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Author Topic:   Where Did The (Great Flood) Water Come From And Where Did It Go?
ringo
Member
Posts: 18865
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 3.1


Message 304 of 432 (833313)
05-19-2018 12:43 PM
Reply to: Message 302 by Minnemooseus
05-13-2018 11:39 PM


Re: ex nihilo / de-ex nihilo
Moose writes:

"de-ex nihilo"


Ad nihilo?

An honest discussion is more of a peer review than a pep rally. My toughest critics here are the people who agree with me. -- ringo

This message is a reply to:
 Message 302 by Minnemooseus, posted 05-13-2018 11:39 PM Minnemooseus has acknowledged this reply

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 18865
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 3.1


Message 312 of 432 (879160)
07-12-2020 2:29 PM
Reply to: Message 310 by dad
07-12-2020 2:10 PM


Re: ex nihilo / de-ex nihilo
dad writes:

The bible indicates plant growth such as trees was very fast in the old world.


No it doesn't. But that discussion belongs in a Bible thread, not a science thread. Take it over thete so we can show where you're mistaken.

"I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing

This message is a reply to:
 Message 310 by dad, posted 07-12-2020 2:10 PM dad has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 313 by dad, posted 07-12-2020 2:43 PM ringo has responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 18865
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 3.1


Message 314 of 432 (879169)
07-12-2020 2:54 PM
Reply to: Message 313 by dad
07-12-2020 2:43 PM


Re: ex nihilo / de-ex nihilo
dad writes:

Is that because science is too small to be able to know one way or the other and deal in the issues?


Science does know but that's irrelevant to what the Bible says. In a Bible thread we can see if you're as wrong about the Bible as you are about science.

"I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing

This message is a reply to:
 Message 313 by dad, posted 07-12-2020 2:43 PM dad has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 315 by dad, posted 07-12-2020 4:35 PM ringo has responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 18865
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 3.1


Message 325 of 432 (879229)
07-13-2020 12:20 PM
Reply to: Message 315 by dad
07-12-2020 4:35 PM


Re: ex nihilo / de-ex nihilo
dad writes:

If science does know where the water came from or went as you claim, then post it.


You should read the post you're answering. I didn't say anything about where the water came from. (Sue me for being off topic.)

I said that there is nothing about rapid plant growth in the Bible.

Science does know where the water came from - the same place the Tooth Fairy came from, human imagination.


"I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing

This message is a reply to:
 Message 315 by dad, posted 07-12-2020 4:35 PM dad has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 328 by dad, posted 07-13-2020 2:20 PM ringo has responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 18865
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 3.1


(1)
Message 343 of 432 (879302)
07-14-2020 12:14 PM
Reply to: Message 328 by dad
07-13-2020 2:20 PM


Re: ex nihilo / de-ex nihilo
dad writes:

Science does not know.


You don't know what science knows.

dad writes:

It has no possible way of knowing whether wormhole like openings in the sky existed temporarily long ago in the past.


Science only deals with the evidence that we have today. You're just shooting yourself in the foot with fantasies about wormholes. Unless we DO know about wormholes, we can't use them to test the accuracy of the Bible stories.

dad writes:

As for your concern about what the bible indicates about trees growing in the former world, a garden was planted. Man ate fruit from trees in the garden the same week!


In Genesis One, the earth brought forth fruit trees on the third day - no talk about "planting". The sun was not created until the fourth day, so you have a bigger problem there to solve.

In Genesis Two, there is no specific time line.


"I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing

This message is a reply to:
 Message 328 by dad, posted 07-13-2020 2:20 PM dad has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 345 by dad, posted 07-14-2020 3:24 PM ringo has responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 18865
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 3.1


Message 347 of 432 (879333)
07-14-2020 5:17 PM
Reply to: Message 345 by dad
07-14-2020 3:24 PM


Re: Here comes the sun
dad writes:

Chapter two fills in details of what happened.


But chapter two contradicts chapter one on those details. And chapter two has no time line.

dad writes:

We also have trees and plants spoken about growing in the future in New Jerusalem, and no sun is needed. No problem whatsoever.


Huge problem, since we know it can't be done. Or are you going to insert another magical "different nature" in the future to make your beliefs work?

"I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing

This message is a reply to:
 Message 345 by dad, posted 07-14-2020 3:24 PM dad has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 350 by dad, posted 07-15-2020 10:07 AM ringo has responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 18865
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 3.1


Message 351 of 432 (879370)
07-15-2020 12:22 PM
Reply to: Message 350 by dad
07-15-2020 10:07 AM


Re: Here comes the sun
dad writes:

Chapter two is after the fact, as the first verse in the chapter makes perfectly clear.


You don't know that. It's just a poor apologetic made up to try to hide the contradictions.

What you should know is that the chapter divisions were added later. The first few verses of Chapter Two actually belong to the story in Chapter One.

dad writes:

What is done now or what you think can be done now is not an issue.


Of course it is, to reality if not to you. Your "different nature" in the past is completely made up, with no connection to reality or to the Bible.

"I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing

This message is a reply to:
 Message 350 by dad, posted 07-15-2020 10:07 AM dad has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 352 by dad, posted 07-15-2020 2:56 PM ringo has responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 18865
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 3.1


Message 356 of 432 (879429)
07-16-2020 12:17 PM
Reply to: Message 352 by dad
07-15-2020 2:56 PM


Re: Here comes the sun
dad writes:

The only way it can become an issue is if you prove a same nature in the past existed.


Done.

Whether or not you understand it is irrelevant.

dad writes:

2:1 - Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them.

So whatever is talked about here is after the fact, it was all done. Finished.


That's your problem. The first story is finished. Then the second one begins and it's different.

dad writes:

There is no possibility it could be some new creation order.


Since it IS different, there's no reason to think it's an "explanation" of the first story. It's just a different story with a different purpose.

"I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing

This message is a reply to:
 Message 352 by dad, posted 07-15-2020 2:56 PM dad has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 358 by dad, posted 07-16-2020 1:24 PM ringo has responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 18865
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 3.1


Message 369 of 432 (879534)
07-17-2020 12:47 PM
Reply to: Message 358 by dad
07-16-2020 1:24 PM


Re: Here comes the sun
dad writes:

We'll see if anyone is capable of realizing you posted something.


You have really lost the plot, haven't you? It isn't me against "we". It's YOU against "we".

The smart people here aren't afraid to correct me if I'm wrong. In fact, the people on my "side" give me a much harder time than any creationist. That's what science does. Nobel Prizes are won by disrupters, not by cheerleaders.

The purpose of EvC, as I understand it, is to expose the nonsense of creationism. Creationists can come here and spout their nonsense - e.g. you - and their errors will be pointed out. Nobody - NOBODY - is trying or even hoping to convince you of anything. That would be like trying to teach origami to a brick wall. You're the straight-man here. You're only here to set up the jokes.

Creationism is a rotting corpse. It is not allowed in public schools. That's our goal. We have already won.

If YOU want to promote creationism, YOU are the one who has to do the heavy lifting.

dad writes:

ringo writes:

The first story is finished. Then the second one begins and it's different.


There is no second one. There are details of what was already done.

You're just repeating yourself. Say something substantial.

"I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing

This message is a reply to:
 Message 358 by dad, posted 07-16-2020 1:24 PM dad has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 370 by dad, posted 07-17-2020 1:47 PM ringo has responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 18865
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 3.1


Message 371 of 432 (879575)
07-18-2020 12:20 PM
Reply to: Message 370 by dad
07-17-2020 1:47 PM


Re: Attitude adjustment therapy
dad writes:

How many live inside of you?


We, plural, are most of the members of this forum. There are a few drive-by creationists once in a while but they don't usually last long. They're a dying breed.

dad writes:

But if it is really a sham site out to hit believers....


It has nothing to do with believers. We have believers here who understand the reality of evolution and an old earth. Creationists are only a small subset of believers.

dad writes:

I feel the belief in creation is a superior belief and needs no promotion.


And will get none, especially in schools.

"I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing

This message is a reply to:
 Message 370 by dad, posted 07-17-2020 1:47 PM dad has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 372 by dad, posted 07-18-2020 5:27 PM ringo has responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 18865
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 3.1


Message 374 of 432 (879636)
07-19-2020 10:45 AM
Reply to: Message 372 by dad
07-18-2020 5:27 PM


Re: false prophet
dad writes:

Thanks for the prophesy about what will be taught to children in this world.


It's not a prophecy. It's reality. It's what's happening now, no creationism in schools. You might be able to change that by marching in the streets but you won't change it by posting nonsense here.

Edited by ringo, : Spalling.


"I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing

This message is a reply to:
 Message 372 by dad, posted 07-18-2020 5:27 PM dad has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 375 by dad, posted 07-19-2020 1:24 PM ringo has responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 18865
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 3.1


Message 376 of 432 (879654)
07-19-2020 3:05 PM
Reply to: Message 375 by dad
07-19-2020 1:24 PM


Re: begin has begun
dad writes:

The schools are closed in many places now, for example. Coincidence?


Undoubtedly.

But standards remain the same. You still won't get into medical school or law school or engineering school with a diploma from Joe's Creationist Skool.


"I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing

This message is a reply to:
 Message 375 by dad, posted 07-19-2020 1:24 PM dad has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 377 by dad, posted 07-22-2020 4:08 PM ringo has responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 18865
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 3.1


Message 380 of 432 (879825)
07-23-2020 10:06 AM
Reply to: Message 377 by dad
07-22-2020 4:08 PM


Re: begin has begun
dad writes:

Not when Joe's creation school was closed down because they refused to teach your religion as science, or were closed down for teaching Adam and Eve rather than Adam and Steve etc.


If you can back that up, start a different topic.

"I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing

This message is a reply to:
 Message 377 by dad, posted 07-22-2020 4:08 PM dad has not yet responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 18865
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 3.1


Message 394 of 432 (880171)
07-30-2020 10:21 AM
Reply to: Message 392 by Juvenissun
07-30-2020 6:02 AM


Re: Empty the oceans and pile the water on land, then drain back into oceans
Juvenissun writes:

Only it was a much shallower basin.


Where's your evidence of that?

"I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing

This message is a reply to:
 Message 392 by Juvenissun, posted 07-30-2020 6:02 AM Juvenissun has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 395 by Juvenissun, posted 07-30-2020 11:50 AM ringo has responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 18865
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 3.1


Message 396 of 432 (880183)
07-30-2020 12:15 PM
Reply to: Message 395 by Juvenissun
07-30-2020 11:50 AM


Re: Empty the oceans and pile the water on land, then drain back into oceans
Jevenissun writes:

It is a simple physical model one called isostasy.


That doesn't answer the question. You said the oceans were "shallower" then. Why would isostasy make the oceans shallower then than it does now?

"I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing

This message is a reply to:
 Message 395 by Juvenissun, posted 07-30-2020 11:50 AM Juvenissun has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 397 by Juvenissun, posted 07-30-2020 12:23 PM ringo has responded

  
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