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Author Topic:   Adding information to the genome.
LucyTheApe
Inactive Member


Message 146 of 280 (534229)
11-06-2009 4:05 AM
Reply to: Message 145 by Coyote
11-05-2009 5:47 PM


Re: Willfully...
That has led to the whole field of #%$&%%## "science," which seeks to shoehorn those beliefs into some semblance of scientific language in order to allow #%$&%%##s to continue to believe that science corroborates their beliefs when the exact opposite is more often the case.


There no doubt exist natural laws, but once this fine reason of ours was corrupted, it corrupted everything.

blɛz paskal


This message is a reply to:
 Message 145 by Coyote, posted 11-05-2009 5:47 PM Coyote has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 147 by Huntard, posted 11-06-2009 4:30 AM LucyTheApe has responded

  
LucyTheApe
Inactive Member


Message 148 of 280 (534234)
11-06-2009 5:29 AM
Reply to: Message 147 by Huntard
11-06-2009 4:30 AM


Re: Willfully...
Huntard writes:

Yes, creation and creationist, that's what Coyote said. No need to repeat that. And creationism isn't a bad word, no need to censor it....

Huntard, do you believe that information systems evolve solely as a natural process, or do you know they do?

Does energy and matter create themselves purely as natural process? Is that what you believe or do you know it to be the case?

Can you show me how rocks turned into humans, or is that just a belief?

How strong is your belief in science, will you still believe tomorrow?

Do you believe that what you believe is a belief?


There no doubt exist natural laws, but once this fine reason of ours was corrupted, it corrupted everything.

blɛz paskal


This message is a reply to:
 Message 147 by Huntard, posted 11-06-2009 4:30 AM Huntard has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 149 by Huntard, posted 11-06-2009 6:07 AM LucyTheApe has responded
 Message 150 by Percy, posted 11-06-2009 7:26 AM LucyTheApe has not yet responded

  
LucyTheApe
Inactive Member


Message 151 of 280 (534245)
11-06-2009 7:28 AM
Reply to: Message 149 by Huntard
11-06-2009 6:07 AM


Re: Willfully...
Hantard writes:

Ape writes:

Huntard, do you believe that information systems evolve solely as a natural process, or do you know they do?

they evolve solely by natural processes, simply because if something evolves, it is a natural process.

And then Huntard writes:

I have not seen any information system come about without anything natural either.

You're not answering the question, your begging it. Just answer the question honestly. Do you believe natural laws produce information systems. And if so how?

Then you flip an adjective into a noun without suspecting that I'll see your dishonesty.

Huntard writes:

Ape writes:

Does energy and matter create themselves purely as natural process?

What has that got to do with anything? And yes, they do. Energy turns into matter and matter into energy all by itself.

It's got everything to do with everything. I'm not talking about conservation, I'm talking about creation. Does matter create itself?

Huntard writes:

LTA writes:

Is that what you believe or do you know it to be the case?

So far all evidence points to the fact that it does.

Or do you interpret bits of the evidence to fit what you believe?

Huntard writes:

LTA writes:

Can you show me how rocks turned into humans, or is that just a belief?

If that is what you think happened, then yes, that is a belief. An erroneous one at that.

So you don't believe the whole theory, just the parts that you want to believe.

Huntard writes:

Yes. Beliefs are beliefs. I don't hold too many of them though.


There no doubt exist natural laws, but once this fine reason of ours was corrupted, it corrupted everything.

blɛz paskal


This message is a reply to:
 Message 149 by Huntard, posted 11-06-2009 6:07 AM Huntard has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 154 by Percy, posted 11-06-2009 7:56 AM LucyTheApe has responded
 Message 156 by Huntard, posted 11-06-2009 8:16 AM LucyTheApe has not yet responded

  
LucyTheApe
Inactive Member


Message 235 of 280 (536170)
11-20-2009 8:05 AM
Reply to: Message 154 by Percy
11-06-2009 7:56 AM


Re: Willfully...
Percy writes:

Reality *is* an information system.

It's a bit metaphysical Percy! But logically:

R -> I
~I -> ~R
Entropy is imaginary.

Honestly, I think we need to do a whole new thread on information.

Edited by LucyTheApe, : l


There no doubt exist natural laws, but once this fine reason of ours was corrupted, it corrupted everything.

blɛz paskal


This message is a reply to:
 Message 154 by Percy, posted 11-06-2009 7:56 AM Percy has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 236 by Wounded King, posted 11-20-2009 8:21 AM LucyTheApe has not yet responded
 Message 237 by Percy, posted 11-20-2009 8:48 AM LucyTheApe has responded

  
LucyTheApe
Inactive Member


Message 238 of 280 (536175)
11-20-2009 9:17 AM
Reply to: Message 237 by Percy
11-20-2009 8:48 AM


Re: Willfully...
one on one in a new thread.


There no doubt exist natural laws, but once this fine reason of ours was corrupted, it corrupted everything.

blɛz paskal


This message is a reply to:
 Message 237 by Percy, posted 11-20-2009 8:48 AM Percy has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 239 by Percy, posted 11-20-2009 5:12 PM LucyTheApe has responded

  
LucyTheApe
Inactive Member


Message 275 of 280 (543081)
01-15-2010 8:53 AM
Reply to: Message 239 by Percy
11-20-2009 5:12 PM


Re: Willfully...
Percy writes:

I said that Shannon didn't conduct experiments to develop information theory, not that he never conducted any experiments ever. Information theory is a mathematical, not an experimental, science, but it does have real world applications.

Good Percy, we don't need the scientific method. I see your a real scientist at heart.

Percy writes:

That is precisely the point, that information theory is not concerned with meaning. If you're talking about meaning then you're not talking about information theory.

No your right, I'm talking about information science.

Percy writes:

No, that's how you defined information. I inquired how you were calculating the amount of information in your program, and you replied like this:

LTA writes:

If you want to know how I calculated the information content then just compile the following files..


So did you?
The human brain is amazing. I can start talking to you in Spanish and you might have no idea what I'm talking about. But we adjust. You understand that I am trying to convey some information but you don't understand the code. Then we start talking slowly and/or use our body language. When I was a bit younger I journeyed the the Himalayas, I didn't know their language but I could communicate easily.

You say that reality is information; what kind of a statement is that?

You enquire:

Percy writes:

I presume you didn't just make them up, so where did they come from?

They come from a set of standards. I want to juggle a few objects, I need to conform to the language of the processor, a standard. The "shell" of the program informs the processor of the addressess where it should start loading and how much space it needs to allocate to the process.

The next set of instructions juggle the first lot of objects and the additional information juggles the second.

But of course we're talking about a binary machine, boring, lets talk about a machine that has a base FOUR system but also has 'fussy logic'.

Percy writes:

Well, okay, yes, you have argued with it, but that log23 is 1.585 bits, and that DNA uses 12 bits to represent these 1.585 bits, and that the difference between them is 10.415 bits, are mathematical facts as undeniable as 2+2=4. You can argue if you like, but not rationally.

--Percy


Yes Percy I'll attempt the argument.


There no doubt exist natural laws, but once this fine reason of ours was corrupted, it corrupted everything.

blɛz paskal


This message is a reply to:
 Message 239 by Percy, posted 11-20-2009 5:12 PM Percy has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 276 by Percy, posted 01-15-2010 10:22 AM LucyTheApe has not yet responded

  
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