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Author Topic:   The Global Warming Scam
DBlevins
Member (Idle past 3802 days)
Posts: 652
From: Puyallup, WA.
Joined: 02-04-2003


Message 81 of 177 (586934)
10-15-2010 3:49 PM
Reply to: Message 41 by Dr Adequate
10-09-2010 3:20 AM


Warming and CO2
Melting of permafrost releases methane through the decomposition of organic matter...ie. Warming temps melt permafrost releasing methane which contributes to warming the atmosphere which warms the ocean which releases CO2.
Iirc from my 2 geology classes I took.
Methane will oxidise to form CO2 but i'm unsure how much of an effect that reaction has on atmospheric concentrations.

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 Message 41 by Dr Adequate, posted 10-09-2010 3:20 AM Dr Adequate has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 82 by Taz, posted 10-16-2010 2:50 AM DBlevins has replied

  
DBlevins
Member (Idle past 3802 days)
Posts: 652
From: Puyallup, WA.
Joined: 02-04-2003


Message 86 of 177 (587605)
10-19-2010 6:17 PM
Reply to: Message 82 by Taz
10-16-2010 2:50 AM


Re: Warming and CO2
NPR was talking about this the other day. It's a spiralling affect that, frankly, there's little we can do about. It would take the unified effort of the entire world over the next 30 years to reverse the effects of greenhouse gases. Unfortunately, the world is anything but unified on this issue.
We can debate about this all we want. GW is pretty much unstoppable at this stage in the game.
DBlevins writes:
Melting of permafrost releases methane through the decomposition of organic matter...ie. Warming temps melt permafrost releasing methane which contributes to warming the atmosphere which warms the ocean which releases CO2.
NPR was talking about this the other day. It's a spiralling affect that, frankly, there's little we can do about. It would take the unified effort of the entire world over the next 30 years to reverse the effects of greenhouse gases. Unfortunately, the world is anything but unified on this issue.
We can debate about this all we want. GW is pretty much unstoppable at this stage in the game.
Yes, but why add to the problem? Why make things worse by not addressing the tremendous impact that we have on the world? We should not be throwing up our hands and saying 'Sad, but nothing we can do.' There are ways we can begin limiting our output of GHG's into the atmosphere.

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Replies to this message:
 Message 87 by Taq, posted 10-19-2010 6:28 PM DBlevins has replied

  
DBlevins
Member (Idle past 3802 days)
Posts: 652
From: Puyallup, WA.
Joined: 02-04-2003


Message 88 of 177 (587618)
10-19-2010 7:06 PM
Reply to: Message 87 by Taq
10-19-2010 6:28 PM


Re: Warming and CO2
If we think that by presenting the facts in a forthright and honest matter will change people's minds then we are living in fantasy world. People (like the originator of this thread) have made an emotional decision that GW is a scam, and no amount of evidence will change their mind. There are also people who may very well accept the facts but see no reason to change their lifestyle unless everyone else does first.
Do you recall what happened when the government started listening to the scientists and began to ban or limit the use of CFC's?

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 Message 87 by Taq, posted 10-19-2010 6:28 PM Taq has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 89 by hooah212002, posted 10-19-2010 7:08 PM DBlevins has replied
 Message 93 by Taq, posted 10-20-2010 12:34 PM DBlevins has replied
 Message 94 by Species8472, posted 10-20-2010 1:29 PM DBlevins has replied

  
DBlevins
Member (Idle past 3802 days)
Posts: 652
From: Puyallup, WA.
Joined: 02-04-2003


Message 90 of 177 (587631)
10-19-2010 7:44 PM
Reply to: Message 89 by hooah212002
10-19-2010 7:08 PM


Re: Warming and CO2
There ARE "ozone hole deniers", ya know....... There are people who think that was also a lie purported by big brother....
That might be the case, but you don't have nearly the same level of incredulity and invictive that you do with GW or AGW.
I disagree that there is nothing to do about it because people deny its validity. It just means that there is a lot more work to do to convince people that there is a problem and something can be done about it.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 89 by hooah212002, posted 10-19-2010 7:08 PM hooah212002 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 91 by hooah212002, posted 10-19-2010 8:13 PM DBlevins has replied

  
DBlevins
Member (Idle past 3802 days)
Posts: 652
From: Puyallup, WA.
Joined: 02-04-2003


Message 95 of 177 (587961)
10-21-2010 3:03 PM
Reply to: Message 91 by hooah212002
10-19-2010 8:13 PM


Re: Warming and CO2
Sorry, but didn't you say that there were also ozone hole deniers?
I thought I was just commenting on that statement that you made.

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 Message 91 by hooah212002, posted 10-19-2010 8:13 PM hooah212002 has seen this message but not replied

  
DBlevins
Member (Idle past 3802 days)
Posts: 652
From: Puyallup, WA.
Joined: 02-04-2003


Message 96 of 177 (587963)
10-21-2010 3:06 PM
Reply to: Message 93 by Taq
10-20-2010 12:34 PM


Re: Warming and CO2
Who is talking about banning fossil fuels?
What dramatic change in our lifestyles is going to occur because we recycle or carpool more or use the bus more or use high-speed rail transportaion or increase our use of solar cells and other green technologies?

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 Message 93 by Taq, posted 10-20-2010 12:34 PM Taq has not replied

  
DBlevins
Member (Idle past 3802 days)
Posts: 652
From: Puyallup, WA.
Joined: 02-04-2003


Message 97 of 177 (587965)
10-21-2010 3:13 PM
Reply to: Message 94 by Species8472
10-20-2010 1:29 PM


Re: Warming and CO2
Like some others on here, I am convinced that there is little we can do stop global warming. We are currently at 380 ppm or so. Many believe the point of no return is around 450. But since we're never going to be able to convince the opposition, the point of no return might as well have been 350, which we already passed long ago.
What we (those of us who are sane enough to honestly want a cleaner planet) ought to do now is prepare the world for what's to come. For example, Australia has recently adjusted their entire economic system to deal with the changes. In the 80s, Australia was the biggest exporter of grain. They now have no export at all. Their people have finally realized that the 2 decades long drought they've been having is no drought at all but actually climate change in action. You see, drought ends. If you have a period of decreased precipitation that lasts forever, it's not a drought. It's climate change.
I agree that if the government does not take it seriously, then you will have a significantly lessened impact upon the unwashed masses but that doesn't mean that people can take personal account of their own impacts on the environment and even start grassroots efforts to make some meaningful changes to how we run our day to day lives that don't have to 'drastically' alter our lifestyles. (Ie. After repeated complaints by my household and others in our apartment complex they added a recycling bin to our garbage disposal. I had been using the library to deposit our batteries and traveling to dispose of my plastics and other recyclables so it was nice to see this change just because I can now walk to recycle instead of drive a good distance to dispose of them all)

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DBlevins
Member (Idle past 3802 days)
Posts: 652
From: Puyallup, WA.
Joined: 02-04-2003


Message 169 of 177 (599458)
01-07-2011 3:40 PM
Reply to: Message 160 by GDR
01-04-2011 7:02 PM


Re: Evangelical earth killers playing defense
But, if cutting human CO2 emissions doesn't have any effect then none of that will change but many others besides would be affected unnecessarily.
We know that the Antarctic Glaciers did not exist when CO2 was above 450ppm. We also believe that we are rapidly approaching the tipping point (or have already passed it) when the CO2 levels in the atmosphere precipitate the uncontrollable release of greenhouse gases trapped during the last ice age, which it has been estimated could raise the CO2 ppm to roughly 800-1000 ppm. If you don't believe that that would be catastrophic to the viability of our species as well as countless others, then you frankly don't understand the issues. The point being, that if we do not, "right now!", take charge of our CO2 inputs, then we can expect that it won't be just the grain farmers in Australia crying and gnashing our teeth. It will be ALL of us.

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 Message 160 by GDR, posted 01-04-2011 7:02 PM GDR has not replied

  
DBlevins
Member (Idle past 3802 days)
Posts: 652
From: Puyallup, WA.
Joined: 02-04-2003


Message 170 of 177 (599467)
01-07-2011 4:53 PM
Reply to: Message 152 by GDR
01-04-2011 5:27 PM


Re: Evangelical earth killers playing defense
As I said to jar, combatting CO2 emmisions will cost people their livelihood, and I'd hate to see that done if it isn't of any use.
Not combatting CO2 emmisions will cost people and especially their children their livelihood. Not combatting CO2 emmsions will also cost lives.
Also, as I pointed out to jar if it isn't CO2 emmisions it is something else, and maybe we will miss out on what we might have been able to do with whatever else is causing the problem.
If it was something else causing climate change we would have likely had a clue to what it was by now. You would be wrong to think that climate scientists are focused solely on CO2 emmisions as to the cause of global warming. Researchers have studied and continue to study more aspects related to climate change than CO2. But, the simple fact remains that we have well documented sources that show that rising CO2 levels, caused by humans, is the largest factor in global warming.

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