Change In Egypt

well, looking at it this way I would say I support US intervention, because we are going to need SIGINT and ELINT on the area, and that would mean alot of work for me.but that is my greedy take on it, if i step back from myself for a minute, I would hope western powers would allow the Egyptians to make the call. I want to not be greedy about this one.

While the plight of the citizens in Egypt might be insufficient to justify intervention, the fact of geography could definitely generate enough reason to force an intervention.The Suez Canal is still a necessary international resource.

---

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

I know what you're trying to say here, but this could be carried to a preposterous extreme that the USA has a right to the oil in the middle east because it is a necessary resource, the diamonds in South Africa, the exotic wood from the Amazon jungle, penguin dust from Antarctica, sulfur from Jupiter's moon Io...and so on.Yes. The time to ship to the world is drastically affected by an interruption to the Suez Canal, but that is not a justification for the USA to rule over it. The USA is thousands of miles away.Penguin Dust???

---

- xongsmith, 5.7d

We were discussing UN action, not US unilateral actions.

---

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

I think this is the natural way of things for a young and new republic. The Egyptian Republic is only 57 years old (it will be 58 in june). For thousands of years Egypt was not ruled by Egyptians, I could be wrong but I think no Egyptian ruled Egypt from the time of Alexander the Great (300s bce) till 1953 ce. Gamel abd-al Nasser was the 1st Egyptian ruler (of Egypt) in over 2000 years. He was popular, but really set up the government that exists today almost 58 years later. there were some reforms and much improvement, but Nasser failed to introduce democracy and was also a human rights bad guy. He did resign from office (after the six day war), but he left the country in poor shape. one also has to look at the times in the late 1960s most of the world was involved in the "cold war", Nasser was better friends with Krushchev, than with the US. The USSR helped with the Asswan High Dam, not the Unites States. His (Nasser's) successor, Anwar Sadat, probably realized that war with Israel would not work, and therefore made peace with them, much to the dismay of the rest of the Arab World (Egypt was ejected from the Arab League because of it), but it was a popular idea in Egypt at the time. This is when the US became friends with Egypt (I think Jimmy Carter was the President then). Sadat brought in a multi-party system, and Infitah (allowing private investment and focusing more on the free market). He was very different from Nasser, and may have brought the change that was needed, but he was assassinated by Islamic Fundamentalists in 1981. Hosni Mubarak has been in power ever since. Mubarak while not as progressive as Sadat, has kept the nation relatively stable, and further edeared himself to the west in 1991 during the gulf war, but using the Egyptian army to assit the coalition in removing Iraqi Forces from Kuwait (I think the Egyptians were the 1st Arabs to help). He has been corrupt, and extremly unfair with his detractors, but in a part of the world where we have few allies he is one of them. He has been lucky for a long time (only slightly injured in 1981 when Sadat was killed), and gaining much favor for opposing Saddam Hussien immidiatelty. it seems his luck ran out when stable Tunisia overthrew its dictator in similar fashion last month, and gave the go ahead for the Egyptians to join in.I wonder if the Hussiens of Jordan, the Gaddafis of Libya, and the Alaouites of Morocco are getting nervous, I would think the Alaouites have the most to fear but that is another topic.While I doubt and hope this does not cause a civil war, it is time for a change, time for civil liberties, time for human rights, time for a modern democratic system of government, and this to me just seems to be what is going on. Its sort of a natural evolution of the government of a state.

It depends on what one calls a Egyptian. The modern Egyptians are transplanted Arabs and in this case the Egyptians still have not ruled Egypt since before the Hellenics in the 4th Century BCE.

---

There is no better love between 2 people than mutual respect for each other WT Young, 2002

​

Who gave anyone the authority to call me an authority on anything. WT Young, 1969

​

Since Evolution is only ~90% correct it should be thrown out and replaced by Creation which has even a lower % of correctness. W T Young, 2008

Well, according to Atticus Finch's daughter, Scout, it all in how you walk - which was later turned into a pop song.

---

- xongsmith, 5.7d

what would cause you to think that? would you say that no one survives of ancient world because they identify as a different name today Babylonians/Iraqis, Persians/Iranians, Romans/Italians, Celts/Irish-Welsh-Scots-Bretons, Gauls/French, Teutons/Germans, Nubians/Sudanese, Carthaginians/Tunisians, Cappadocians/Turks?what do you think happened to the original Egyptians? I think they are still there, I also think if you compared the DNA profile of Modern Egyptians to that of the Pharaohs (some data we have), that you would find that modern Egyptians are definitely descendants of the Ancient Egyptians, heck I bet someone already has done that.

You are missing one point. Yes there are probably descendants of ancient Egyptians, but most of their "blood" is Arab. How many Danites, Hittites, Assyrians, Etruscans or Sumerians are around today? Historically my ancestors came from Ireland, Scotland & France by way of Canada where some Algonkian was mixed in. The French is probably a mix of Keltic & Romance. and The Irish-Scotch probably has some Teutonic. Migrations, conquerings and inter marriage destroys true ethnicity. Edited by bluescat48, : sp

---

There is no better love between 2 people than mutual respect for each other WT Young, 2002

​

Who gave anyone the authority to call me an authority on anything. WT Young, 1969

​

Since Evolution is only ~90% correct it should be thrown out and replaced by Creation which has even a lower % of correctness. W T Young, 2008

ORLY? It seems I am not alone in disagreeing with you. yet it creates others, it's another evolution of sorts. ethnicities that weren't exposed to others would find themselves in a genetic bottle-neck, and would kill themselves off if true and isolated.

Agreed. Apart from anything else, I feel that the longer the lid is kept on the just aspirations of the Egyptian people, the more violent the reaction will be when (as I think is inevitable) they have a successful revolution. If it happens now, then the Muslim Brotherhood may win a majority in a democratically elected parliament. If there's another twenty years of oppression, then they might establish an Iranian-style theocracy.I say, lift the lid. We in America have a religious right, but they haven't destroyed democracy --- they are amongst its most enthusiastic participants.---Having written this, I become humorously aware of my own impotence in this matter. Does history give a flying fuck what I think? We sit here and pontificate about what would be a desirable outcome, but unless we're on the streets of Cairo we might as well be on the moon.Edited by Dr Adequate, : No reason given.

I'd like to see some scientific rather than cultural evidence.

---

There is no better love between 2 people than mutual respect for each other WT Young, 2002

​

Who gave anyone the authority to call me an authority on anything. WT Young, 1969

​

Since Evolution is only ~90% correct it should be thrown out and replaced by Creation which has even a lower % of correctness. W T Young, 2008

Actually, they were returning the favor. A group of Mulsims shielded the Copics for Christmas.http://onfaith.washingtonpost.com/...tic_christmas_mass.html

Mubarak is out, but who is in?Will this be a coup or a transition?

---

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

I am going to wait for the dust to settle on this one.

---

Jesus was a liberal hippie