Obama supports Ground Zero mosque. Religious freedom or is he being too PC?

Why? To be deliberately provocative and offensive?Would you consider hanging a big white sign with bold red lettering saying "NIGGER!"?Every population has its crazies and while most of the local black folk would be all mighty offended you might find, however, one of the more reactionary leaders calling for "something to be done to this racist!" and thus shouldn't be surprised if a small band of crazy thugs come after you with guns and knives.By the same token we already know there are a whole big bunch of moslem crazies out there. Probably no more than any other population as a percentage, but there are lots more moslems in the world than there are blacks in the USA. And while most moslems would be all mighty offended you might find some radical Imam will invoke a fatwa against you and you probably shouldn't be surprised if a small band of crazy thugs came after you with C4 and scimitars.Well, it's just a cartoon caricature isn't it?Yes. And "NIGGER!" is just a word, isn't it.Analogies are never perfect, but if you understand Islam then you appreciate that this analogy is especially apt.Why would you want to be deliberately offensive and hateful to an entire population? Edited by AZPaul3, : spelin, as usual

Would you deliberately do something hateful, spiteful and offensive to your Mother? Your best friend?Don't get into hyperbole. We're not talking about giving inadvertent offense, which is too easy to do these days in a PC climate. Not even a periodic joke or one of Oni's hilariously offensive schticks would count.We're talking about taking an unnecessary action to deliberately be offensive out of pure malice. Doesn't matter if the target is one or a million.Hang a big "NIGGER!" sign on your house. Post a large Nazi flag across the street from the Synagogue. Hang a cartoon caricature of Muhammad out your window.You certainly have the right to do these things, but are you really one of the crazy zealots hateful enough to do these things?Other than a demented sociopath, why would anyone go out of their way to do such a thing or even contemplate such a thing in an open public forum?This has nothing to do with being PC. It has to do with pure unadulterated hate. Yet, this is exactly what Taz is contemplating and you are defending. Why?

I have no problem with the material. I do not even have any problem with its use to make a joke or political point.I am interested in the motivation.Taz wanted to hang a caricature of Muhammad out his window. I wonder if he fully realizes the significance of such an action in Islam. Thus the analogies to swastikas and bold red signs.If someone wants to hate so hard as to be sociopathic then fine. I have no objection.But I question whether Taz and Huntard realize just how hateful all Islam finds idols, images and caricatures of Muhammad and God.If one is going to take an action, they should at least have an appreciation for the full extent of the message they are sending to their intended receiver. And if that is really where their heart is then fine, have at it.Taz and Huntard strike me as people with their heads on straight. I would not have expected them to be so hateful, which led me to wonder if they truly understood the significance of such an action.[aside]You must love Stephen Lynch's "Alter Boy." Don't show it to Mom.[/aside]Edited by AZPaul3, : the usual.

I'm not saying you should.I'm saying you should have a full knowledge of the message you are sending. I do not think Taz and Huntard, along with most others in the West, do.As long as you understand the full impact of your action, then, if you are still so inclined, have at it.

That is one point, Huntard. Hanging a caricature of Muhammad is offensive to ALL moslims, radical, moderate, liberal. As usual with people in the west they cannot seem to appreciate the gravity of the signal being sent.So the second point I am trying to make is that it is not such a "little thing" as it may appear in western eyes. To Islam caricatures, idols and images of God or Muhammad are hateful in the extreme. Just as hateful as the modern connotation of a swastika is to a Jew or the racists' use of nigger to a black.If you can appreciate the revulsion of the two latter then you can recognize the revulsion of the former.And to do such a thing is a blanket statement given to ALL Islam not just the few "assholes" you think are your target.Again, I really don't care if someone wants to do such things as hang caricatures or paint swastikas as long as it is not done out of ignorance of a foreign culture and they understand, in full, the extremely hateful impact of their signal.

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As usual with people in the west they cannot seem to appreciate the gravity of the signal being sent.

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Oh, Huntard, there are some very powerful historical reasons for Islam's distaste of these things. In its infancy Islam was tolerant of pagans and polytheism. Idols were not for them since this was too much like praying to man-made stone things in place of God, but they let the pagans do their thing.Then Muhammad become successful with is message.It begins with Muhammad's fleeing from Mecca to Medina when the Idol Merchants started killing all his followers. They controlled Mecca at that time and saw Muhammad's teachings (monotheist) as cutting into their "trade." They went after Muhammad and the moslims with a vengeance. The ensuing wars were, well, quite bloody, like all wars. Eventually, Muhammad conquered Mecca where he destroyed the idols, caricatures and images in the Kabaal.So, Islam's view of such idols as haraam stems from a bloody history of suppression as well as folding quite nicely into their monotheistic beliefs.It is not a "just because I want it to be..." kind of thing.But the western mind has little appreciation for such foreign history and its effects on culture.[abe] My little screed here can hardly do justice to the depth of emotion. Kinda like saying jews were killed by Nazis. There is much too much more to this then a mere "war". Sorry.Edited by AZPaul3, : edit added

Deliberately obtuse?No, Huntard, not those kinds of idols. Muslims couldn't care less what pictures, statues, figurines or cartoons anyone wants to prey to just as long as they are not of Muhammad or God.And where the hell are the muslims? Why is this being left to some atheist to explain? Badly. To the western mind this is so, but the rest of the world does not revolve around Europe and the USA.Even though I try to help avoid misunderstandings based on cultural ignorance I do not have the patience to preach on something I do not believe in.Just know that images (drawn, carved, molded, stamped, whatever) of Muhammad or God are hateful images in the extreme to a moslim.Accept that or not as you wish. If you ever do feel a curiosity as to the "why" then the history is out there ready for you to learn.[abe] Sorry, Moose. I did not see your closing statement. I beg the forgiveness of the mighty ones.Edited by AZPaul3, : No reason given.