Connecticut abolishes the Death penalty

Please excuse me as I unironically use it for BOTH definitions. I would say that a serial killer is an unpredictable predator, judging by the nature of their crime have zero value for human life, and ANYONE fitting that bill should be considered dangerous.You didn't just say self-defense, you also said in the defense of others. The "others" if what I'm talking about. How isn't he dangerous? He is a SERIAL KILLER. Please enjoy the video... you'll get a kick out his ending statement. How do you know which one's are a threat and which one's aren't a threat? I'd say the condition of their crime is a good indicator.Most importantly, a violent, unpredictable serial killer who has no regard for human life is a threat to other inmates.- OniEdited by onifre, : No reason given.Edited by onifre, : No reason given.Edited by onifre, : No reason given.

There are lots of prisoners who are potentially violent, unpredictable and dangerous to other inmates. Not all of them are serial killers. Not all of them are in prison for the most serious crimes.So I am still unclear as to whether you are advocating the death penalty for prisoners who commit certain crimes OR for prisoners who are deemed violent and dangerous to other inmates.Can you clarify? Then I'll watch your video.

I have already made it clear that I don't completely trust them. That is an argument against the death penalty as much as it is against assassinations. Also, I've already made it clear that I did not support the notion of assassinating Bin Laden (not that he actually was assassinated), so please give it a rest. Again, this has nothing to do with capital punishment. Quit changing the subject. a) This is bullshit. If you were about to be shot by some criminal and an armed cop was there, damn right you'd want him to use his judgement and shot the perp.b) Even after a trial and an appeal, the Birmingham Six stayed in jail for an astonishing sixteen years. The corrupt establishment guaranteed that. Had the death penalty been on the statutes, they might never have been freed. Trials and appeals are not the magic bullets you seem to think they are.c) Trial Tri-al. Trial. Gah! I would not support the assassination of dictators by governments. There is no contradiction.But we're not talking about assassinations. Death penalty, remember? This is an argument for prison reform, not the death penalty. The control is over the life or death of the prisoner. You are twisting my words. That control is absolutely real.As for your argument about prison violence, I find that abhorrent. You are essentially arguing that we should kill someone for crimes that he might commit. Might as well argue to omit trials altogether, just in case a guilty party gets free and kills again. You keep doing this shit and it's annoying. Who the fuck said that was my only other option?I would support wholesale reform of the prison system, which I regard as an ongoing human rights crime, even in so-called developed countries. You cite this in another message. You cite it wrong. Try to read what I'm actually saying here. I don't support routinely arming police. Absolute nonsense. There are clear differences between firing on someone to save lives and the cold-blooded execution of a helpless victim. I've been over this and you have not responded. Clearly. You are in favour of execution, but seem unwilling to be executed. You would care about the innocent victims of wrongful execution soon enough if you were one of them. It's only that the fact that it's happening to other people that allows you to turn a blind eye to the fact that your policy would lead to innocent lives being taken by the state.Mutate and Survive

I'm sorry, but you referenced the wrong game... BF3 is where its at. You don't really know if Bin Laden was guilty? Didn't you see his videos? Certainly, we can both agree that he was guilty of the U.S. thinking he needed to be taken out And sending choppers full fo SEAL guys isn't something they do all willy-nilly. That shits expensive. I'm sure they had courtroom-like amounts of evidence. What they didn't have, was Bin Laden sitting in a courtroom.But the question was about trusting the government to do the proper work to ensure guilt. I don't think assassinations should require the same hindrance that a courtroom has. For army operations, they don't always have the luxury of having court as an option. And they have a vested interest in their country so I think we should be able to trust them to make those kinds of determinations. But with a convict, you already got the guy. Now you're just tea-bagging him.

...and not all are sentenced to death. It is a case by case basis.I am advocating the death penalty for certain crimes, such that it involves an extreme case of violence and an extreme disregard for human life. Because (A) it serves as justice for the victims family (B) the psycological effects of long-term solitary confinment actually increase the violent behavior (C) they possess a greater threat to those who come in contact with them.Please watch, I gotta go eat Indian food with my Philipino girlfriend now.- Oni

Lets reform this guy!- Oni

I just watched your vid. The guy in question was originally imprisoned for 3 years for auto-theft. He has done 15 years (and counting) because it turns out he is a dangerous and violent prisoner who is a threat to the life of other prisoners.So your vid would seem to support capital punishment for those potentially dangerous and violent individuals who commit relatively minor crimes such as auto-theft rather than murderers who are not a physical threat to other prisoners.I am sure that in your mind all serial killers are physically impressive specimens who are a threat to other prisoners. But unless this is the case your self-defense argument doesn't really hold water.

I doubt you can reform everyone.But that doesn't change the criteria of self-defense does it?

Straggler grumbles: defence: when the legal enforcement team successfully pulls off a sting operation at the point of a live transaction of stolen goods for small unmarked bills, returning the stolen goods to their rightful owner. Furthermore, when one member of the team, who lives right next door to another member of the same team, then goes home and removes the posts & rails between them....and then, retiring to his bedroom, in candlelight to read again some more Robert Frost.

Oh, I dunno. I don't think the data is that conclusive. They could commit crimes in prison. Also, they argue that people tend get out of jail and could go on and commit another murder. Too, that some people are beyond rehabilitation. Sure, but that could just be an argument against the appeals process rather than one against capital punishment. I don't think so. Justice and vengeance are not synonomous. Well in a pragmatic sense, that risk of an innocent death could be worth the prevention of future ones. Ya know, if it worked. I'd have to see the data. Well that's really easy to type on a message board Heh:

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They're typically extremely resistant to any form of argument.There are a few Ive spoken to who have, upon direct questioning, replied that there is no possible evidence or argument that would ever dissuade them...

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Well, how do you get justice? Yeah, but there's always another option besides killing the guy. I don't think its some necessity. I don't really think there's anything wrong with it either. I just don't think we need it. For many, death is the ultimate suffering. Too, sitting on Death Row has gotta be torturous. I could see it either way. I suppose you could drug 'em. There's always another option.

"Also, you know that guy the State of Texas is executing tonight. Definitely guilty. Why, he was found guilty by twelve upstanding citizens whose prolonged experience of watching American Gladiators makes them the ideal people to determine guilt or innocence. Go back to sleep."

That's a cupcake. Not cake. And you shouldn't be eating that, fatty.- Oni

I'm not trying to change the subject, it's just part of my overall point that morality and being for or against risking the loss of innocent life is selective. All that may get lost in the shuffle of trying to respond to everyone, but I'm not trying to pull a fast one on you. If you don't get my point, that's cool, it is sometimes hard to convey one's position over a message board. I could repeat it, or we can just stop the entire debate, up to you. Then my opinion on what I prefer is bullshit, oh well. And?I would prefer a trial based-death penalty rather than a cop on the beat judging a situation based death penalty. I find it has a lot less risk. Now, my reason was only to make a point. I actually do support an armed police force, even though those assholes have killed innocent people. And not just innocent mistakes because they missed judge. No. Actual mistakes based on racism, bigotry and stereotyping. But I feel there is a greater good done to a community to have cops armed, because here our citizens are armed too.Likewise, it is my opinion, there is a greater good served with the death pThe corrupt establishment guaranteed that. Had the death penalty been on the statutes, they might never have been freed.[/qs]So because of that one situation the entire death penalty should be abolished? I simply don't agree. I still feel some crimes warrent the death penalty. Well then let me respond. I don't feel someone like Gacy is a "helpless victim." They are far from even being considered human. Don't try to paint someone like that as some poor, helpless victim when 33 fucking bodies were found under his trailer.Lets take a look at a few of these "helpless victims." On Death Row: Lawrence Bittaker - convicted of rape, torture, kidnapping, and murder.One of the crimes:

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On June 24, 1979, they claimed their first victim, 16-year-old Cindy Schaeffer. They picked her up near Redondo Beach, Norris forcing her into the van. He duct taped her mouth and bound her arms and legs. Bittaker drove the van to a fire road on San Gabriel Mountains out of sight of the highway. Both men raped the girl, and then Bittaker wrapped a straightened wire coat hanger around her neck. He tightened the wire with vise-grip pliers, strangling her to death. They wrapped her body in a plastic shower curtain and dumped it in a nearby canyon.

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Jessie Campbell III: Murder, attempted murder, first-degree assault, and weapons violations for the August 26, 2000, shooting deaths in Hartford of 20-year-old LaTaysha Logan and 18-year-old Desiree Privette and the shooting of Privette's aunt, Carolyn Privette. Steven Hayes: Sentenced to death on all six possible death-penalty counts: killing Jennifer Hawke-Petit and Michaela and Hayley [Petit] in the course of a single action; killing a child under the age of 16; killing Hawke-Petit in the course of a kidnapping; killing Hayley in the course of a kidnapping; killing Michaela in the course of a kidnapping; and killing Hawke-Petit in the course of a sexual assault. Todd Rizzo: The 1997 murder of 13-year-old Stanley Edwards of Waterbury. He lured Edwards into his backyard under the guise of hunting snakes and then hit him 13 times with a three-pound sledgehammer.
(Note: The Connecticut Supreme Court ordered a new penalty hearing in Rizzo's case in 2003, but he was sentenced to death again in 2005.)Here's a fun case: Thomas Eugene Creech: Previously on Idaho's death row; in 1977 the U.S. Supreme Court overturned Idaho's previous death penalty on his appeal.He was put in general population...Sentenced AGAIN to the death penalty for murder, by beating an inmate to death on May 13, 1981.The poor, poor hepless victims, in my opinion, should be put to death. Yeah, go figure!- OniEdited by onifre, : No reason given.

What it actually shows is a man who has killed twice in cold blood, and yet has not received the death penalty. However IF he commits one more murder, then he will get it.My point was this, what do you do with that guy? When you can't obviously reform him. He is going to kill at will. Has no regard for human life. How many more times does he have to kill before you can consider him fit for the death penalty? Or if not the death penalty, then what exactly do you do with him?- Oni