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Author Topic:   Existence After Death
dyluck
Member (Idle past 2987 days)
Posts: 31
Joined: 10-06-2010


Message 121 of 163 (586519)
10-13-2010 5:13 PM
Reply to: Message 115 by 1.61803
10-13-2010 3:45 PM


1.61803 writes:

Not the point. The point was if Adolf received absolution and last rites prior to his death. Would it be springtime for Hitler in heaven?


Sounds like unbiblical founded huministic ritual talk to me.
Nobody can do anything on this earth to save anybody. If God wanted to save hitler then he would have done it, God would have changed his heart. No matter what silly human ritual or some "absolution" thought a priest. no prayer is going to save you, no priest is going to save anybody. Thas why baby baptism is such a silly practice. Its funny how synergistic salvation creeped its way into the roman church.
God is the one who chooses who he will save, he supplies the means, he changes the heart He drives the person to repent and gifts them with grace and faith to continue in it. Sustaining them as a good father does.
God saves us from himself, for himself, through himself. Simple.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 115 by 1.61803, posted 10-13-2010 3:45 PM 1.61803 has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 137 by 1.61803, posted 10-14-2010 11:25 AM dyluck has responded

    
ringo
Member
Posts: 16222
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.3


Message 122 of 163 (586520)
10-13-2010 5:16 PM
Reply to: Message 119 by dyluck
10-13-2010 4:44 PM


dyluck writes:

See nobody is consigning you to eternal punishment. At the end of the day, you are either for him or against him.


If he kills millions of people with a flood, I'm against him. Are you suggesting that I'm not consigned to eternal punishment for being against him?

dyluck writes:

Ok, good statement, so you tell me what is good justice. How can God be a good judge?


Your god can't be a good judge. He can't be a judge at all for the same reason that Charles Manson can't be a judge. He's the criminal.


"It appears that many of you turn to Hebrew to escape the English...." -- Joseppi
This message is a reply to:
 Message 119 by dyluck, posted 10-13-2010 4:44 PM dyluck has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 124 by dyluck, posted 10-13-2010 5:23 PM ringo has responded

  
dyluck
Member (Idle past 2987 days)
Posts: 31
Joined: 10-06-2010


Message 123 of 163 (586521)
10-13-2010 5:18 PM
Reply to: Message 109 by Coragyps
10-13-2010 2:39 PM


Re: Life After Death
Coragyps writes:


What? Without the Aztecs (and Mayans?) cutting hearts out of folks, all mankind and the whole earth would have ended! They were preserving life with every slice!


Sorry Aztecs, my bad.
Anyways, I don't get it. Not up on my ancient Aztec hisory.. Was there going to be some world wide Aztec revolt? Or are you sarcasticly eluding to doing it because if they didn't their "god" would have ended the world?
This message is a reply to:
 Message 109 by Coragyps, posted 10-13-2010 2:39 PM Coragyps has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 131 by Coragyps, posted 10-13-2010 6:33 PM dyluck has not yet responded

    
dyluck
Member (Idle past 2987 days)
Posts: 31
Joined: 10-06-2010


Message 124 of 163 (586522)
10-13-2010 5:23 PM
Reply to: Message 122 by ringo
10-13-2010 5:16 PM


ringo writes:


If he kills millions of people with a flood, I'm against him. Are you suggesting that I'm not consigned to eternal punishment for being against him?


You neglect to mention that everyone had the option of choosing to get on board the boat. Secondly, this was clearly a judgement of a God that has the right to do with his creation as he will...

No, I was saying that you are either for him or against him. You are either a slave to sin or righeousness. One leads to death and the other to life. You decide what that means to you.


Your god can't be a good judge. He can't be a judge at all for the same reason that Charles Manson can't be a judge. He's the criminal.

You didn't answer my question. Describe a just judge for me please.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 122 by ringo, posted 10-13-2010 5:16 PM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 126 by ringo, posted 10-13-2010 5:40 PM dyluck has not yet responded
 Message 136 by frako, posted 10-13-2010 8:11 PM dyluck has not yet responded

    
dyluck
Member (Idle past 2987 days)
Posts: 31
Joined: 10-06-2010


Message 125 of 163 (586526)
10-13-2010 5:39 PM
Reply to: Message 110 by Dr Adequate
10-13-2010 3:07 PM


Re: Life After Death
I admit, im not the WW2 history buff. I will have to talk to my friend to pull some stops here.

Secondly, say he was indeed a "christian". He certianly wasn't following the bible. If a so-called christian is trying to add to what is in the bible, make up his own laws, says its from God is a liar and the truth is not in him at all.

Do you believe hitler was indeed a true christian?

Matt 7:21-23 " 21 "Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22 On that day many will say to me, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?' 23 And then will I declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.'"


This message is a reply to:
 Message 110 by Dr Adequate, posted 10-13-2010 3:07 PM Dr Adequate has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 129 by Dr Adequate, posted 10-13-2010 5:48 PM dyluck has not yet responded
 Message 133 by jar, posted 10-13-2010 6:38 PM dyluck has responded

    
ringo
Member
Posts: 16222
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.3


Message 126 of 163 (586527)
10-13-2010 5:40 PM
Reply to: Message 124 by dyluck
10-13-2010 5:23 PM


dyluck writes:

You neglect to mention that everyone had the option of choosing to get on board the boat.


No they didn't. Read your Bible. They weren't given that option.

dyluck writes:

No, I was saying that you are either for him or against him. You are either a slave to sin or righeousness.


As I said, if your god is real, I'm against him. I'm against his idea of sin and righteousness. I'm saying that he wouldn't recognize righteousness if it sat down beside him in church. Are you saying that I'm not consigned to eternal punishment?

dyluck writes:

You didn't answer my question. Describe a just judge for me please.


As I said, a just judge must be of exemplary character. Mass murderers need not apply.


"It appears that many of you turn to Hebrew to escape the English...." -- Joseppi
This message is a reply to:
 Message 124 by dyluck, posted 10-13-2010 5:23 PM dyluck has not yet responded

  
dyluck
Member (Idle past 2987 days)
Posts: 31
Joined: 10-06-2010


Message 127 of 163 (586529)
10-13-2010 5:44 PM
Reply to: Message 111 by DrJones*
10-13-2010 3:09 PM


Re: Life After Death
DrJones* writes:

What sin? As I said, I am without sin.


Lawlesness is that better? how many different ways you want me to say it.?


True, but in this arguement you're not using sin = bad act. You're using sin = transgression of the Christian God's Law

Ok, what part of God's law do you not like? The do not murder part? the do not steal part? Tell me?

We are commanded to obey the law of the land barring it doesn't superceed God's law. So just not obeying the law of the land is a "sin against God". If our law says that you must steal from another person at least once a day, guess what. Im going to jail because Im not going to steal.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 111 by DrJones*, posted 10-13-2010 3:09 PM DrJones* has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 132 by DrJones*, posted 10-13-2010 6:38 PM dyluck has responded

    
Dr Adequate
Member
Posts: 16085
Joined: 07-20-2006
Member Rating: 10.0


Message 128 of 163 (586530)
10-13-2010 5:45 PM
Reply to: Message 117 by dyluck
10-13-2010 4:29 PM


Re: Life After Death
There are no easy explination.

True.

God is soverign and, these things included I accept him as God and I have faith that he knows what's best for his people and I trust him.

I guess that's what the Aztecs said about Tezcatlipoca.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 117 by dyluck, posted 10-13-2010 4:29 PM dyluck has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 130 by dyluck, posted 10-13-2010 5:51 PM Dr Adequate has responded

  
Dr Adequate
Member
Posts: 16085
Joined: 07-20-2006
Member Rating: 10.0


Message 129 of 163 (586531)
10-13-2010 5:48 PM
Reply to: Message 125 by dyluck
10-13-2010 5:39 PM


Re: Life After Death
Do you believe hitler was indeed a true christian?

That's a more difficult question. But certainly he was a creationist who denied both the possibility of evolution and the evidence for it.

You don't have to be a "true christian" to be wrong about biology, you know.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 125 by dyluck, posted 10-13-2010 5:39 PM dyluck has not yet responded

  
dyluck
Member (Idle past 2987 days)
Posts: 31
Joined: 10-06-2010


Message 130 of 163 (586532)
10-13-2010 5:51 PM
Reply to: Message 128 by Dr Adequate
10-13-2010 5:45 PM


Re: Life After Death
19For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them. 20For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse. 21For although they knew God, they did not honor him as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in their thinking, and their foolish hearts were darkened. 22Claiming to be wise, they became fools, 23and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images resembling mortal man and birds and animals and creeping things.
24Therefore God gave them up in the lusts of their hearts to impurity, to the dishonoring of their bodies among themselves, 25because they exchanged the truth about God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever! Amen.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 128 by Dr Adequate, posted 10-13-2010 5:45 PM Dr Adequate has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 134 by Dr Adequate, posted 10-13-2010 6:49 PM dyluck has not yet responded

    
Coragyps
Member
Posts: 5377
From: Snyder, Texas, USA
Joined: 11-12-2002


Message 131 of 163 (586534)
10-13-2010 6:33 PM
Reply to: Message 123 by dyluck
10-13-2010 5:18 PM


Re: Life After Death
Or are you sarcasticly eluding to doing it because if they didn't their "god" would have ended the world?

Not sarcastically. That's apparently what they fervently believed. Are you going to judge them? Oh, it appears that you already have.......and they were just trying to keep the world around so you could exist someday.

And the Aztecs had lots of gods, nearly all of them much spiffier-looking than the Hebrew model.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 123 by dyluck, posted 10-13-2010 5:18 PM dyluck has not yet responded

    
DrJones*
Member
Posts: 1804
From: Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
Joined: 08-19-2004
Member Rating: 5.5


Message 132 of 163 (586535)
10-13-2010 6:38 PM
Reply to: Message 127 by dyluck
10-13-2010 5:44 PM


Re: Life After Death
Ok, what part of God's law do you not like? The do not murder part? the do not steal part? Tell me?

For starters:
I am the lord your god and you shall have no other gods before me
Do not take the name of the Lord in vain
Remember the Sabbath and keep it holy

which are all laws which impose on my and others freedom of and from religion


It's not enough to bash in heads, you've got to bash in minds
soon I discovered that this rock thing was true
Jerry Lee Lewis was the devil
Jesus was an architect previous to his career as a prophet
All of a sudden i found myself in love with the world
And so there was only one thing I could do
Was ding a ding dang my dang along ling long - Jesus Built my Hotrod Ministry

Live every week like it's Shark Week! - Tracey Jordan
Just a monkey in a long line of kings. - Matthew Good
If "elitist" just means "not the dumbest motherfucker in the room", I'll be an elitist! - Get Your War On
*not an actual doctor
This message is a reply to:
 Message 127 by dyluck, posted 10-13-2010 5:44 PM dyluck has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 139 by dyluck, posted 10-14-2010 5:39 PM DrJones* has responded

  
jar
Member
Posts: 30934
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 133 of 163 (586536)
10-13-2010 6:38 PM
Reply to: Message 125 by dyluck
10-13-2010 5:39 PM


Re: Life After Death
Do you believe hitler was indeed a true christian?

Absolutely as have been many horrific people.

Matt 7:21-23 " 21 "Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22 On that day many will say to me, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?' 23 And then will I declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.'"

Don't worry, just as in Matthew 25 he is saying that the Goats will be his followers.

If there is a Heaven I am quite sure there will be far more atheists, agnostics, Buddhist, Taoists, Animists, Satanists, Jews, Hindus and Muslims there than Christians.


Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!
This message is a reply to:
 Message 125 by dyluck, posted 10-13-2010 5:39 PM dyluck has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 135 by bluegenes, posted 10-13-2010 7:04 PM jar has acknowledged this reply
 Message 138 by dyluck, posted 10-14-2010 5:33 PM jar has responded

  
Dr Adequate
Member
Posts: 16085
Joined: 07-20-2006
Member Rating: 10.0


Message 134 of 163 (586538)
10-13-2010 6:49 PM
Reply to: Message 130 by dyluck
10-13-2010 5:51 PM


Re: Life After Death
1 Huitzilopochtli is first in rank, no one, no one is like unto him: not vainly do I sing (his praises) coming forth in the garb of our ancestors; I shine; I glitter. 2 He is a terror to the Mixteca; he alone destroyed the Picha-Huasteca, he conquered them. 3 The Dart-Hurler is an example to the city, as he sets to work. He who commands in battle is called the representative of my God. 4 When he shouts aloud he inspires great terror, the divine hurler, the god turning himself in the combat, the divine hurler, the god turning himself in the combat.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 130 by dyluck, posted 10-13-2010 5:51 PM dyluck has not yet responded

  
bluegenes
Member (Idle past 550 days)
Posts: 3119
From: U.K.
Joined: 01-24-2007


Message 135 of 163 (586540)
10-13-2010 7:04 PM
Reply to: Message 133 by jar
10-13-2010 6:38 PM


Life After Death/Pascal's wager/Atheists in heaven
jar writes:

If there is a Heaven I am quite sure there will be far more atheists, agnostics, Buddhist, Taoists, Animists, Satanists, Jews, Hindus and Muslims there than Christians.

On atheists in heaven......


This message is a reply to:
 Message 133 by jar, posted 10-13-2010 6:38 PM jar has acknowledged this reply

  
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