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Author | Topic: New catholic scandal | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Trixie Member (Idle past 3706 days) Posts: 1011 From: Edinburgh Joined: |
The argument "it's her own fault for wearing a short skirt" is not the same as saying that wearing a short skirt gives a man "absolute licence to abuse her body without restrictions". That's the exact words that it is claimed the archbishop used. It's the phrase "absolute licence" that I see as the problem.
Can I point out that the short skirt argument, whichever way you slice it, isn't acceptable either, just incase someone thinks I'm alright with that.
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Dogmafood Member (Idle past 349 days) Posts: 1815 From: Ontario Canada Joined: |
Have they learned nothing from the various child abuse scandals? The RCC has adroitly side-stepped any liability in the past by claiming that all of their priests are actually independant contractors and that the church itself is not responsible for their misdeeds. One of my favourite quotes from the RCC...
quote: Source
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caffeine Member (Idle past 1025 days) Posts: 1800 From: Prague, Czech Republic Joined: |
The argument "it's her own fault for wearing a short skirt" is not the same as saying that wearing a short skirt gives a man "absolute licence to abuse her body without restrictions". That's the exact words that it is claimed the archbishop used. It's the phrase "absolute licence" that I see as the problem. I agree it's not a good analogy, but I'm having difficulty coming up with one. The point is that this can't be taken as incitement. Even if the arch-bishop does mean that it's okay to rape women (which I doubt), this in itself isn't a crime (I'm talking British law, anyway, I can't speak for every country in the world). "Raping women is okay" - the expression of an opinion, albeit a horrific one. Not illegal. "Go and rape women" - exhortation to commit a crime. This is illegal.
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New Cat's Eye Inactive Member |
Has anyone seen this already? No.
A Spanish cleric says it's OK for women who have had an abortion to be raped. Here is the link. Are you saying that this:
quote: ... is saying that its OK for women who have had an abortion to be raped? While its a pretty fucked-up thing to say, it doesn't say to me that its OK for the woman to be raped. I think what he was trying to say was: because she's acting as if she has a right to abuse her body without restriction, then she's allowing for others to do the same (not that I agree with that statement). But that doesn't mean that others doing that something would be OK. Rape would still be wrong, but since she's done something, that he feels is, so terrible, then she'd have no business complaining about something else, that he feels is, not so terrible. But I think he was trying to express how bad he thought abortion was, not how not-bad he thought rape was. That being said, it was a bad thing to say and he should retract it and appologize. The phrase "gives a man absolute licence to abuse her body without restrictions" certainly sounds like rape, and he does seem to be legitimizing it a bit. I think he probably could have phrased it better, or maybe there's a lot lost in translation. However, if he does think that its OK to rape women who've had an abortion, then he needs to be fired.
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saab93f Member (Idle past 1395 days) Posts: 265 From: Finland Joined:
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Hi CS!
While I kinda understand what you are saying I am baffled by the need to apologize on that monsters behalf or even to try and justify his train of thought. He should quit his "job" and move to a cave where he cannot do harm to anyone but himself. Horrid piece of filth - a real shame to all us men. I have zero symathy for a scum like that.
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New Cat's Eye Inactive Member |
"Go and rape women" - exhortation to commit a crime. This is illegal. I think its a pretty big stretch to make this a statment that the men in the congregation should go out and rape the woman who have had abbortions.
I agree it's not a good analogy, but I'm having difficulty coming up with one. How about this: 'a woman who drives 30 mph over the speed limit gives a man absolute licence to cut her off in traffic without restrictions because she has committed a sin as if she had a right to do so'. Meh, I dunno.
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New Cat's Eye Inactive Member |
While I kinda understand what you are saying I am baffled by the need to apologize on that monsters behalf or even to try and justify his train of thought. Yeah, I wasn't going to say anything at all because anything besides "OMG! THIS FUCKER IS SOOO TERRIBLE!" would be responded to with detest. Upon submission, I fully expected to have people tell me that I'm a bad person for not jumping on the bandwagon and hating on this guy (not that you've done this). But then I remembered that it doesn't really matter. I don't feel any need to apologize for this guy. I just don't think that what people think he was saying was what he was actually saying. Clarity for clarity's sake. That is all.
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Tangle Member Posts: 9489 From: UK Joined: Member Rating: 4.9 |
SC writes: That being said, it was a bad thing to say and he should retract it and appologize. Not good enough really is it? This wasn't an off the cuff remark in the pub, it was the Archbishop's Christmas message to his congregation. That's normally something you think about in advance and even write down. He obviously means what he says. If the Vatican doesn't fire him, they're once again saying that they are not going to conform to the normal rules of decent society. Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android
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Buzsaw Inactive Member |
I see Message 6 netted six jeers and zero responses. What does that tell us? It is indicative that the jeers were biased and unwarranted. It is indicative that the message was irrefutable.
BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW. The Immeasurable Present Eternally Extends the Infinite Past And Infinitely Consumes The Eternal Future. Someone wisely said something ;ike, "Before fooling with a fool, make sure the fool is a fool."
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crashfrog Member (Idle past 1467 days) Posts: 19762 From: Silver Spring, MD Joined: |
One jeer and one reply, just to make Buz's previous message as inaccurate as possible. It certainly couldn't get any stupider.
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DrJones* Member Posts: 2284 From: Edmonton, Alberta, Canada Joined: Member Rating: 6.8
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Or: it is indicative that the members thought that a jeer was the most response your message deserved.
God separated the races and attempting to mix them is like attempting to mix water with diesel fuel.- Buzsaw Message 177 It's not enough to bash in heads, you've got to bash in mindssoon I discovered that this rock thing was true Jerry Lee Lewis was the devil Jesus was an architect previous to his career as a prophet All of a sudden i found myself in love with the world And so there was only one thing I could do Was ding a ding dang my dang along ling long - Jesus Built my Hotrod Ministry Live every week like it's Shark Week! - Tracey Jordan Just a monkey in a long line of kings. - Matthew Good If "elitist" just means "not the dumbest motherfucker in the room", I'll be an elitist! - Get Your War On *not an actual doctor
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New Cat's Eye Inactive Member |
SC writes:
Not good enough really is it? That being said, it was a bad thing to say and he should retract it and appologize. Huh?
This wasn't an off the cuff remark in the pub, it was the Archbishop's Christmas message to his congregation. That's normally something you think about in advance and even write down. He obviously means what he says. Sure, but did he mean what people are interpreting him as saying? Did he mean what he was translated as saying?
If the Vatican doesn't fire him, they're once again saying that they are not going to conform to the normal rules of decent society. I could think up other reasons... but when have you ever gotten the sense from the Vatican that they think they should comform to the normal rules of decent society?
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Tangle Member Posts: 9489 From: UK Joined: Member Rating: 4.9 |
I didn't bother to reply or jeer but now that you've brought my attention to it again I see that it's well worth a jeer.
(You provide a link to an alleged convent brothel which turned out to actually be an priest talking about legalising prostitution - the jeer was for my disappointment.)Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android
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Theodoric Member Posts: 9076 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: Member Rating: 3.7 |
I see Message 6 netted six jeers and zero responses. What does that tell us? It is indicative that the jeers were biased and unwarranted. It is indicative that the message was irrefutable.
Umm, no.Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
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Tangle Member Posts: 9489 From: UK Joined: Member Rating: 4.9 |
CS writes: Sure, but did he mean what people are interpreting him as saying? Did he mean what he was translated as saying? No, of course not. But even though what he said was deliberately misinterpreted by the headline, what he actually DID say was bad enough to get him fired from any normal organisation.
..... but when have you ever gotten the sense from the Vatican that they think they should comform to the normal rules of decent society? Never. It's just disapointing to have it confirmed over and over.Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android
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