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Author Topic:   Non-scientific evidence
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2126 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


Message 60 of 98 (560255)
05-14-2010 12:08 AM
Reply to: Message 57 by Pauline
05-13-2010 11:18 PM


Re: Stage 2
What you are doing, though you might pretend otherwise, is nothing more than religious apologetics--theology in disguise.
And as Heinlein noted:

Theology is never any help; it is searching in a dark cellar at midnight for a black cat that isn't there. Theologians can persuade themselves of anything.
Robert A. Heinlein, JOB: A Comedy of Justice, 1984

Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 57 by Pauline, posted 05-13-2010 11:18 PM Pauline has not replied

Coyote
Member (Idle past 2126 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


Message 81 of 98 (564560)
06-10-2010 11:51 PM
Reply to: Message 80 by Jzyehoshua
06-10-2010 11:44 PM


Re: No McDowell Citations
McDowell's point is just that rather than trying to decide in a controlled environment whether Jesus could turn water into wine, we should be looking at the manuscript evidence for the New Testament, the internal consistency for the Bible (does it contradict itself, and are the witnesses reliable?), and whether there are corroborating external sources supporting what it says, such as archeology or mentions in ancient literature.
Actually, what you seem to be advocating is better described as religious apologetics or creation "science" than real science.
When it comes to religious belief, evidence plays no role. Contrary evidence is either ignored, denied, or misrepresented.
See most any post by Buzsaw for examples.

Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 80 by Jzyehoshua, posted 06-10-2010 11:44 PM Jzyehoshua has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 82 by Jzyehoshua, posted 06-11-2010 12:05 AM Coyote has replied
 Message 83 by Jzyehoshua, posted 06-11-2010 12:28 AM Coyote has not replied

Coyote
Member (Idle past 2126 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


Message 84 of 98 (564568)
06-11-2010 12:29 AM
Reply to: Message 82 by Jzyehoshua
06-11-2010 12:05 AM


Re: No McDowell Citations
coyote writes:
When it comes to religious belief, evidence plays no role. Contrary evidence is either ignored, denied, or misrepresented.
Jzyehoshua writes:
long post quoting scripture
To support my statement, look at the biblical claim of a global flood, which biblical scholars place at about 4,350 years ago.
Contrary evidence--that is, evidence that shows the flood did not happen as described--is either ignored, denied, or misrepresented.
No amount of scripture quoting will change this one simple problem--the story of a global flood about 4,350 years ago is a myth. But, as I point out, evidence does not matter.

Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 82 by Jzyehoshua, posted 06-11-2010 12:05 AM Jzyehoshua has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 86 by Jzyehoshua, posted 06-11-2010 12:54 AM Coyote has replied

Coyote
Member (Idle past 2126 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


Message 90 of 98 (564574)
06-11-2010 1:35 AM
Reply to: Message 86 by Jzyehoshua
06-11-2010 12:54 AM


Scientific evidence
I would be interested in hearing what this contrary evidence involves.
Here is one quick one:
Biblical scholars place the flood at about 4,350 years ago. For deposits of that age you look to soils, not geological formations; bones, not fossils.
More precisely, you look for soil deposits that are about 4,350 years old. Fortunately, those are pretty much everywhere. Your backyard is a good place to find soils of that age.
And who deals with that time period? Archaeologists for the most part. (Me, for example. And thousands of my colleagues around the world.)
And what we have found in dealing with the general time period of 4,350 years ago is continuity--continuity of human cultures, fauna and flora, mtDNA, and sedimentation.
We would have none of those things if there was a global flood at that time period.
What we would have then would be erosional and depositional features. For examples of those, google "channeled scablands" and see what much smaller and much older floods leave behind.
So, don't bother telling me about Pangea, the Cambrian explosion, volcanic eruptions, or fossils. If you want to present evidence of a global flood, better make it in the proper time frame.

Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 86 by Jzyehoshua, posted 06-11-2010 12:54 AM Jzyehoshua has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 92 by Jzyehoshua, posted 06-11-2010 1:48 AM Coyote has not replied

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