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Author Topic:   Intelligent (maybe), but far from perfect
crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1488 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 6 of 91 (50865)
08-18-2003 1:38 PM
Reply to: Message 5 by Dan Carroll
08-18-2003 1:03 PM


Yeah, how about a spine that's a little more stable than a stack of quarters? A skull actually built to stand on top of the neck? Female legs that are straight enough not to cause major knee problems?
Not to mention the frailty of age. Perfectly consistent with evolution but makes no sense in a creationist framework.

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crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1488 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 12 of 91 (50978)
08-19-2003 4:03 AM
Reply to: Message 11 by Andya Primanda
08-19-2003 3:50 AM


Batman can easily be dismissed because we know that people made Batman.
Not so. The guy at DC Comics was simply expounding and elaborating on the inner "Batman conciousness" that we all possess - the deep, abiding need we all have that can only be fulfilled by loving, personal relationship with Batman.

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crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1488 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 25 of 91 (51117)
08-19-2003 1:01 PM
Reply to: Message 23 by Mammuthus
08-19-2003 12:47 PM


The presence of a designer, perhaps? One with the power to create life?
I mean, I wouldn't assume Mount Rushmore had been created unless I knew about the existence of designers with the power to carve stone. I.e. sculptors. Trying to infer a designer from a potential design - given the existence of designer-less design - seems backwards.

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 Message 23 by Mammuthus, posted 08-19-2003 12:47 PM Mammuthus has replied

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 Message 26 by Mammuthus, posted 08-20-2003 4:14 AM crashfrog has replied

  
crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1488 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 35 of 91 (51353)
08-20-2003 9:59 AM
Reply to: Message 26 by Mammuthus
08-20-2003 4:14 AM


I am not advocating the position mind you...
Yes, I realize that. I'm mostly just thinking aloud.
we can tell when something is designed by humans i.e. clovis artifacts, Mt. Rushmore etc...
Right, because as humans ourselves we're exposed to the idea of humans making things. And that's how we find out if a thing had been designed, in the past - comparing it to things that are being designed right now.
On the other hand, there's no aspect to a clovis point that you could use to infer the existence of humans if you didn't already know that humans exist. There's no magic design essence that is imparted to those things that are designed, so the answer to your question:
what would indicate it in a natural system.
would be, in my opinion, "nothing at all." There's no part of an object that can tell you it was designed unless you're looking at a part specifically designed for the purpose of telling you it was designed. (The "maker's mark" idea.)
Life is nothing like anything we've ever seen designed. Ergo it seems reasonable to me to assume that it was not designed.

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crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1488 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 60 of 91 (233681)
08-16-2005 1:06 PM
Reply to: Message 59 by Darwin's Terrier
08-16-2005 12:57 PM


Re: via deeper physics
The problem is that Randman sees quantum mechanics not as an approximate description of the behavior of very small things, but as a scientific basis for magic.

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 Message 59 by Darwin's Terrier, posted 08-16-2005 12:57 PM Darwin's Terrier has replied

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crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1488 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 74 of 91 (403182)
06-01-2007 9:37 AM
Reply to: Message 73 by tcroth01
06-01-2007 3:00 AM


Re: Reason for Imperfection, Disease etc
Originally Adam and Eve had perfect health but due to their disobedience, death entered to human family.
What evidence do you have for your contention that diseases are caused not by biological agents or congenital flaws but by "disobedience?" According to you, we should find that the disobedient have a higher incidence of disease.
Do you have evidence that's the case? If there's no evidence for that, would we be justified in considering it a strike against literal truth of the Bible?

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