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Practical Prodigy
Junior Member (Idle past 3184 days)
Posts: 30
From: IN, USA
Joined: 06-30-2010


Message 1 of 60 (567304)
06-30-2010 2:53 PM


Im new to C vs E. Hope to add useful debate ;P
Replies to this message:
 Message 2 by AZPaul3, posted 06-30-2010 2:56 PM Practical Prodigy has not yet responded
 Message 3 by New Cat's Eye, posted 06-30-2010 3:06 PM Practical Prodigy has responded
 Message 4 by Huntard, posted 06-30-2010 3:08 PM Practical Prodigy has not yet responded

    
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 4132
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 2 of 60 (567307)
06-30-2010 2:56 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Practical Prodigy
06-30-2010 2:53 PM


Welcome
So then jump in someplace and get to it.

Welcome aboard.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Practical Prodigy, posted 06-30-2010 2:53 PM Practical Prodigy has not yet responded

  
New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member


Message 3 of 60 (567311)
06-30-2010 3:06 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Practical Prodigy
06-30-2010 2:53 PM


Hello.

Why don't you describe yourself and position to us?

The typical stuff... atheist/theist, creationist/evolutionist?

What are you most and least knowledgeable about?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Practical Prodigy, posted 06-30-2010 2:53 PM Practical Prodigy has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 5 by Practical Prodigy, posted 06-30-2010 4:15 PM New Cat's Eye has responded

  
Huntard
Member (Idle past 466 days)
Posts: 2870
From: Limburg, The Netherlands
Joined: 09-02-2008


Message 4 of 60 (567314)
06-30-2010 3:08 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Practical Prodigy
06-30-2010 2:53 PM


Welcome to EvC!
This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Practical Prodigy, posted 06-30-2010 2:53 PM Practical Prodigy has not yet responded

    
Practical Prodigy
Junior Member (Idle past 3184 days)
Posts: 30
From: IN, USA
Joined: 06-30-2010


Message 5 of 60 (567329)
06-30-2010 4:15 PM
Reply to: Message 3 by New Cat's Eye
06-30-2010 3:06 PM


About Me
I'm a theist, I believe in Theistic evolution.

I am most knowledgable about physics, followed by biology, then chemistry. I have an Associates Degree in Applied Science (CIT) and a Bachelors Degree in Applied Science (Forensics). Does that sum it up


This message is a reply to:
 Message 3 by New Cat's Eye, posted 06-30-2010 3:06 PM New Cat's Eye has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 6 by New Cat's Eye, posted 06-30-2010 4:33 PM Practical Prodigy has responded
 Message 8 by Minnemooseus, posted 06-30-2010 7:04 PM Practical Prodigy has responded
 Message 9 by RAZD, posted 06-30-2010 7:25 PM Practical Prodigy has responded

    
New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member


Message 6 of 60 (567335)
06-30-2010 4:33 PM
Reply to: Message 5 by Practical Prodigy
06-30-2010 4:15 PM


Re: About Me
I'm a theist, I believe in Theistic evolution.

Me too

I am most knowledgable about physics, followed by biology, then chemistry.

I know more physics and chemistry than biology. I've got a good grasp of the Theory of Evolution. I like the cosmology stuff too, Big Bang, Inflation, etc.

I've been through Genesis a lot. The Flood. The Synoptic Gospels. Some of Leviticus. I'm lacking on the history.

How's your Bible knowledge? Where do you lack knowledge the most, in general?

I have an Associates Degree in Applied Science (CIT) and a Bachelors Degree in Applied Science (Forensics)

I have a BS in Materials Science & Engineering.

Does that sum it up

Pretty much. Thanks!

Are you Christian? Which denomination?

Where are you lacking?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 5 by Practical Prodigy, posted 06-30-2010 4:15 PM Practical Prodigy has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 7 by Artemis Entreri, posted 06-30-2010 4:57 PM New Cat's Eye has acknowledged this reply
 Message 10 by Practical Prodigy, posted 06-30-2010 8:56 PM New Cat's Eye has responded

  
Artemis Entreri 
Suspended Member (Idle past 2399 days)
Posts: 1194
From: Northern Virginia
Joined: 07-08-2008


Message 7 of 60 (567343)
06-30-2010 4:57 PM
Reply to: Message 6 by New Cat's Eye
06-30-2010 4:33 PM


Re: About Me
Ha I kind of dig the introduction stuff.

I guess I'm probably a Theistic Evolutionist myself.

I'm bad at most science, especially life science.

I have a BS in History (Africa and South West Asia), and a Graduate Certificate in Geospatial Intelligence (thinking about GEOINT Graduate School). I work as a cartographer.

I am Roman Catholic.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 6 by New Cat's Eye, posted 06-30-2010 4:33 PM New Cat's Eye has acknowledged this reply

  
Minnemooseus
Member
Posts: 3725
From: Duluth, Minnesota, U.S. (West end of Lake Superior)
Joined: 11-11-2001
Member Rating: 3.2


Message 8 of 60 (567356)
06-30-2010 7:04 PM
Reply to: Message 5 by Practical Prodigy
06-30-2010 4:15 PM


Theist and evolutionist or theistic evolutionist?
As I understand such, theistic evolutionist means a belief that God guided evolution to some degree, be it small or in detail.

On the other hand, there are theists who believe in a creator God and an unguided by God evolution. As such, there is a distinction between being a theist evolutionist and a theistic evolutionist.

So, are you actually a theistic evolutionist?

Moose


Professor, geology, Whatsamatta U
Evolution - Changes in the environment, caused by the interactions of the components of the environment.

"Do not meddle in the affairs of cats, for they are subtle and will piss on your computer." - Bruce Graham

"The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness." - John Kenneth Galbraith

"Yesterday on Fox News, commentator Glenn Beck said that he believes President Obama is a racist. To be fair, every time you watch Glenn Beck, it does get a little easier to hate white people." - Conan O'Brien

"I know a little about a lot of things, and a lot about a few things, but I'm highly ignorant about everything." - Moose


This message is a reply to:
 Message 5 by Practical Prodigy, posted 06-30-2010 4:15 PM Practical Prodigy has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 11 by Practical Prodigy, posted 06-30-2010 9:26 PM Minnemooseus has responded

    
RAZD
Member
Posts: 19878
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004
Member Rating: 5.7


Message 9 of 60 (567360)
06-30-2010 7:25 PM
Reply to: Message 5 by Practical Prodigy
06-30-2010 4:15 PM


welcome
Hi Practical Prodigy, welcome to the fray.

... and a Bachelors Degree in Applied Science (Forensics) ...

Cool, I don't think we've had a professional in forensics here, so it will be interesting to see what you can contribute (especially in response to creationist claims that you can't know if you weren't there to see it).

I'm a theist, I believe in Theistic evolution.

Fair enough, I'm a Deist, and an open minded skeptic (or at least I try to be).

Enjoy

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This message is a reply to:
 Message 5 by Practical Prodigy, posted 06-30-2010 4:15 PM Practical Prodigy has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 12 by Practical Prodigy, posted 06-30-2010 9:29 PM RAZD has acknowledged this reply

  
Practical Prodigy
Junior Member (Idle past 3184 days)
Posts: 30
From: IN, USA
Joined: 06-30-2010


Message 10 of 60 (567369)
06-30-2010 8:56 PM
Reply to: Message 6 by New Cat's Eye
06-30-2010 4:33 PM


Re: About Me
know more physics and chemistry than biology. I've got a good grasp of the Theory of Evolution. I like the cosmology stuff too, Big Bang, Inflation, etc.

I've been through Genesis a lot. The Flood. The Synoptic Gospels. Some of Leviticus. I'm lacking on the history.

How's your Bible knowledge? Where do you lack knowledge the most, in general

I also like atronomy and cosmology. I am pretty well versed in the Bible, my history knowledge is fairly vast I have done alot of research on most of the Books. I have also researched Pseudepigrapha, Apocrypha, and Sacred Writings such as; Book of Enoch, Book of Adam, etc.

Pretty much. Thanks!

Are you Christian? Which denomination?

Where are you lacking?

I am a nondenominational Christian. I'd say I'm lacking most in organized religion, I grew up in Roman Catholic schooling but dont hold much stock in the "Hollywood" style religion types. In my opinion it takes you from the personal relationship with God and destroys free-thinking and encourages dogma.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 6 by New Cat's Eye, posted 06-30-2010 4:33 PM New Cat's Eye has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 22 by New Cat's Eye, posted 07-01-2010 12:54 PM Practical Prodigy has responded

    
Practical Prodigy
Junior Member (Idle past 3184 days)
Posts: 30
From: IN, USA
Joined: 06-30-2010


Message 11 of 60 (567375)
06-30-2010 9:26 PM
Reply to: Message 8 by Minnemooseus
06-30-2010 7:04 PM


Re: Theist and evolutionist or theistic evolutionist?
As I understand such, theistic evolutionist means a belief that God guided evolution to some degree, be it small or in detail.
On the other hand, there are theists who believe in a creator God and an unguided by God evolution. As such, there is a distinction between being a theist evolutionist and a theistic evolutionist.

So, are you actually a theistic evolutionist?

Well as I understand it there is three different camps, creationism (which believes in creation and Young Earth and literal interpretation of Genesis), theistic evolutionists (which believes in an allegory version of Genesis and creation), and naturalist evolutionists (no belief in God, just abiogenesis and evolution).

My position in theistic evolution, due to the fact that I believe in the process of adaptation, mutation, etc (ie micro-evolution). I do not believe that one species will become another through macro-evolution. I also believe that Evolutional Theory, which is based on philosophical naturalism (a religious worldview), is used to explain processes in the hypothetical distant past and even the extreme distances of the Universe. Methodological naturalism is thus going far beyond science's proper boundaries of the observable human experience. Proper science uses inductive reasoning from facts or general principles and causality, without excluding possibilities (supernatural or natural). Using undirected nature and unnatural intelligent causes to explain everything in the human experience leaves various phenomena unexplained (a basis for most of the content on this site). If something is not repeatable and leaves little trace or no trace of its occurance, mainstream science has a hard time dealing with it. Evolutional theory does not nearly have all the answers it is limited in its application at best, and misleading at worst.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 8 by Minnemooseus, posted 06-30-2010 7:04 PM Minnemooseus has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 13 by Dr Adequate, posted 06-30-2010 10:31 PM Practical Prodigy has responded
 Message 14 by Minnemooseus, posted 06-30-2010 10:36 PM Practical Prodigy has not yet responded

    
Practical Prodigy
Junior Member (Idle past 3184 days)
Posts: 30
From: IN, USA
Joined: 06-30-2010


Message 12 of 60 (567377)
06-30-2010 9:29 PM
Reply to: Message 9 by RAZD
06-30-2010 7:25 PM


Re: welcome
Yes I love mysteries and researching things and figuring out things with little to no evidence ;P

Forensics when applied to this debate produces interesting results...


This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by RAZD, posted 06-30-2010 7:25 PM RAZD has acknowledged this reply

    
Dr Adequate
Member
Posts: 16097
Joined: 07-20-2006


Message 13 of 60 (567383)
06-30-2010 10:31 PM
Reply to: Message 11 by Practical Prodigy
06-30-2010 9:26 PM


Re: Theist and evolutionist or theistic evolutionist?
My position in theistic evolution, due to the fact that I believe in the process of adaptation, mutation, etc (ie micro-evolution). I do not believe that one species will become another through macro-evolution.

Then you're not a theistic evolutionist.

I also believe that Evolutional Theory, which is based on philosophical naturalism (a religious worldview) ...

If that was true, then there wouldn't be any actual theistic evolutionists.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 11 by Practical Prodigy, posted 06-30-2010 9:26 PM Practical Prodigy has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 15 by Practical Prodigy, posted 06-30-2010 11:14 PM Dr Adequate has responded

  
Minnemooseus
Member
Posts: 3725
From: Duluth, Minnesota, U.S. (West end of Lake Superior)
Joined: 11-11-2001
Member Rating: 3.2


Message 14 of 60 (567385)
06-30-2010 10:36 PM
Reply to: Message 11 by Practical Prodigy
06-30-2010 9:26 PM


Looks like material for a new topic
I certainly think there are some substantial flaws in your reasonings. Your position seems to be that of an old Earth creationist - The position seems to have much in common with young Earth creationism, only that you concede an old Earth. I do not think you qualify as being a variety of theistic evolutionist.

There is a theistic evolution topic I started way back in 2002, which qualifies as being in the early days of this forum. You may wish to look at and comment at that topic.

That said, I thing your material of message 11 would better function as a new topic. I suggest you plug that material, modified as you see best, into a Proposed New Topic. If you do such, please include a good topic title that helps define the topic theme. I foresee that such will get a quick promotion into an open debate topic.

Minnemooseus (the same person who also happens to be Adminnemooseus)


This message is a reply to:
 Message 11 by Practical Prodigy, posted 06-30-2010 9:26 PM Practical Prodigy has not yet responded

    
Practical Prodigy
Junior Member (Idle past 3184 days)
Posts: 30
From: IN, USA
Joined: 06-30-2010


Message 15 of 60 (567391)
06-30-2010 11:14 PM
Reply to: Message 13 by Dr Adequate
06-30-2010 10:31 PM


Re: Theist and evolutionist or theistic evolutionist?
Then you're not a theistic evolutionist.

What is your definition of a theistic view then? I believe God has guided a limited form of evolution/adaptation/variation that means I am not a Creationist and not an Evolutionists. The misnomer Old World Creationist is an catch-all term for; creationism, including Gap creationism and Progressive creationism. I also only reject macro-evolution not the consensus on observable micro-evolution.

I believe that biological micro-evolution is merely another process within creation. It is what God employed to develop diversity and adaptation.

If that was true, then there wouldn't be any actual theistic evolutionists.

Naturalism is a religious worldview, theistic evolutionists and accept the supernatural aspect of creation. Fundamental evolutionists believe in abiogenesis and hold a naturalists world view in most instances as does a majority of empirical science. The are based on the human experince and observable processes.


This stance is concerned with knowledge: what are methods for gaining trustworthy knowledge of the natural world? It is an epistemological view that is specifically concerned with practical methods for acquiring knowledge, irrespective of one's metaphysical or religious views. It requires that hypotheses be explained and tested only by reference to natural causes and events. Explanations of observable effects are considered to be practical and useful only when they hypothesize natural causes (i.e., specific mechanisms, not indeterminate miracles). Methodological naturalism is the principle underlying all of modern science. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naturalism_(philosophy)

If that isnt a religious worldview I dont know what is.

Edited by Practical Prodigy, : spelling



This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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