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EvC Forum Side Orders Coffee House Occupy Wall Street

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Author Topic:   Occupy Wall Street
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 306 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


(4)
Message 55 of 602 (636182)
10-04-2011 3:19 PM
Reply to: Message 50 by Omnivorous
10-04-2011 1:54 PM


Re: What George Said
The Tea Party is essentially an instrument of the religious right, insisting they are "Taxed Enough Already" when taxes are lower than they've been in most of their lifetimes. They deride Obama as a tax and spend liberal when he has cut taxes; they stockpile ammo and buy guns by the crate because Obama will take their guns away, while he has explicitly rejected any thought of doing so.
Oh, you're so naive. As the VP of the NRA has explained, not taking away their guns is part of a "massive Obama conspiracy" to take away their guns:
In public, he'll remind us that he's put off calls from his party to renew the Clinton ban, he hasn't pushed for new gun control laws [...] The president will offer the Second Amendment lip service and hit the campaign trail saying he's actually been good for the Second Amendment.
But it's a big fat stinking lie! It's all part of a massive Obama conspiracy to deceive voters and destroy the Second Amendment in our country.
Obama himself is no fool. So when he got elected, they concocted a scheme to stay away from the gun issue, lull gun owners to sleep and play us for fools in 2012. Well, gun owners are not fools and we are not fooled.
See?
Edited by Dr Adequate, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 50 by Omnivorous, posted 10-04-2011 1:54 PM Omnivorous has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 61 by xongsmith, posted 10-04-2011 3:40 PM Dr Adequate has not replied
 Message 70 by Omnivorous, posted 10-04-2011 6:01 PM Dr Adequate has not replied

  
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 306 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


Message 56 of 602 (636183)
10-04-2011 3:21 PM
Reply to: Message 51 by Coyote
10-04-2011 2:34 PM


Re: What George Said
Perhaps, although organized, the far left is much smaller than they would have you believe?
It's not the far left who describe everyone who isn't actually a registered Republican as being on the far left.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 51 by Coyote, posted 10-04-2011 2:34 PM Coyote has not replied

  
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 306 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


(3)
Message 103 of 602 (636760)
10-10-2011 5:00 PM
Reply to: Message 100 by Buzsaw
10-10-2011 4:30 PM


Re: Demand What Of Their Congressman?
What are they going to demand of their congressman, being most of them have no idea what they are protesting about, relative to Wall Street?
For starters, that Wall Street shouldn't get a second chance at destroying capitalism.
While these non-tax paying idle (many of whom are rag tag) routy mobs are on the streets, (abe: biting) the hands that feed them, the one's feeding them are working ever harder to pay the increased taxes levied on them to pay for the 2 years unemployment, etc.
Taxes have been cut, Buz. They are lower.
If they contact their congressman, they should advise him/her that they are willing to give up their techy stuff, food, trucking companies that truck the stuff, motorcycles, autos and all else that Wallstreet affords them.
Wall Street doesn't make any of those things. What they made was economic chaos. What they made was unemployment for the people whom you despise for being unemployed. If you hate the poor so much, couldn't you spare a little of that hatred for the people who made them poor?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 100 by Buzsaw, posted 10-10-2011 4:30 PM Buzsaw has not replied

Replies to this message:
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Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 306 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


Message 130 of 602 (636886)
10-11-2011 8:38 PM
Reply to: Message 119 by Buzsaw
10-11-2011 11:31 AM


Re: Demand What Of Their Congressman?
If you were a Fox News listener, you would be aware that Democrat congressmen, during the Bush Admin, and now the Obama Admin along with Democrat oversight congressmen were demanding the banks to dish out loans to people who couldn't afford them.
No, if you were a Fox News listener you'd be under the delusion that that was the case. 'Cos of being lied to.
The protesters are organized by the Obama backed unions, Obama crony, billionaire socialist George Soros, et al and other left wing anti-capitalist entities who, unlike the well mannered Tea Partiers, occupy the people's parks, streets and businesses.
And your evidence for this is ... ?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 119 by Buzsaw, posted 10-11-2011 11:31 AM Buzsaw has not replied

  
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 306 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


Message 131 of 602 (636887)
10-11-2011 8:40 PM
Reply to: Message 109 by Coyote
10-10-2011 11:47 PM


Re: An occupier rant
I certainly want nothing to do with that sort of nonsense.
So, already we've found one issue on which you agree with 99.999% of the protestors.

This message is a reply to:
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Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 306 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


(2)
Message 153 of 602 (637161)
10-13-2011 10:56 PM
Reply to: Message 150 by Buzsaw
10-13-2011 9:44 PM


Unwelcome
We shouldn't welcome illegal anybodies.
Yeah, that's what they thought in Georgia:
Thanks to the resulting labor shortage, Georgia farmers have been forced to leave millions of dollars’ worth of blueberries, onions, melons and other crops unharvested and rotting in the fields. It has also put state officials into something of a panic at the damage they’ve done to Georgia’s largest industry.
Barely a month ago, you might recall, Gov. Nathan Deal welcomed the TV cameras into his office as he proudly signed HB 87 into law. Two weeks later, with farmers howling, a scrambling Deal ordered a hasty investigation into the impact of the law he had just signed, as if all this had come as quite a surprise to him.
He has also set up a blue ribbon commission to investigate the potential downside of not locking the stable door.
Meanwhile, in Alabama ...
Alabama's new immigration law has already delivered "unintended consequences" across the state, said Agriculture Commissioner John McMillan.
The picking of blueberries, tomatoes and squash largely requires hand labor, McMillan said Monday, and the work is no longer getting done.
McMillan said he recently visited a farmer who has 75 acres of squash in north Jackson County.
"It was just rotting in the fields because he had half the labor," McMillan told The Huntsville Times editorial board. "That's a fact. What I'm telling you is what I've seen."
In related news, the Governor of Alabama is said to be contemplating a crackdown on geese that lay golden eggs. In a terse statement, his office has announced that they are to be "killed".

This message is a reply to:
 Message 150 by Buzsaw, posted 10-13-2011 9:44 PM Buzsaw has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 157 by frako, posted 10-14-2011 4:30 AM Dr Adequate has not replied

  
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 306 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


(2)
Message 156 of 602 (637199)
10-14-2011 3:40 AM



Replies to this message:
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Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 306 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


(4)
Message 165 of 602 (637336)
10-15-2011 12:34 AM
Reply to: Message 162 by Buzsaw
10-14-2011 8:41 PM


Re: Demand What Of Their Congressman?
I'm one of those Social Security recipients. I, along with most of us paid our dues/taxes for our SS retirement . I paid non-inflated hard earned $$ for 40 years to pay for the pittance of inflated $$ I'm getting back; about enough to keep me from freezing and starvation. Had I been allowed to invest all of this money in money markets, etc, I'd be living on easy street today. I was paying in 25 cent gasoline money and getting back $3.00 gasoline money.
No we seniors, many of whom were Tea Party participants, were not on the public dole. We/they were the cheated ones who were frisked by the government for our hard earned to pay for our own retirement.
What is your source that most were seniors and the figure you cited? Methinks it's a blind assertion.
BTW, Froggie, who's paying the Union workers, their organizers and many of the people who are there spending money, buying food, buying Ipods, phones, tents, etc.
I smell rats here, involving our Organizer In Chief, who saw to it that the workers could get two years $$ from the public dole so as to implement mayhem, chaos and spread anti capitalistic hatred around the nation and the planet?
Our Organizer in Chief is organizing his promised civilian army revolution so as to keep his promise of changing America so as for it to be compatible with he, his close bud, Bill Ayres, violent Weather Underground terrorist, America hater/pastor/former Nation Of Islam member/ bud of Louis Farrakahn, self avowed Communist/socialist, Frank Marshal Davis, etc, etc.
In order to fundamentally transform our nation into what Bill Ayers et al fail to do violently, the Organizer In Chief plans to achieve chaos and mayhem, destroy the American &&, undermine our only ally in the Mid East, Israel and empower the Islamic Brotherhood in nations like Egypt, Labia, (now Sudan) and other nations.
Now our Army is aiding and abetting the ruthless Islamic regime in Sudan who was burning villages, crucifying Christians, burning down the homes of Christians, killing and persecuting Christians to the point that, like now in Egypt, the Christians were forced to organize a resistance to save the lives of their families and avoid being forced to convert to Islam which was why the ruthless regime persecuted them.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 162 by Buzsaw, posted 10-14-2011 8:41 PM Buzsaw has not replied

  
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 306 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


Message 176 of 602 (637734)
10-17-2011 5:22 PM
Reply to: Message 175 by dronestar
10-17-2011 4:58 PM


Re: Best way to Occupy Wall Street
As you changed your post to say "trillion" instead of "billion", I shall withdraw mine. Which is a shame, 'cos I had some good sarcasm going there.
Edited by Dr Adequate, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 175 by dronestar, posted 10-17-2011 4:58 PM dronestar has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 215 by caffeine, posted 10-19-2011 12:38 PM Dr Adequate has replied

  
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 306 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


(3)
Message 181 of 602 (637757)
10-17-2011 7:52 PM
Reply to: Message 178 by Buzsaw
10-17-2011 7:43 PM


Re: Best way to Occupy Wall Street
Yah sure, like all of the city folks are going to run out and find a farmer to by dinner, produce, home canned peaches, pressed cider, whole hog sides, live steers to butcher, lumber to build your house and garage with, etc, etc.
He didn't say farmers, he said small independent merchants.
If Wall Street were blown to bits tomorrow, can you imagine the panic you and all of those nincompoops out their yelling their fool heads off about ?? would be caught up in along with the whole nation? The impact on the economy and welfare of Americans would dwarf 9/11.
If, tomorrow, someone assassinated the President and every Democratic congressman and senator and everyone who's ever voted Democrat, what panic would that cause and what would it do to the economy and the stock market? That would be bad. And yet you think that the existence of Democrats is a bad idea. This perhaps suggests that the criterion of "if they were blown to bits tomorrow" is not the correct one.
The protestors don't want Wall Street blown to bits, they want it better regulated so that Wall Street doesn't get another crack at destroying capitalism.
Edited by Dr Adequate, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 178 by Buzsaw, posted 10-17-2011 7:43 PM Buzsaw has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 184 by Buzsaw, posted 10-17-2011 8:42 PM Dr Adequate has replied

  
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 306 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


(6)
Message 185 of 602 (637767)
10-17-2011 8:52 PM
Reply to: Message 184 by Buzsaw
10-17-2011 8:42 PM


Re: Best way to Occupy Wall Street
That's a blatant false blind assertion. [...] It happens that the Democrats are the ones who are pushing for TARP and a whole lot of what are going to bankrupt the nation.
Well, perhaps your stance is more nuanced then I thought. Are you for or against bankrupting the nation?
Oh yah, sure, just what we need is more of the government medling in private lives and affairs that got us in the mess in the first place.
Er ... it didn't. That's something you made up.
You best go back to the science forums, Dr Adequate, where you can at least appear to be intelligent.
I shall freely stipulate that even the most recondite aspects of science are clearer to me than whatever the fuck is going on in your head.

This message is a reply to:
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Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 306 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


(3)
Message 193 of 602 (637916)
10-18-2011 7:03 PM
Reply to: Message 191 by rueh
10-18-2011 3:25 PM


Re: Best way to Occupy Wall Street
Why is it more fair that the richer you are the higher the percentage? Why not 10% across the board regardless of your income? To me fairness is for it to be the same for everyone regardless of income.
Marginal utility. Someone near the poverty line gets more out of 1% of their income than (say) Bill Gates does --- in BG's case taking away an extra 1% won't determine how well he can eat or whether he can make the rent this month. 1% of one's income is, by this standard, worth more to the person with a small income. But it is worth less to the government, because of being a smaller amount of actual dollars.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 191 by rueh, posted 10-18-2011 3:25 PM rueh has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 200 by rueh, posted 10-19-2011 8:25 AM Dr Adequate has replied

  
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 306 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


(3)
Message 196 of 602 (637959)
10-18-2011 10:15 PM
Reply to: Message 194 by Coyote
10-18-2011 9:20 PM


Re: Polling the Occupy Wall Street Crowd
Hey, look, he told the truth about something!
Our research shows clearly that the movement doesn't represent unemployed America ...
Yeah, well, they'd have difficulty doing that what with 85% of them having jobs.
But wait, I thought their problem was that they were all workshy layabouts demanding to suckle at the public teat.
I guess that was last week. This week the complaint is that they don't represent the unemployed. I guess they'll have to stop calling themselves "the 10%", then ...
... oh, wait.
Golly, politics is so confusing, isn't it? Maybe the Wall Street Journal should confine themselves to giving financial advice to investors ... oh, wait ... how did that turn out?
Edited by Dr Adequate, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
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Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 306 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


(3)
Message 197 of 602 (637970)
10-18-2011 10:51 PM
Reply to: Message 194 by Coyote
10-18-2011 9:20 PM


Re: Polling the Occupy Wall Street Crowd
Yet the Occupy Wall Street movement reflects values that are dangerously out of touch with the broad mass of the American people ...
We may also note that his poll could not possibly have shed any light on this, since he did not do an equivalent poll of "the broad mass of the American people" for the purposes of comparison. I guess their "values" are something else that he feels entitled to make up in his head.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 194 by Coyote, posted 10-18-2011 9:20 PM Coyote has not replied

  
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 306 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


(2)
Message 202 of 602 (638017)
10-19-2011 9:13 AM
Reply to: Message 200 by rueh
10-19-2011 8:25 AM


Re: Best way to Occupy Wall Street
True, the lower income can get more in food and rent than the higher income, however. The higher income also has more opportunities to allow that 1% to work for them and for the benefit of the economy as a hole than if it is just given to the government.
I guess we can agree that the government needs to raise some money for some purposes, you're not actually an anarchist. In that case I have provided a reason why there is some element of justice in the government doing so via a progressive system of taxation.
If you're now going to change your approach and talk about the practical outcome on the economy of progressive rather than flat-rate taxation, then we're going to have to leave off talking about issues of abstract justice and look at some actual facts and figures. Have you got any?
Now it is a fact so well-known that I don't think I even need to cite the evidence that economic growth was higher in decades in the last century when taxes on the rich were also higher than they are now. I admit that correlation is not cause --- but on the other hand correlation in the direction opposite to that suggested by your hypothesis does suggest that perhaps the causal mechanisms that you wish to invoke do not in fact exist.
---
I should add to that that in fact a moral solution, in the end, is what we're after. Sure, I want economic growth. But the only reason I want that (and, if you think about it, the only reason you want that) is because we think that economic growth will tend to make the citizens happier. We like "the benefit of the economy" only because we think that it benefits the average American. If it doesn't, what's it there for? So the question of people being able to pay for things like rent and food still remains as a consideration. If you could prove that making the 1% happier at the cost of making the 99% more miserable would benefit that unfeeling abstraction, "the economy", it would still be a reasonable objection to point out that it increased the misery of the 99%.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 200 by rueh, posted 10-19-2011 8:25 AM rueh has not replied

  
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