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Author Topic:   Evolution is True Because Life Needs It
markl67
Junior Member (Idle past 2735 days)
Posts: 9
Joined: 02-20-2012


Message 68 of 188 (653412)
02-20-2012 9:37 PM
Reply to: Message 61 by Invader Scooch
02-19-2012 4:57 PM


This is my first post and perhaps my only post. I have been perusing many posts tonight and I can certainly see why there aren't many creationists posting here, as one commenter pointed out, given the repeated insults and condescending remarks. Basically anyone who discounts the evolution model is a religious nut job or a laughable fanatic of some sort.

As a believer in creation (ID) it seems to me that the evolution hypothesis attempts to build its case from the 2nd floor up. It cannot reasonably explain the origin of the "primordial ooze" from whence all life originated from. Something does not come from nothing. All life and the perfect order of the universe could not have come into existence by random chance. There probably will never be a "scientific model" for creation that will satisfy the other camp since any such model would be deemed religious in nature and not "superior" to the "accepted" evolutionary model. I guess the bottom line is it takes faith to believe either argument which ironically makes evolution a form of religion. Creationists have nothing to lose...if we're wrong then we all die like dogs and this life is all there is...


This message is a reply to:
 Message 61 by Invader Scooch, posted 02-19-2012 4:57 PM Invader Scooch has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 70 by jar, posted 02-20-2012 10:33 PM markl67 has responded
 Message 71 by Coyote, posted 02-20-2012 10:43 PM markl67 has responded
 Message 77 by hooah212002, posted 02-21-2012 12:00 AM markl67 has responded
 Message 83 by New Cat's Eye, posted 02-21-2012 10:53 AM markl67 has not yet responded
 Message 84 by Perdition, posted 02-21-2012 12:50 PM markl67 has not yet responded
 Message 99 by RAZD, posted 02-21-2012 10:11 PM markl67 has not yet responded

  
markl67
Junior Member (Idle past 2735 days)
Posts: 9
Joined: 02-20-2012


Message 72 of 188 (653420)
02-20-2012 10:59 PM
Reply to: Message 70 by jar
02-20-2012 10:33 PM


Re: There will be a 101 level course for Creationists.
"For by him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things were created by him and for him." Believing in creationism is not a basic tenet of Christianity? Really? I could care less what other branches believe. Truth does not rely on what others think or feel is right.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 70 by jar, posted 02-20-2012 10:33 PM jar has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 73 by jar, posted 02-20-2012 11:03 PM markl67 has responded

  
markl67
Junior Member (Idle past 2735 days)
Posts: 9
Joined: 02-20-2012


Message 74 of 188 (653422)
02-20-2012 11:27 PM
Reply to: Message 71 by Coyote
02-20-2012 10:43 PM


Re: Welcome!
Evolution does not need to explain origins? Exactly my point - building an argument from the 2nd story up. How do I know something doesnt come from nothing? Because it can't and it doesn't - logically and scientifically. (thermodynamics) You've heard this example before but it bears repeating...take apart a car and then blow up the parts and then parts re-form into the car (big bang). Anti-creatiionists cannot even explain where the "parts" came from. "Science relies on evidence", as opposed to logic and common sense in this case I suppose. Not that there is any shred of concrete evidence to support your hypothesis. You better believe I stick to scripture and I believe every word. God states He created everything in the beginning - seems as if the burden of proof is upon you to prove otherwise. You have made a choice to not believe because God is not something we can fully wrap our minds around so we look for other ways to explain the origins of life aka pride. I would disagree there is no faith required to believe your dogma.

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Replies to this message:
 Message 78 by hooah212002, posted 02-21-2012 12:01 AM markl67 has not yet responded
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markl67
Junior Member (Idle past 2735 days)
Posts: 9
Joined: 02-20-2012


Message 75 of 188 (653423)
02-20-2012 11:34 PM
Reply to: Message 73 by jar
02-20-2012 11:03 PM


Re: There will be a 101 level course for Creationists.
I'm not sure where you stand exactly to be honest so its hard to know how to respond. You state God is far grander - grander than what? But not grand enough to speak the universe into existence? I worship the God of the Bible. What God are you referring to?

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 Message 73 by jar, posted 02-20-2012 11:03 PM jar has responded

Replies to this message:
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markl67
Junior Member (Idle past 2735 days)
Posts: 9
Joined: 02-20-2012


Message 76 of 188 (653424)
02-20-2012 11:35 PM
Reply to: Message 73 by jar
02-20-2012 11:03 PM


Re: There will be a 101 level course on faith
There will be a 101 level course on faith...when every knee will bow...yours and mine.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 73 by jar, posted 02-20-2012 11:03 PM jar has acknowledged this reply

Replies to this message:
 Message 80 by Coyote, posted 02-21-2012 12:44 AM markl67 has not yet responded

  
markl67
Junior Member (Idle past 2735 days)
Posts: 9
Joined: 02-20-2012


Message 88 of 188 (653482)
02-21-2012 5:05 PM
Reply to: Message 77 by hooah212002
02-21-2012 12:00 AM


Yes, I know what the HoE says...I'm nor more "indoctrinated" by a pastor than you are by a professor/teacher right?. My contention is that the evolutionary hypothesis is bunk based on the fact that it doesn't address (because it can't) the issue of origin. Its my contention that all life is by intentional and intelligent design and because of that species do not need to change into something they weren't created for. Adapt/change within a species does not equal evolution.

Perfect order has nothing to do with habitation. Perhaps that's your definition of perfect. Habitable by what...only humans. Did it occur to you that perhaps earth is the only habitable planet in the universe as God's way of showing mankind their significance?

I'm not admitting defeat (not that this is a win-able debate by either side in all likelihood). What I'm saying is submitting a model on creation is not taken seriously because if/when the term "creator" is used its directly tied to God and deemed religious. It's like inviting a basketball team to play in a hockey rink.

Faith is belief in something not provable. If you had mounds and mounds of evidence we wouldnt be having a debate. Your reality is skewed in my mind...how anyone can look at nature and the amazing human anatomy and arrive at anything other than ID is mind boggling to me.

I certainly do care about life but this is all temporal to me. I try to live in light of eternity. I'm not sure what my statement has to with morals in any way. My point is if atheists are right then who cares, but if wrong then you have a major problem don't you. I cant even imagine thinking this life is it...


This message is a reply to:
 Message 77 by hooah212002, posted 02-21-2012 12:00 AM hooah212002 has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 89 by hooah212002, posted 02-21-2012 5:16 PM markl67 has not yet responded
 Message 90 by Tangle, posted 02-21-2012 5:19 PM markl67 has not yet responded
 Message 91 by Perdition, posted 02-21-2012 5:21 PM markl67 has responded
 Message 92 by jar, posted 02-21-2012 5:37 PM markl67 has responded

  
markl67
Junior Member (Idle past 2735 days)
Posts: 9
Joined: 02-20-2012


Message 93 of 188 (653501)
02-21-2012 7:31 PM
Reply to: Message 91 by Perdition
02-21-2012 5:21 PM


Fair enough. Thank you for stating your position in a courteous and respectful way.

I know we're getting way off topic but this type statement saddens me..."If all that is holding you back from committing immoral acts is the fear of eternal punishment, then I sincerely hope you never lose your faith."... the perception that God is angry and/or unloving. I never fear eternal punishment no matter what I do because I believe someone took my place and paid the debt.


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 Message 91 by Perdition, posted 02-21-2012 5:21 PM Perdition has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 106 by Perdition, posted 02-22-2012 11:13 AM markl67 has not yet responded

  
markl67
Junior Member (Idle past 2735 days)
Posts: 9
Joined: 02-20-2012


Message 94 of 188 (653502)
02-21-2012 7:42 PM
Reply to: Message 92 by jar
02-21-2012 5:37 PM


Re: more misrepresentation
Right...I guess anything short of you actually examining the Creator just won't suffice...

"For since the creation of the world God's invisible qualities — his eternal power and divine nature — have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that humans are without excuse."...from that book you don't believe exists...


This message is a reply to:
 Message 92 by jar, posted 02-21-2012 5:37 PM jar has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 95 by jar, posted 02-21-2012 8:19 PM markl67 has responded

  
markl67
Junior Member (Idle past 2735 days)
Posts: 9
Joined: 02-20-2012


Message 96 of 188 (653504)
02-21-2012 8:41 PM
Reply to: Message 95 by jar
02-21-2012 8:19 PM


Re: more misrepresentation
Fair enough on the science forum comment....understood. As a suggestion to you, perhaps you could show some respect for others beliefs and stop with the "myths" comments.

As to the rest of your post I have no clue what you're talking about. Calling God a critter and expecting to actually examine Him...and I'm committing hubris...?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 95 by jar, posted 02-21-2012 8:19 PM jar has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 97 by jar, posted 02-21-2012 8:52 PM markl67 has not yet responded
 Message 98 by dwise1, posted 02-21-2012 9:55 PM markl67 has not yet responded
 Message 101 by Dr Adequate, posted 02-21-2012 11:14 PM markl67 has not yet responded

  
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