On the evolution of English as a written or spoken language.

It's named after the town in England, which we pronounce 'Luff - burra' (with the a being more of a schwa, and the 'burra' verging on one syllable.As for 'to be', that's irregular in every language I've ever come across, even ones with hardly any irregular verbs.

I'm not sure how we could even begin to make such a comparison given that we are dealing with two entirely distinct media.Jon

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Check out No webpage found at provided URL: Apollo's Temple!
Ignorance is temporary; you should be able to overcome it. - nwr

The context of the g changed its pronunciation.This is why a draught (Am. E. "draft") horse drags or draws a dray. The gh, g, w, and y all originate with a g that then changed its pronunciation in different ways.

I am trying to think, but I cannot conceive of a case in which such 'gh' is pronounced [f] that does not involve (at least historically/orthographically) a preceding rounded (labialized) vowel/f/ also being labial.Of course, the conditional doesn't go the other way for some reason; that's always puzzled menot enuff to investigate, tho.Jon

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Check out No webpage found at provided URL: Apollo's Temple!
Ignorance is temporary; you should be able to overcome it. - nwr

I guess they then go for a draught beer. Speaking of beer and the Aenglish Language. When I was in Australia on R & R from Vietnam, an Aussie guy said Hi to me and turned to the bar keep and stated, "Give the Yank a pint of Piss."

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There is no better love between 2 people than mutual respect for each other WT Young, 2002Who gave anyone the authority to call me an authority on anything. WT Young, 1969Since Evolution is only ~90% correct it should be thrown out and replaced by Creation which has even a lower % of correctness. W T Young, 2008

Eric Idle as an Aussie: American beer is like making love in a canoe. F**king close to water!

He's got a point.

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There is no better love between 2 people than mutual respect for each other WT Young, 2002Who gave anyone the authority to call me an authority on anything. WT Young, 1969Since Evolution is only ~90% correct it should be thrown out and replaced by Creation which has even a lower % of correctness. W T Young, 2008

Just saw a neat story about English on NPR

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Tourism is one of Zanzibar's main industries, and learning English is vital to attain a highly-prized hotel job. It's their ticket out of the hardscrabble life their parents lead in the fishing industry.

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But their primary school education was all in Swahili. Now that their high school is taught in English as the law requires, the students can hardly read the questions on the science quiz, let alone absorb the science.

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What do you think?Edited by Phat, : No reason given.Edited by Phat, : fixed quote

I think the people want to learn English (and other European languages) but their oppressive nationalistic governments, instead of serving the interests of their people, are more interestedoften by the advice of arrogant linguistsin serving the interests of their culture or nation.This is part of the broader worldwide Multiculturalism movement. While the people themselves would rather be taught the languages that help them in the world, global hippies continue to push for 'education in the native tongue' and other oppressive policies that retard development, putting cultures over people, with their only upside being that they will, eventually, make sure these languages end up dead and buried (as their speakers desire) instead of preserved.Oh; and what does this have to do with 'ghoti'?

I forgot to change the sub title. I suppose that my reaction to the NPR article was that Young people are wired to think in their language and cultural expression and yet required to learn English in order to succeed at business. I watched a bit of their movie and was empathetic to their passion. Just by making the movie they (the filmmakers) were able to communicate their heart and passion to me despite knowing few ways to express it in English.

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The film examines one of the oldest debates in African education. Should classes be taught in the colonial language of English (or French) or in local languages that students speak and understand more fluently?

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You say 'required' as though they are being forced. The reality is that most want to learn the European languages. People who fight to push native languages into education are fighting against the wishes of those being educated, and if they aren't, they are certainly fighting against their best interests.And sometimes it is a big effort, since some languages need orthographies developed, textbooks written, etc.

It seems to me to be the exact opposite of multiculturalism. It's imposing the English language on native speakers so they can compete in a world economy that's dominated by Western corporate interests.I'd like to know what you mean by "putting cultures over people." Aren't cultures worth preserving? If economic expediency threatens the survival of communities, cultures, and language, doesn't that indicate a problem with globalist economics?

No one is 'imposing the English language'. People are dying to learn it. Of course not. Cultures don't matter. People matter. If the people don't want their culture, or some aspect of it, then let them throw it away and pick up something they like better. It doesn't matter. The people want European languages, and European languages will benefit them most. It's time to stop the nonsense of 'preserving culture' and start helping people.

They're not eager to learn English so they can read Shakespeare. They're doing it because (as they say in the movie linked in Phat's post) they prefer employment in tourist hotels to rural poverty. Problem is, culture comes with people. And it sounds like you're defining culture in a very consumerist way, as if the shared history of a community is just like other any item you acquire and discard whenever the mood strikes you. Only it's not about helping them in postcolonial Africa, it's about exploiting them. It's not as if there's a level playing field or a power equilibrium. Europeans still call the shots, and you seem just fine with that.

And because they can actually be educated in English since, you know, there're actually textbooks, research papers, and other educated people to talk to in English (and French, and German, and Spanish, and...).The people who want education in the native language are people who have already been educated in English and enjoy the International audience and opportunities they have as a result; and they turn around and fight vehemently to deny that opportunity to others.They are no better than rich Republicans with their 'I got my money, now screw you' attitude; except that the Republicans know they are fucking over the poor, while these language people have some twisted disease that tells them they are doing good.It's disgusting that these people put their academic ideologies over the lives of real flesh and blood human beings. Huh? People want to change their practices; speak another language; learn different worldviews.Should they be allowed to? Should a free democratic government fertilize that desire or attempt to drown it? Nonsense.It's about people who want to change something about their lives; people who have made the decision en masse that they want to learn in a European language.And it's about the people who will stop at nothing to make sure that never happens.