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Author Topic:   Something BIG is coming! (AIG trying to build full sized ark)
Granny Magda
Member
Posts: 2380
From: UK
Joined: 11-12-2007


Message 58 of 261 (595350)
12-08-2010 7:55 AM
Reply to: Message 46 by Deleted
12-06-2010 2:13 AM


Hi PrinceGhaldir,

Well, it seems that quite a lot of people want to see the ark float.

Well, that's because it's easy to see AiG building this and then claiming that they have somehow proved the ark to be feasible. If they don't float it, they have proved no such thing.

The whole park will cost 150 million dollars, of which AiG will provide 24,5 million.

How about the profits? Where do they go?

The park will be build eco friendly.

In my opinion, building a 150 million dollar white elephant could never be eco friendly. The whole project is a massive waste of resources. Where are they going to source their "Gopher wood"? Is that a hardwood? Hard to see how that could be considered green.

In the pressconference (which you can see on YouTube or on their site) they say it will be able to float, although they wont do that

That is exactly the sort of claim that people are objecting to. So AiG thinks it will float? Then float it! Not going to float it? Then don't claim it floats! If AiG want to claim that their silly boat is seaworthy, they have to send it out to sea. Anything else falls into the category of "Making Shit Up".

I mean, if I built a rocket in my back yard and claimed that it could take me all the way to Mars, wouldn't you want to see me go to Mars? Or would you just take my word for it?

I dont completely see why you all are doubting the ark can be build?

Because it's frickin' huge! The ark dwarfs any contemporaneous vessel. Even much later, much more sophisticated ships couldn't match that size. It's simply too big to hold together on the water, let alone in the cruel waters of the flud.

It has already been designed, no offence, but I do think that naval engineers know better then you do (yes, naval engineers designed it).

Did they have naval engineers in the Bronze Age? I don't think they did...

Of course, if you're going to fall back on that line of reasoning, then geologists tell us that there never was a global flood, so no need for any ark. It simply never existed. I do think that geologists know better than you do, eh?

Mutate and Survive

Edited by Granny Magda, : No reason given.


On two occasions I have been asked, – "Pray, Mr. Babbage, if you put into the machine wrong figures, will the right answers come out?" ... I am not able rightly to apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could provoke such a question. - Charles Babbage

This message is a reply to:
 Message 46 by Deleted, posted 12-06-2010 2:13 AM Deleted has acknowledged this reply

Replies to this message:
 Message 61 by bluegenes, posted 12-08-2010 8:49 AM Granny Magda has acknowledged this reply

    
Granny Magda
Member
Posts: 2380
From: UK
Joined: 11-12-2007


Message 67 of 261 (595578)
12-09-2010 11:39 AM
Reply to: Message 64 by Deleted
12-09-2010 10:34 AM


Floating on Blind Faith
Hi PG,

I guess theoraticaly it would float,

Really? Why? What "theory"? You seem to be taking this on trust.

How many boats have been build, only to sink in water?

That's precisely my point! There have been plenty of disasters at sea. What specific, concrete reason can you present to suggest that this would not be one of them?

Granny writes:

How about the profits? Where do they go?

Prince Ghaldir writes:

I will just quote the website to avoid wrong interpretations:

That quote doesn't really cover where the profits end up, but it sounds like they will be used to continue proselytising for AiG's uniquely insane version of fundamentalist Christianity; aided by over a hundred million dollars of state funds. Separation of church and state anyone?

Granny writes:

Where are they going to source their "Gopher wood"? Is that a hardwood? Hard to see how that could be considered green.

Prince Ghaldir writes:

They are using other woods IIRC, it is mentioned in the press conference.

That quote doesn't mention what wood they are using, but even if it did, it still does not address the simple fact that squandering precious and finite resources on a purposeless white elephant can never be environmentally friendly. Almost all human activities have an environmental cost. It's a question of whether the benefits outweigh the cost. The alleged benefits of this project seem to be exclusively geared toward spreading AiG's crazy delusions to impressionable rubes. Forgive me, but I don't consider that to be a valid use of resources.

I would certainly take calculations for it, if your rocket would fly to Mars according to your calculations (which I checked). I would certainly believe you.

Ah! A maths graduate! You are a maths graduate right? Otherwise, what on Earth would make you think that you would be able to understand the maths involved. Fluid dynamics is an extremely complex subject. Assuming that you can casually pick it up and immediately understand it strikes me as both frighteningly naive and astonishingly arrogant.

Then of course, we have the small problem that you haven't presented any maths. Where is your maths? Where is AiG's maths? You would demand calculations for my rocket but you seem happy to accept AiG's word for it that their boat would float without them presenting any calculations at all.

Again, this comes across as deeply naive and lacking in due scepticism. If that is your attitude, I have some money resting in a Nigerian bank account that might interest you...

The tower in Dubai is also "frickin' huge", and it still stands because of a few(/sarcasm) calculations. Why wouldn't the ark?

Please try to keep up; I wasn't asking about whether the "ark" would stand up. I was wondering whether it would float.

The tower doesn't float.

The tower is not built with Bronze Age materials.

The tower is actually standing as we speak, so I believe that it can stand.

The "ark" is not floating, nor is it likely to do so, so why should I take it on blind faith that it will float?

There is no comparison.

Granny writes:

Did they have naval engineers in the Bronze Age? I don't think they did...

Prince Ghaldir writes:

Since when does the evolutionary timescale count for biblical stories?

So you're just going to gloss over the fact that AiG are intending to use modern expertise that did not exist in the time that the original ark was supposedly built? Oh. Okay.

The reason that AiG should accept a conventional time scale for their project is because they want to claim that the ark myths are more than a "stories". They want to claim that those events were real. That means they have to use a real time-line, one that fits in with all the relevant evidence, not just the evidence that they find convenient. Of course, they won't do this, preferring instead to go with the methodology known as "Making Shit Up".

Evolution of course, has nothing to do with it, beyond the lazy habit of using the term "evolutionist" to describe anyone who disagrees with a fundamentalist/evangelical Christian.

And other geologists say there was a global flood. And I cant find scientists say the Ark cant be build...

Really? have you tried... looking?

The overwhelming consensus of expert geological opinion is that there was no flood. That renders this whole Snark hunt completely pointless. It also means that you don't get to use naked arguments from authority. Just because AiG's pet engineers claim the boat can float does not mean it will. The only way to prove that is to float the damn thing, something that AiG will never do because they know only too well that it won't work.

Mutate and Survive


On two occasions I have been asked, – "Pray, Mr. Babbage, if you put into the machine wrong figures, will the right answers come out?" ... I am not able rightly to apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could provoke such a question. - Charles Babbage

This message is a reply to:
 Message 64 by Deleted, posted 12-09-2010 10:34 AM Deleted has acknowledged this reply

    
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