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Author Topic:   What does ID theory say?
DevilsAdvocate
Member (Idle past 3122 days)
Posts: 1548
Joined: 06-05-2008


Message 39 of 67 (488680)
11-14-2008 7:36 PM
Reply to: Message 25 by Cold Foreign Object
11-13-2008 2:01 PM


Re: Design theory
1. Before 1859 the special creation hypothesis was held true by science; therefore Creationism is a scientific explanation-interpretation of evidence. Darwin was able to convince most of his scientific peers that the hypothesis was erroneous and that his transmutation hypothesis correct. This fact renders your blanket assertion that Creationism to not be testable to be false based on the fact that science before Darwin 1859 held Creationism to be true.
This is a logical fallacy based on an appeal to belief. The majority of the population at that time also believed that blood-letting was an effective medical procedure that does not make it true.
This "special creation hypothesis" you are talking about was the defacto religious world view by the Christian world from the time of Jesus to the mid-20th century. It was not recognized as a "hypothesis" of science per se, but instead it was a adopted on its value of being part of what they interpreted was "the inspired word of God". That is, it was adopted not as a result of scientific evidence but was instead adopted on the basis of the faith of the believer. However, the increase in critical thinking and reasoning in the post-renaissance world caused many scientific minds (not just Darwin) to question this world view. For example, James Hutton, the founding father of modern geology in the 18th and 19th century observed clear evidence that reflected the old age of the Earth. Much older than 3-4 thousand years that the Christian world had previously thought.
Edited by DevilsAdvocate, : No reason given.

"For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring." Dr. Carl Sagan

This message is a reply to:
 Message 25 by Cold Foreign Object, posted 11-13-2008 2:01 PM Cold Foreign Object has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 42 by subbie, posted 11-14-2008 7:48 PM DevilsAdvocate has replied
 Message 50 by Cold Foreign Object, posted 11-15-2008 6:32 PM DevilsAdvocate has not replied

  
DevilsAdvocate
Member (Idle past 3122 days)
Posts: 1548
Joined: 06-05-2008


Message 43 of 67 (488684)
11-14-2008 8:02 PM
Reply to: Message 38 by Cold Foreign Object
11-14-2008 7:32 PM


Re: Design theory
So are these folks fundamentalists or atheists?
False dichotomy.
I believe this was a legitimate question and not an assertion. Questions do not fall under the rules of logical fallacies.
Edited by DevilsAdvocate, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 38 by Cold Foreign Object, posted 11-14-2008 7:32 PM Cold Foreign Object has not replied

  
DevilsAdvocate
Member (Idle past 3122 days)
Posts: 1548
Joined: 06-05-2008


Message 44 of 67 (488685)
11-14-2008 8:08 PM
Reply to: Message 42 by subbie
11-14-2008 7:48 PM


Re: Design theory
This is not entirely accurate. In fact, most scientists proceeded on the basis of a creation hypothesis, but then attempted to conduct genuine scientific investigation for evidence in support of the hypothesis. While certainly one can criticize much of what passed for science 150 years ago, in particular if one compares it with science of today, it is a fact that many genuine scientists of the time did genuine scientific work to try to support the hypothesis of creation. It was in large part because that work was fruitless, and often pointed in different directions, that the creation hypothesis was rejected as scientifically unsupported.
I agree. I probably didn't phrase this exactly the way I understand it. Yes, many pre-modern scientists i.e. Newton, Galileo, etc worked off the premis that the universe was divinely created. My point is that there was no alternative theory of how the universe could have come into existence according to their worldview. It is as you said, only by digging deeper into the inner mechanics of the universe i.e. a geo-centric solar system vice a helo-centric one or discovering the old age of the earth, that these early scientists began to discover that the actual science did not match their previous religious beliefs.

"For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring." Dr. Carl Sagan

This message is a reply to:
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