Summations Only

You sound like one of "Bill Hicks's Non-Smokers"Do you go up to cripples and dance too?

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I should mention that I do like your point that its silly for people to abuse the shit out of their bodies and then demand free healthcare.Edited by Catholic Scientist, : No reason given.

Um, you have said a bit more than that...

Nothing is "free"... but its free in the sense that they don't have to "pay" for it. So you know what I mean. Isn't this where you would berate me for being inconsistant? That's beside the point. Regardless of why you're advocating for it, there's still the issue of it being silly to trash your body and then expect to have someone fix a problem that arrises without you paying for it. Too, there's the moral hazard of this. Its been working fine for me. It is a little pricey, but we do a lot of innovation and inventing here too. That's gotta be factored in.

Universal insurance would increase the number of people who get free healthcare. I pay for my insurance out of my paycheck. The research just adds to the total costs. I don't think it would stop. I think other countries do significantly less than we do and people don't factor that in when talking about the cost of healthcare in the US vs the socialized version in another country.

Huh? Its not free for you if you're paying for it. Its free for the guy who isn't. That doesn't make it any less silly for the fatties to cry for free healthcare. I don't subscribe the quality of our healthcare to our provisions, but I do think they help justify the cost. I'm not opposing universal healthcare.

I'm not saying we dominate in medical innovations, nor that we've made the most significant medical achievements; I think that we spend a lot more money on research at the facilities that also provide the healthcare and that that drives up the costs in ways that it doesn't in other countries.Welcome to EvC by the way. How'd you find us?

My point was that I pay for my healthcare...Do you have a point or are you content in being pointless?

Nope.

Ditto. I don't claim that.

They don't have anything to do with it being silly for a fatty to cry for free healthcare. Silly, ain't it?

I've seen it in universal healthcare discussions where people will say something like:"Look at this country, they have socialized healthcare and the costs is waaay lower than in the U.S. So we should socialize ours to reduce the cost!"So yeah, but that's a whole 'nother country. I don't think it considers all the right factors. It just seems to me that we do a lot of medical research here at hospitals that also provide care. That's gotta drive up the cost.If those other countries have hospitals that aren't also research facilities, then that would play a part in their cost being lower.This isn't something I've really spent time delving into tho, I could be way off base. It was something I was jst saying in reply to our healthcare being "unjustifiable expensive".

Holy shit... so out of the top hospitals in the world, no matter how you slice it, the US has almost half of them, and then the next groups down are about 10% of that.As I said:

quote:

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I've seen it in universal healthcare discussions where people will say something like:

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"Look at this country, they have socialized healthcare and the costs is waaay lower than in the U.S. So we should socialize ours to reduce the cost!"

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So yeah, but that's a whole 'nother country. I don't think it considers all the right factors.

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Its not as simple as "they're socialized and cheeper ergo we should socialize too".

What does that imply? Is Taiwan a part of China? That's not what I meant by slicing, but your point isn't lost.How does dividing it per capita help determine how much it costs to run the whole thing?

But not every individual has insurance... The cost isn't divided by everyone, and neither is the quality. Even just the total number of people is going to affect the cost of healthcare for an individual... I guess I just don't see any value in comparing another country's cost to ours in considering only one variable: whether its socialized or not. That wasn't really the entire point, that was an aside to the point that the cost of US healthcare has other things going on that don't always get factored in when assessing the price. Maybe I'm looking at it differently. Straggler said the cost of US healthcare was unjustifiably expensive. I was considering the total cost of healthcare in general and thinking that we do a lot of stuff at our hospitals that can drive that cost up (research, etc.). That's going to lead to an increase in cost to the individuals who are paying into it.On the surface, dividing that cost by more people should lower the cost for everyone. But just because another country's costs is lower, while everyone is paying together, doesn't mean that the cost in the US isn't still going to be a lot higher because of all the other stuff that goes into the costs of the hospitals. Even if we were to socailize it, it still might cost a lot more than other countries and look unjustifiably expensive.

Nobody. Yes. Do whatever you want.