Group of atheists has filed a lawsuit

The problem with religions is the villifications of others, inculcated since childhood, with no proof of any of the charges.IMHO, the future of humanity fully depends on belief via laws agreed to by humanity, as opposed preferred revered names, and mandating any scripture with unfound charges be forbidden. There is no alternative to this for humanity's future. This may also be the underlying reason why groups of humanity are beginning to rebel. Two of the world's biggest religions rely pivotally on villifications of others as their fulcrum pillars, and would crash without it. Some one should start a thread what laws are acceptable for humanity as a whole, applying equally to all.

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All the arguments that can be made for including the cross can be made for your hypothetical heart. None of the arguments against the cross really apply. So yes there is no reason not to include it at all.

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Its all in the fine print. Love, according to the cross followers, also says those who do not toe the line of the cross by signing on the dotted line are damned forever to a very hot place for a very long time: what a waste of fuel, at least! It is mandated as a belief irrespective if the targeted ones are otherwise nice folk. This is the associating factor which impacts on other groups, but may not be in the radar of the followers. It was soon followed by a counter doctrine, ITS A BLESSING TO KILL AN INFIDEL.What's for encores of all these wonderful spoonfuls of love and belief?

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Well feel free to start such a thread. But I would suggest that the golden rule is the closest to a human universal we can find.

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Don't know what you mean by golden rule. Mine is:WHAT IS HATEFUL TO YOU - DO NOT UNTO OTHERS.

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So I spose the obvious question to ask in this context is how the Christians affected by 9/11 would respond if instead of a cross it was a giant statue of Vishnu or something being proposed at the memorial museum?

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No sir. I admire America as a Christian country - especially because it is the best savior of Christianity - saving it from medevial Europe. Christian America flaunted Europe with the Constitution, perhaps one of the greatest documents humanity possesses. Europe did great damage to the symbol of the cross.

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Well I did link to it.......? It is a quite common concept in one form or another.

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Common yes, but this is because Christianity has the biggest following, not because its golden rule is better than the one I gave you.

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IAJ writes:
I admire America as a Christian country

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And therein lies the problem. Because very arguably in the sort of sense being discussed it isn't supposed to overtly favour any one religion over any other.

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Yes, but Europe was overtly wrong, unlike America.

I would say that the factor of reciprocity is the same as WHAT IS HATEFUL TO YOU - DO NOT UNTO OTHERS.

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Europe is wrong about what? I have no idea what you are referring to.

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Europe's history as a Christian block is horrific, mass murdering more humans than Poll Pot, Rome, Babylon and ancient Egypt combined. Europe did so by following the doctrine:WHAT IS GOOD FOR YOU - DO UNTO OTHERS. [Read, woe to any who refuse!].

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That's not the Golden Rule. That's the Silver Rule. And no, I'm not making that up.

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The Golden Rule is, as everyone knows, "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you."

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Put your thinking cap on. Isabela of Spain killed off 1000's of innocent folk with that same doctrine, boasting 'BETTER TO DESTROY THEIR BODIES AND SAVE THEIR SOULS".Does anyone remember an empire called Spain anymore! Her evil deeds made Europe irrelevent, ushering the founding of America - by a hidden Jew.Penicilin saves. Penicilin kills. Edited by IamJoseph, : No reason given.

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And yet Europe is doing so much better than America.

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Don't you mean Eurostan?

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the cross had significance

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This was a pre-christian Jewish symbol, emerging after Rome invaded Judea around 150 BCE. It was meant to signify an omen of death [cricifixion; a Roman doctrine]. It became a Christian symbol after 400 CE.

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You claimed that the Golden Rule is "Do not do unto others as you would not have them do unto you." That's not the Golden Rule. That's the Silver Rule.

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What does Isabella have to do with that?

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The golden rule I suggested is the true golden one, from a Hebrew sage 150 BCE. I tried to show you how Isabela used the European golden rule, imposing her will to cause 1000's to be killed in the 15th Century. What is good for Europe may be death to others from a different belief and culture. I tried to show you that while penicilin can save lives, it can also kill those who have no tolerance for it. Pls consider if you would like another to do unto you what they think is good for themselves - irrespective of your own preference and will? One golden rule is racist and hell bent on domination and potential genocide. Think it over.

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And yet Europe is doing so much better than America.
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Don't you mean Eurostan?

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Huh? There is no such place.

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The terms Eurostan and Londonistan are the subject of two best selling books of things to come, with Paristan coming out soon: these emminent books speak for themselves. The big picture says if a law suit needs to be made, it should be directed at Europe: the greatest post-W.W.II crime is the corruption of the Balfour Declaration, which carved off 80% of a tiny land allocated for the Jews. This most evil deed remains illegal, perpetrated under extreme duress when the Jews were totally helpless following W.W.II.It was followed by serial 2-state demands in the same land and the re-transfer of the name Palestinian from Jews onto those openly panting for another holocaust. Rocket science what its intentions are, yet all Christians remained deathly silent. Eurostan is a payback - using the same tools and weapons planed for Israel. All for 30 barrels of oil, giving BORN IN SIN a whole new non-virtual meaning.

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words do not mean what you choose them to mean.

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Words mean what they mean, not what someone says it means.

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The phrase, "The Golden Rule," has a very specific meaning: "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you." We get that you don't like this meaning being attached to that phrase, but that's your problem.

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I showed you how this can be used to commit mass murder, as in Spain.

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"Do not do unto others what you would not have them do unto you" is also a very ancient philosophy...but it is known as the "Silver Rule."

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How about Platinum?

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Are you having trouble with the idea that Hillel put forward both?

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I showed that any alternative to what I suggested is open to mis-use. The Nazis did to others what was good for them; so did depraved Rome; so did Islam in India.

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I tried to show you how Isabela used the European golden rule
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No, you didn't. You brought in a non sequitur. Isabella I's actions have no connection to the Golden Rule.

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Try this lovely one, made with a decree to convert or die - because its good for Spain thus also for you:'BETTER TO DESTROY THER BODIES AND SAVE THEIR SOULS".Gee thanks.

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Nor does penicillin have anything to do with the Golden or Silver Rules.

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Its a most fitting metaphor.

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You really need to stop and go back to read the history of philosophy. Confucius not enamored of the Golden Rule. When asked about the Golden Rule's admonition to repay evil with kidness, he replied: "Then with what will you repay kindness?" It's why Martin Luther King, Jr. and Gandhi expounded the Silver Rule: While it's wrong to do evil to your enemy, that doesn't mean you have to take it, either. Resist, but non-violently.

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I highly recommend you read Carl Sagan's article regarding philosophy and the ideas of the Golden, Silver, Brazen, and Iron Rules.

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Hint: I am not questioning your valuation of the Golden or Silver Rules. I am simply pointing out that the phrase, "The Golden Rule," specifically and solely means: "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you." If you are referring to a different philsophy, then you cannot call that other philosophy, "The Golden Rule," because that already means something else. The philosophy you espoused, "Do not do unto others what you wouldn't have them do unto you," is specifically known as "The Silver Rule."

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As an example, I am not questioning a person's preference of "black" over "white." I am simply pointing out that the word "black" means the absence of color and cannot be arbitrarily redefined to mean something else.

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Hint. I see Hillel as transcendent of Sagan, King and Ghandi. Black is NOT the absence of color or light. I'd like to see a commemoration by honest Europeans which condemns Spain's history and this should be part of European education. Silence to evil is not a golden rule either.

Good on you. A remnant often beats a multitude in error. I brought this up to impress the multidue it is better not to do what is hateful to others, than to do what is good in one's own eyes. The latter is not a bad virtue, but it can be mis-used, and should thus be discretional only. The former is incumbent.

BREAKING!No theology or ideology has the patent on belief. This is a generic, inherent trait with all life, akin to love and breathing. It is also the easiest to exploit: if we are inculcated to believe in pink zebras, 99% would become Pink Zebraites and follow Pink Zebraism. But the math says all beliefs can't be right - they all contradict each other.Conclusion: There is no alternative to humanity being ruled under majestic laws, accepted and agreed by all humanity and equally applying to all. Its like the rules of the game which all players must follow. While belief has a potent place, the law should be transcendent; the former has to be validated by the latter. Most of the rebellion comes from the requirement the community at large has transcendent rights than the individual, which is sometimes seen as impinging on one personal liberties, and is also seen as socialism. These appear the two big polar points before humanity, each pointing in oppositte directions.What is forgotten is that personal liberties are also fully dependent on good laws, not on beliefs.

My history lessons say 1.1 million gave their lives to defend their beliefs against Rome, which was indeed the greatest sacrifice in recorded history. Care to mention the verse reference of that in the Gospels?

There is no alternative to humanity being governed by magestic laws instead of names. This is the true meaning of being monotheists. Christianity and Islam are in polar contradiction of each other, assuring only disaster ahead, and this insanity is only because of preferred names, which have become transcendent of the Creator. If one examines what is great about America - this is limited to the fact her constitution based itself on laws - it is thereby the savior of Christianity - saving it from medevial Europe. This is also the message from the greatest event in the universe, which was and is Sinai.That is the message to all groups of humanity, from atheists, buddhists, muslims, communists, creationists, evolutionists, whoever and whatever. Its not a multi-choice option; don't start such a thread because you will loose.