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Author Topic:   What is Life?
ringo
Member
Posts: 19528
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.8


Message 8 of 268 (581074)
09-13-2010 12:20 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by mosassam
09-02-2010 10:00 PM


What life "is" is important to creationists because they want to claim that anything that can self-assemble from simple chemicals isn't life. It isn't very important to scientists because they're interested in both living and non-living chemicals.


Life is like a Hot Wheels car. Sometimes it goes behind the couch and you can't find it.

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ringo
Member
Posts: 19528
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.8


Message 16 of 268 (587173)
10-17-2010 12:54 PM
Reply to: Message 11 by mosassam
10-17-2010 12:31 PM


mosassam writes:

Part of science is to provide a description of reality and, in my opinion, Life is a fundamental feature of reality, particularly when discussing something like evolution. To suggest that trying to define Life is outside the arena of science seems preposterous to me and I find it truly shocking that there seems to be no scientific consensus on what Life is but it is understandable.


There's a difference between "description" and "definition".


"It appears that many of you turn to Hebrew to escape the English...." -- Joseppi

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ringo
Member
Posts: 19528
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.8


Message 19 of 268 (587176)
10-17-2010 1:04 PM
Reply to: Message 18 by mosassam
10-17-2010 1:00 PM


mosassam writes:

Part of the description of reality must include, imo, Life. But what is the definition of Life.


Certainly, a description of reality should include a description of life - but what does a description of life have to do with a definition of life? An artist can describe life without defining it. Why not a scientist?


"It appears that many of you turn to Hebrew to escape the English...." -- Joseppi

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ringo
Member
Posts: 19528
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.8


Message 24 of 268 (587183)
10-17-2010 1:26 PM
Reply to: Message 22 by mosassam
10-17-2010 1:14 PM


mosassam writes:

I have not asked for a description of Life, I have asked for a definition - what thoughts do you have regarding this.


You said that "part of science is to provide a description of reality". I'm asking what that has to do with a definition. My thought is that science can putter along quite nicely without a definition of life.

mosassam writes:

Don't you think it should be possible?


Definitions, by definition, are vague. "Meaning" is necessarily subjective. It's possible to have a thousand different definitions of life. It isn't possible to agree on one.


"It appears that many of you turn to Hebrew to escape the English...." -- Joseppi

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ringo
Member
Posts: 19528
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.8


Message 67 of 268 (592974)
11-23-2010 10:31 AM
Reply to: Message 61 by AlphaOmegakid
11-23-2010 9:38 AM


Re: Sad Sad Sad
AlphaOmegakid writes:

Go ahead, run away from the definition of life....


The OP doesn't suggest that there "is" no definition of life. It says that there is no consensus on what that definition should be. Different definitions are used for different applications.

What point are you trying to make by throwing yet another option into the non-consensus?


"It appears that many of you turn to Hebrew to escape the English...." -- Joseppi

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ringo
Member
Posts: 19528
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.8


(1)
Message 104 of 268 (593771)
11-29-2010 10:30 AM
Reply to: Message 102 by AlphaOmegakid
11-29-2010 9:44 AM


AlphaOmegakid writes:

It is the designer or owner who decides the definition of their house. That doesn't mean it cannot be defined.


Where you're going wrong is in assuming that there's only one definition. The designer and owner may or may not have the same definition. The designer may define it as a house as soon as the drawings are complete. The owners may be showing people "their house" when it's just a foundation and a pile of lumber. The city government has its own definition - it's a house when it meets all of the building codes and becomes taxable.

It's naive to pretend that one definition will work in all situations.


"It appears that many of you turn to Hebrew to escape the English...." -- Joseppi

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ringo
Member
Posts: 19528
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.8


Message 156 of 268 (594396)
12-03-2010 10:56 AM
Reply to: Message 149 by AlphaOmegakid
12-03-2010 8:42 AM


AlphaOmegakid writes:

For an organism to be alive, it is necessary for it to participate in the process of reproduction.


"Participate in the process of reproduction" is a poor choice of words. A participant is the subject of an action, not the object. A cheer isn't a participant in a baseball game; it's a product.

The point you're trying to make is that a species must reproduce to be alive, even if individual organisms don't reproduce.

If you want your One True Definition™ to be taken seriously, you'll have to be more precise with your language.


"I'm Rory Bellows, I tell you! And I got a lot of corroborating evidence... over here... by the throttle!"

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ringo
Member
Posts: 19528
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.8


Message 205 of 268 (598319)
12-30-2010 10:16 AM
Reply to: Message 184 by Philip Johnson
12-29-2010 5:13 PM


Re: What is the simplest life form?
Philip Johnson writes:

Why are there still single cell organisms? Why haven't they evolved into more complex organisms?


Single-celled organisms are doing quite well as they are. They're the major serious biological threat to mankind. Why would they change?

Some of the first shelters were made of tree branches. Our houses today are considerably more complex, yet we still use a simple stick to hold up a flag. By your logic, a flagpole should have thousands of parts.


"I'm Rory Bellows, I tell you! And I got a lot of corroborating evidence... over here... by the throttle!"

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ringo
Member
Posts: 19528
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.8


Message 262 of 268 (600046)
01-12-2011 1:34 AM
Reply to: Message 261 by john6zx
01-12-2011 12:23 AM


Re: what is life,,,baby dont hurt me baby dont....
john6zx writes:

So energy existed before life? Is that what you are saying?


How could it not?


"I'm Rory Bellows, I tell you! And I got a lot of corroborating evidence... over here... by the throttle!"

This message is a reply to:
 Message 261 by john6zx, posted 01-12-2011 12:23 AM john6zx has replied

Replies to this message:
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