
If God exists, it follows that amazing things can happen, exciting things, true things.
Edited by mike the wiz, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Straggler, posted 07-26-2009 5:40 PM Straggler has seen this message but not replied

  
mike the wiz
Member (Idle past 105 days)
Posts: 4755
From: u.k
Joined: 05-24-2003


Message 19 of 154 (519773)
08-17-2009 6:09 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by Straggler
07-26-2009 5:40 PM


Re: Why The
I know that you can dismiss me as crazy. Afterall, I have language in my head, and depression, etc..
That's okay. You do that. But know this - you can't win. In the end, all that matters is the truth. Deep down Straggler, you know the truth but you're trying to convince yourself otherwise. Why do you kick against the pricks. (mikey for example, being one of them )
In the end, you can come up with clever, elaborate explanations. You can come up with natural explanations, just like with animals, just like with the Creation. You can always conclude this - God even makes it possible for you to explain Him away, as He will "give you" your desire, like he gavce the children of Israel what they wanted to eat when they thought they knew better than God.
But you won't find peace.
The truth is, like you I searched for all of the explanations to explain God away.
I would, with my reasoning mind, say that my prayers are post-hoc reasoning and confirmation bias, that it is wishful thinking and self-induced placebo. I would say that the car is post hoc ergo propter hoc display. I would say that there are experiments showing that religious experience is generic and can be replicated in the lab.
I could say all that and have said those things in the past, but guess what - in the end all of that is an utter joke compared to the truth, and is foolishness, because it handwaves away true wisdom, which was harder to achieve than assimilating a set of objections.
The Spirit of God divides the marrow. You can't beat God.
i will now leave this place. Goodbye for now.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Straggler, posted 07-26-2009 5:40 PM Straggler has seen this message but not replied

  
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