Size of the universe

Dr Jones, note the ABE which I added to my message.

What does that have to do with your claim that the math is incompatible with reality and my request that you show how the math is wrong?Please show where the math is wrong, show your work.

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It's not enough to bash in heads, you've got to bash in minds
soon I discovered that this rock thing was true
Jerry Lee Lewis was the devil
Jesus was an architect previous to his career as a prophet
All of a sudden i found myself in love with the world
And so there was only one thing I could do
Was ding a ding dang my dang along ling long - Jesus Built my Hotrod Ministry
Live every week like it's Shark Week! - Tracey Jordan
Just a monkey in a long line of kings. - Matthew Good
If "elitist" just means "not the dumbest motherfucker in the room", I'll be an elitist! - Get Your War On
*not an actual doctor

I was merely evaluating the priori and the conclusions of the math relative to which life meaning priory and conclusion is the more plausible one realistically.Methinks Admin Moose is already getting antsy about topic. It's time to move on.

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BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The Immeasurable Present Eternally Extends the Infinite Past And Infinitely Consumes The Eternal Future.
Time Relates To What Is Temperal. What Is Eternal Is Timeless.

So you're unable to substantiate your claim: Run along then Buz, rest assured we recognize that you've been beaten even when you don't.

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It's not enough to bash in heads, you've got to bash in minds
soon I discovered that this rock thing was true
Jerry Lee Lewis was the devil
Jesus was an architect previous to his career as a prophet
All of a sudden i found myself in love with the world
And so there was only one thing I could do
Was ding a ding dang my dang along ling long - Jesus Built my Hotrod Ministry
Live every week like it's Shark Week! - Tracey Jordan
Just a monkey in a long line of kings. - Matthew Good
If "elitist" just means "not the dumbest motherfucker in the room", I'll be an elitist! - Get Your War On
*not an actual doctor

I wrote: "Do you believe it was 50+ billion light years in size within a second after the Big Bang?"jar wrote: "No idea, but that simply has no meaning anyway."How can you say that question has no meaning. Cosmological Inflation (that the universe expanded to 75% of its current size within a split second of the Big Bang) was conceived to try to answer the classic conundrum of the Big Bang cosmology: why does the universe appear flat, homogeneous and isotropic in accordance with the cosmological principle when one would expect, on the basis of the physics of the Big Bang, a highly curved, heterogeneous universe? Inflation also explains the origin of the large-scale structure of the cosmos.Do you believe in the Big Bang Theory without Inflation, the Big Bang Theory with Inflation, or some other theory concerning the formation of the universe?

I say it has no meaning because you have not yet explained what you mean by this Universe.How do you measure size before there is something to measure?

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Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

I wrote: "Do you believe in the Big Bang Theory without Inflation, the Big Bang Theory with Inflation, or some other theory concerning the formation of the universe?"jar wrote: "I say it has no meaning because you have not yet explained what you mean by this Universe."The word "universe" is commonly defined as the totality of all physical matter and energy.So, do you believe in the Big Bang Theory without Inflation, the Big Bang Theory with Inflation, or some other theory concerning the formation of all physical matter and energy?"

Okay. Well there was no matter until sometime into the expansion and I'm not sure how to measure what was there before there was matter. I don't believe in any of them. The evidence though seems to show inflation.But again, how do you measure size before there is any matter?

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Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

Where do you get this crap? The Observable Universe ended up with a radius of about *10cm* following inflation - nothing remarkable about that until you realise how quickly it achieved that size following the Big Bang itself.As for the entire Universe, given that we have no idea how big it is, we have no idea how big it was prior to inflation nor post inflation. There is a good chance it is infinite, in which case it was the same size prior and post.Hint: Jar is entirely correct in pointig out that what you are talking about has little to no meaning. Perhaps if you were to recast your question in terms of scale factors, we may be on to a winner. Consider it a small homework assignment.

Cavediver says this is crap and I will believe him well before you. I have been trying to research this , but I can find nothing that agrees with this statement.Where did you come up with this? Please give us the fundie site you got this from.Now like Jar, I, as I am sure others, have an issue with your use of the word believe. The science, reality, minded people don't have the belief you claim they do. As Jar stated, the evidence supports inflation.You, like many fundies, feel a need to conflate religious belief with scientific knowledge. They are not the same thing. No matter how much you want to claim it is so, it is not.

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Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

quote:

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The Observable Universe ended up with a radius of about *10cm* following inflation

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Can you give more info on this, or point me to some? The last time I walked through this, the earliest figure after inflation I have for the OU is 3-5 billion light years. This ten centimeters is making me horny for some book larnin again.Phillip's still profoundly wrong, regardless. But that shouldn't keep us from getting something out of this conv should it?

Sure, this is about a second after inflation - looking back on my post I realise I quoted the wrong part of Philip's posts, and I was trying to point out that inflation in no way resulted in a "universe" that big.Here's a useful, if somewhat loose diagram: Source: hereAs you can see, inflation leaves the Observable Universe with a radius of around 10⁰m, at a time of around 10^-33s. At around 1 sec, the radius has *slowly* increased to around 10²⁰m, which is about 10,000 lyrs.Again, talking about physical distance is largely meaningless and renders the effect of inflation essentially invisiblle. We need to talk about scale factors to appreciate what is going on.Edited by cavediver, : No reason given.Edited by Admin, : Fix image link.

Hi Philip,Since the diameter of the observable universe grew from effectively 0 light years about 13.7 billion years to about 93 billion light years today, there must have been a time when its size was the same as whatever size Biblical literalists want to claim for it. And you want to characterize this mathematical necessity as a point of agreement between science and Biblical literalism?There *are* some actual points of agreement between astronomy and Biblical literalists. For example, the Bible says the Earth has a sun and a moon, and astronomers agree. The Bible notes that there are stars, and astronomers agree.--Percy

"Even a broken clock is right twice a day."

Percy wrote: "Since the diameter of the observable universe grew from effectively 0 light years about 13.7 billion years to about 93 billion light years today."Are you of the opinion that nothing can go faster than the speed of light? Is the radius of the universe increasing by at most 1 light year every year since nothing can go faster than the speed of light?