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Author Topic:   Ignorant, stupid or insane? (Or maybe wicked?)
Minnemooseus
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Posts: 3945
From: Duluth, Minnesota, U.S. (West end of Lake Superior)
Joined: 11-11-2001
Member Rating: 10.0


Message 49 of 89 (586054)
10-10-2010 10:07 PM
Reply to: Message 42 by Bikerman
08-12-2010 6:18 AM


Behe's a theistic evolutionist
Most people will know that Behe is apparently convinced that irreducible complexity demolishes evolution and he has claimed, over the years, to have found several examples of an irreducibly complex structure in an organism - the most famous being the cilia.
I think Behe is a theistic evolutionist and accepts the bulk of the theory of evolution. In a debate with Kenneth Miller, Behe stated that he accepts that man and the other great apes evolved from a common ancestor.
Behe apparently thinks that God had some subtle guiding hand in evolution. His pursuit of irreducible complexity examples is his search for God's fingerprints.
I still find it mysterious that he feels the need to find those fingerprints.
Moose

This message is a reply to:
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Minnemooseus
Member
Posts: 3945
From: Duluth, Minnesota, U.S. (West end of Lake Superior)
Joined: 11-11-2001
Member Rating: 10.0


Message 54 of 89 (586589)
10-14-2010 2:57 AM


Henry Morris, founder of the Institute for Creation Research
Something I originally posted at the Kenneth R. Miller - Finding Darwin's God topic:
Food for thought - a quote from the book (pp. 172-173):
quote:
Are such opponents of evolution sincere? Several years ago, I was invited to Tampa, Florida, to debate the issue of evolution with Henry Morris, founder of the Institute for Creation Research and one of the most influential of the young-earth creationists. The debate had been occasioned by the passage of a curriculum mandating the inclusion of so-called creation science in high school biology. In front of a large audience, I hammered Morris repeatedly with the many errors of "flood geology" and did my best to show the enormous weight of scientific evidence behind evolution. One never knows how such a debate goes, but the local science teachers in attendance were jubilant that I scored a scientific victory.17
As luck would have it, the organizers of this event had booked rooms for both Dr. Morris and myself in a local motel. When I walked into the coffee shop the next morning, I noticed Morris at a table by himself finishing breakfast. Flushed with confidence from the debate, I asked if I might join him. The elderly Morris was a bit shaken, but he agreed. I ordered a nice breakfast, and then got right to the point. "Do you actually believe all this stuff?"
I suppose I might have expected a wink and a nod. We had both been paid for our debate appearances, and perhaps I expected him to acknowledge that he made a pretty good living from the creation business. He did nothing of the sort. Henry Morris made it clear to me that he believed everything he had said the night before. "But Dr. Morris, so much of what you argued is wrong, starting with the age of the earth!" Morris had been unable to answer the geological data on the earth's age I had presented the night before, and it had badly damaged his credibility with the audience. Nonetheless, he looked me straight in the eyes. "Ken, you're intelligent, you're well-meaning, and you're energetic. But you are also young, and you don't realize what's at stake. In a question of such importance, scientific data aren't the ultimate authority. Even you know that science is wrong sometimes."
Indeed I did. Morris continued so that I could get a feeling for what that ultimate authority was. "Scripture tells us what the right conclusion is. And if science, momentarily, doesn't agree with it, then we have to keep working until we get the right answer. But I have no doubts as to what that answer will be." Morris then excused himself, and I was left to ponder what he had said. I had sat down thinking the man a charlatan, but I left appreciating the depth, the power; and the sincerity of his convictions. Nonetheless, however one might admire Morris's strength of character; convictions that allow science to be bent beyond recognition are not merely unjustified - they are dangerous in the intellectual and even in the moral sense, because they corrupt and compromise the integrity of human reason.
My impromptu breakfast with Henry Morris taught me an important lesson-the appeal of creationism is emotional, not scientific. I might be able to lay out graphs and charts and diagrams, to cite laboratory experiments and field observations, to describe the details of one evolutionary sequence after another; but to the true believers of creationism, these would all be sound and fury, signifying nothing. The truth would always be somewhere else.
Religious beliefs so strong that perceptions of reality must be wrong. Ignorant, stupid or insane deluded? I would call it deluded.
Moose

  
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