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Author Topic:   Catholics & Inerrancy
Theodoric
Member (Idle past 6 days)
Posts: 7051
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005


Message 38 of 89 (615143)
05-10-2011 4:09 PM
Reply to: Message 37 by GDR
05-10-2011 10:18 AM


I'm absolutely convinced that the sun will rise tomorrow and that I'll be alive to see it. Verifying that is a little tougher.

Again you are talking about faith. That isn't what ScientificBob was referring to.

Bob is referring to something you believe happened that is unverifiable. The future, by virtue of being the future, is unverifiable. Not the same thing at all.


Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

This message is a reply to:
 Message 37 by GDR, posted 05-10-2011 10:18 AM GDR has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 39 by GDR, posted 05-10-2011 5:27 PM Theodoric has responded

  
Theodoric
Member (Idle past 6 days)
Posts: 7051
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005


Message 40 of 89 (615156)
05-10-2011 7:55 PM
Reply to: Message 39 by GDR
05-10-2011 5:27 PM


How about Caesar crossing the Rubicon? I believe it happened but I can't verify other than by what someone else has recorded.

Nope.
There are many contemporary sources for Caesar crossing the Rubicon. There are none for the resurrection. None.


Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

This message is a reply to:
 Message 39 by GDR, posted 05-10-2011 5:27 PM GDR has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 41 by GDR, posted 05-10-2011 9:24 PM Theodoric has responded

  
Theodoric
Member (Idle past 6 days)
Posts: 7051
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005


Message 42 of 89 (615159)
05-10-2011 9:42 PM
Reply to: Message 41 by GDR
05-10-2011 9:24 PM


I'm not sure how you figure that. The contemporay sources would all be based on the original stories, as are contemporary sources that write about the resurrection.

No you are wrong. We know the provenance of many sources that were contemporary to Caesar that write about and attest to his life. We also have Caesars writings that we have provenance for.

We ain't got crap for Jesus. There is nothing AT ALL about the resurrection or anything about the life of Jesus until at least 40 years after his supposed death. Paul tells us almost nothing about the life of Jesus.


Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

This message is a reply to:
 Message 41 by GDR, posted 05-10-2011 9:24 PM GDR has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 43 by GDR, posted 05-10-2011 10:18 PM Theodoric has responded

  
Theodoric
Member (Idle past 6 days)
Posts: 7051
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005


Message 47 of 89 (615224)
05-11-2011 2:43 PM
Reply to: Message 43 by GDR
05-10-2011 10:18 PM


There would still be eyewitnesses around when the first letters were written even if the stories weren't being told by those who were witnesses which is most likely the case.

Funny how there are no records of these eyewitnesses.

The guys that got involved in this dedicated their lives to it which I can't see happening if they weren't convinced of the truth of the resurrection. In addition the faith grew rapidly and sustained that growth which I can't see happening if the resurrection is just a fable.

Your incredulousness has no affect on reality.

There have been lots of times lots of people have believed things that were not true.

There are other threads to hash this out.


Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

This message is a reply to:
 Message 43 by GDR, posted 05-10-2011 10:18 PM GDR has not yet responded

  
Theodoric
Member (Idle past 6 days)
Posts: 7051
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005


Message 88 of 89 (617155)
05-26-2011 9:03 AM
Reply to: Message 87 by GDR
05-26-2011 1:20 AM


That would be true of any distant historical writing. We have to come to our own conclusions about its veracity.

Not at all. Historical writing will have a provenance and other independent confirmations. The majority of the NT is by anonymous authors. The author we know the most about only has writings that are included in the bible.

The historians of the age tended to have multiple writings. Also, their writings were mentioned by other people. There are multiple lines of verification. We cam follow the provenance of a lot of the writings of the age.

To state that we have to take historical writings on faith as we would have to the bible is is disingenuous at best.


Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

This message is a reply to:
 Message 87 by GDR, posted 05-26-2011 1:20 AM GDR has responded

Replies to this message:
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