Is my rock designed?

Bio-molecularTony writes: Rocks can occur naturally where as life can not. No one has done it or ever will without brains.

It seems to me that bacteria are able to reproduce. Can you show me the 'brain' in a given sample of a species of bacteria?

Cells create structure, and so it is not a natural process.

My wife and I created a daughter who is made of cells. Are you saying we did this through some unnatural process?

Tested and proven.

I believe that reproduction indeed has been tested and proven as I not only have personal experience in this matter but also see the evidence virtually everywhere I look. So why do you consider it unnatural?

Edited by anglagard, : forget it, use new post

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Read not to contradict and confute, not to believe and take for granted, not to find talk and discourse, but to weigh and consider - Francis Bacon

The more we understand particular things, the more we understand God - Spinoza

Bio-molecularTony writes: God has all the time in the world. He can create the process and let the rocks and sand form themselves - within the laws of physical matter, etc. Man (life) is different. Sand is made from the erosion of rocks. Life is not. Rocks are not superhuman technology as is life. Matter could be referred as technology but not rocks in them selves. Rocks can occur naturally where as life can not. No one has done it or ever will without brains. Cells create structure, and so it is not a natural process. Rocks become sand by many natural processes. Tested and proven.

Pardon me for being a bit flippant before, but your posts beg some serious quote mining as they are not carefully constructed IMO.

Now as to cells creating structure and rocks not creating structure. While cells do have a complex structure, I think it is important to point out that 'rocks' are also structured according to the same rules of chemistry as cells, just on a more basic level. If you have ever viewed a rock under a microscope, you would notice that it is made up of crystals, which are quite 'structured.' In fact, one of the speculations concerning abiogenensis involves crystal structure imparting itself upon organic molecules due to electrostatic forces and therefore organizing such organic molecules into self-replicating precursors to what is commonly referred to as life.

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Read not to contradict and confute, not to believe and take for granted, not to find talk and discourse, but to weigh and consider - Francis Bacon

The more we understand particular things, the more we understand God - Spinoza

Bio-molecularTony writes: DNA automation is the intelligence built into your sub-level systems - which you know nothing about or how they work.

Please feel free to elaborate. Are you saying that such "DNA automation" is inherently unknowable or are you claiming to be the judge of what I personally do or do not know?

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Read not to contradict and confute, not to believe and take for granted, not to find talk and discourse, but to weigh and consider - Francis Bacon

The more we understand particular things, the more we understand God - Spinoza

Bio-molecularTony writes: When we get to rocks we find a fork in the road of upper complexity. Rocks are not more complex then sandy beaches, mountains, seas, etc.

How is a crystal more disordered than a sandy beach? What is your definition of complexity? Does complexity mean disorder or order?

Please feel free to define your terms.

So far, I see a lot of pronouncements without any evidence or indeed much examination or clarity.

For example:

Life is really an illusion of bio-technology.

What does that mean? life is an illusion as taught in some parts of Buddhism or Hinduism? we live in the matrix? The definition of life is fuzzy? The definition of life is limited to what a bio-technologist would say?

Please consider being more precise in your statements by using examples of what you mean.

Edited by anglagard, : add all after feel free to define your terms

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Read not to contradict and confute, not to believe and take for granted, not to find talk and discourse, but to weigh and consider - Francis Bacon

The more we understand particular things, the more we understand God - Spinoza

Bio-molecularTony writes: Though "nature hates a vacuum (or a charge)". There seams to be this chemical cycle which "living" system use. You may find pockets of chemicals that have potential energy if they came in contact with other chemical. But in a local area for the most part everything has no charge or potential. Batteries will naturally go dead - for there are not "closed systems" in nature (Lot2). So to find such a charged Battery would be “made” that way. Lemons are batteries too, but they too are made that way – genetically designed and built intelligently.Rocks have no change and no chemical potential cycle to speak of.

Presuming you mean 'charge' instead of 'change' the statement "Rocks have no change {sic - charge} and no chemical potential cycle to speak of" is false.

Piezoelectricity

Well Logging

Electrical Resistivity Tomography

Of course if you really meant "rocks have no change" then that statement is even more absurd.

Just to let you know for reasons of disclosure, I have taken several university classes that covered the latter two links.

Edited by anglagard, : make it clear I am dealing with last sentence

Edited by anglagard, : more precise last link and commentary

Edited by anglagard, : add 'taken' before university in last sentence for reasons of clarity

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Read not to contradict and confute, not to believe and take for granted, not to find talk and discourse, but to weigh and consider - Francis Bacon

The more we understand particular things, the more we understand God - Spinoza