Atheist Appreciation of Biblical Wisdom and Inspiration

While the Bible may not contain unique wisdom, it does show us that some lessons continue through the ages.Sometimes verses also inspire a different wisdom than the author may have intended. Discipline your son, and he will give you peace; he will bring delight to your soul. (NIV, Proverbs 29:17) - While our style of discipline may change, the need for discipline doesn't. Children need discipline and guidance. Train a child in the way he should go, and when he is old he will not turn from it. (Proverbs 22:6) - This doesn't mean the child won't test the limits when they leave home as an adult, but they'll get back on the path as they test what we've taught them. Reminds me to not give up on my child as they adjust to adulthood. By their fruit you will recognize them. (Matthew 7:16) - IOW, actions speak louder than words. Reminds me to look beyond the "sales pitch." Make it your ambition to lead a quiet life, to mind your own business and to work with your hands, just as we told you, so that your daily life may win the respect of outsiders and so that you will nt be dependent on anybody. (1 Thessalonians 4:11-12) - This one I condense to "work hard and mind your own business". IOW, don't be a busybody.This is the wisdom I get from the verses, not necessarily what a clergy will teach.

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The Savior said There is no sin, but it is you who make sin when you do the things that are like the nature of adultery, which is called sin. --Gospel of Mary

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Compassion, generosity, kindness and curiosity are human qualities that existed long before they were noted in the bible. They would continue to exist without the bible. The bible is a result of them not a cause.

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Not the point of the thread. No one is saying the Bible is the cause of these behaviors in people. This thread is asking about what wisdom is contained in the pages of the Bible.Yes, we can find wisdom in many writings of various cultures, but that isn't the issue. This thread is specifically asking about what wisdom is contained within the Bible. Please keep to the topic.Here is another one I like. Some teach we should never get angry, but the verse doesn't really say that.

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Despite practically none of that being in the Bible.

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Why not say instead that it was the result of the Enlightenment? Of the birth of secular thought and secular government?

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So show that these things were because of enlightenment or secular thought only as opposed to being inspired by anything written in Bible. Odds are many things influenced those who fashioned our culture. That doesn't mean the Bible writings didn't provide some wisdom and inspiration. Uncle Tom's Cabin written by Harriet Beecher Stowe is an anti-slavery novel. In this thread we are talking about the wisdom and inspiration that can be gleaned from the Bible. It isn't about whether it is the only source of wisdom and inspiration.I'm not sure why some participants feel the need to keep pointing out that the Bible isn't the only source of wisdom and inspiration. So far no one has implied that it is. We are discussing the Bible, not any other writing. So opinions are concerning what Bible wisdom has influenced or inspired.Do we really have to keep posting a disclaimer that our opinions are only concerning the Bible and not any other book that may have contributed to wisdom and inspiration of humanity?Interesting that no one has disagreed with the actual verses yet.

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Why? I didn't say that they were. I merely pointed out that this would be an alternative hypothesis.

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So it was useless concerning the topic, which is about the wisdom from the Bible and didn't serve to move the discussion forward.All you've provided is another one-liner that doesn't help move the discussion forward.Your alternative hypothesis is irrelevant to the topic. If you can't curb the urge to correct or provide an alternative hypothesis that has nothing to do with moving the topic forward, please try to at least add something that is pertinent to the topic and will help to move it forward.For example: There is one parable in Matthew and two in Luke with this same sentiment. (Matthew 25: 21 & 23) (Luke 19:17)This verse comes to mind when people want me to give them more responsibility or money.This allows participants to at least respond to the portion of the post that is on topic.I find it mind boggling that Christians haven't taken this opportunity to fill this thread with verses of wisdom, lessons, or inspiration for daily living.

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But the real wisdom, in my opinion, is in the ideas that are not "common sense", ideas like loving your enemies or turning the other cheek.

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Unfortunately, not everyone has common sense.
Good that even common sense stuff is written down to see what has been common sense through the ages.Loving one's enemies and turning the other cheek may not seem like common sense today, but they may have been common sense for survival back then. Given that Israel was occupied off and on, to survive it is best not to irritate the people in power.Generally today the expression "turn the other cheek" means to refrain from responding to an aggressor with violence, not seeking revenge. (Matthew 5:39, Luke 6:29 )The same comment is made in Lamentations 3:30 and suggest a form of submission to oppressors, with the hope of being spared. For an occupied land, this would be common sense for survival.The author of Matthew (not Luke) contrasted the comment with the "an eye for an eye" phrase which people take to mean retaliation. In Judaism it doesn't carry that meaning. It refers to appropriate punishment or monetary compensation for physical injuries. This is done through the legal system, not necessarily the individual. (Makes me think of the satire issue I have with the Book of Matthew.)The idea of equitable compensation for loss is good. I feel today our legal system has lost the spirit of that idea.Sometimes the wisdom we glean from a verse isn't necessarily the wisdom the author was presenting. It is interesting to see the difference between what was probably understood by the original audience and what we understand today.

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The Savior said There is no sin, but it is you who make sin when you do the things that are like the nature of adultery, which is called sin. --Gospel of Mary

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Dearest PD: Perhaps I missed the phrase "daily living" in Mr. Straggler's OP. If Mr. Straggler's OP does not limit this thread to the narrow perameters of yours and his ideology, perhaps, therefore, Mr. Straggler was not limiting this thread to aspects of what you consider, daily living to imply. Perhaps it's time to clarify the perameters of Mr. Straggler's OP.

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I understood it. That's why I felt it was a wonderful opportunity for Christians.As for the Topic:
Another lesson I like is in Matthew 7:3-5 and also addressed by Paul in Romans 2:17-23. IOW, if one is teaching someone else that it is wrong to (fill in favorite sin), then one should also not be (fill in favorite sin). Lead by example; as opposed to, do as I say not as I do.

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Mmm, LoL. The phrase wasn't even in the OP, madear. It was your words, spun up from whole cloth. Perhaps you need to reread the OP again, more carefully. I was being facetious when I said that perhaps I missed it.

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Yes dear, I understood that you were being facetious. I didn't say the phrase was in the OP. My point is that I understood what Straggler expected participants to provide in the thread. Now that he has clarified, please adjust accordingly and no more discussion about why you should be able to discuss what you want. Stick to the topic.

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Your implication is that I was personally attacking. I'm sorry you mistook it that way. My intention was to set the record straight as to what the OP appeared to call for. Fair enough?

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The lesson of the speck and the plank had nothing to do with you, Buz. It had to do with the topic. Otherwise, I would be guilty of not moving the on-topic discussion forward, which is also an example of the speck and the plank lesson. IOW, if as an Admin I chastise people for being off topic or not moving the topic forward, I also should not go off topic or post useless messages that don't move the topic forward. That's why that lesson makes me think of the phrase, lead by example. It's very disappointing when clergy don't follow their own teachings.NOTE: If you were personally attacking, the Wizard Cat would have spoken. So no more discussion of this, on with the topic. (Buz or anyone else, that means don't respond to this post unless you're discussing the speck and the plank lesson.)

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For example the story of Samson in Judges 13-16 has plenty to teach that isn't about Sampson's relationship to God.

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Why not actually mention the wisdom you see in the story? As you've noted, not everyone will glean the same lesson.

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I'd also suggest that there is more to Job than just lessons regarding devoutness and faithfulness to God. In particular Job's discussions with Zophar, Eliphaz, and Bildad are just as much about Job's relationships with his peers as they are about his relationship with God.

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I feel the story of Job also shows us that bad things don't necessarily happen to people because of sin. People used to feel (some probably still do) that disease was caused by sin. We see a mention of it in the NT in John 9:2.

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Because its a short, interesting story, and I didn't want to ruin it by preaching what I see in it.

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I think the text speaks for itself. Samson's obvious weaknesses are great allegories for a lot of human failings. That we won't all agree on the lesson is a selling point in my opinion.

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I don't really see any good general lessons in the story for today other than don't give in to a nagging woman.
Samson was a womanizer, a violent man, and wasn’t too bright. He got duped by two women and several times by Delilah.The religious lesson is that God can achieve his goals through people who are less than stellar, not totally righteous. I think that point has been made in other places in the Bible. Overall the point is to show God's leading hand in delivering Israel.

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The literal meaning of 'The Grasshopper and the Ant' is that grasshoppers are lazy but ants are industrious.

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No it isn't. It's understood as a fable, it has nothing to do with grasshoppers or ants. It's used to teach the virtues of hard work.

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That's correct. Do you know any people like Sampson? Do you know anyone with different gifts than Sampson whose failings gets him/her into trouble.

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Most people do, but no teaching is presented on how to prevent or get out of the situation. It's more of a hero legend than a story for teaching. It could be used as an example of what not to do or the need for self control, but I don't see a clear lesson from the story itself.

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And aren't the religious meanings besides the point here. I agree that for all of the passages that I've cited, the religious meanings of the scriptures are more important than the secular ones. So what?

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I'm asking you and have asked you before what the secular ones are! Good grief it's like pulling teeth. This is a discussion board.

The thread isn't about how many times the word wisdom is used in the Bible. It is about verses or stories that actually teach us and hopefully make us wiser. It has nothing to do with science.I really didn't think this topic was going to be so difficult.