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EvC Forum Side Orders Coffee House Creationist Shortage

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Author Topic:   Creationist Shortage
Tangle
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Message 54 of 415 (661783)
05-10-2012 2:41 AM
Reply to: Message 44 by Buzsaw
05-09-2012 9:34 AM


Re: Who Takes Who Seriously
Buzsaw writes:
Not sure, but likely relating to how the Crysper System applies the DNA factor, relative to macro-evolution, more-so than for evolution of species
There's no shame in not understanding what this is all about because in order to understand it you have to have formally studied the subject, normally for many years - like any complex modern science, you would normally be a research scientist in the particular subject before you could even think of having an opinion on it.
But there's a huge amount of shame in PRETENDING that you understand it and even more in thinking that you're fooling anyone here by claiming that you do.

Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android

This message is a reply to:
 Message 44 by Buzsaw, posted 05-09-2012 9:34 AM Buzsaw has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 55 by Buzsaw, posted 05-10-2012 6:15 AM Tangle has replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9537
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 3.9


(1)
Message 58 of 415 (661817)
05-10-2012 2:14 PM
Reply to: Message 55 by Buzsaw
05-10-2012 6:15 AM


Re: Who Takes Who Seriously
Buz, as has been said, it's nothing to do with your correction, what you said was just pure nonsense. You don't understand it at all do you?
(fyi - neither do I.)

Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android

This message is a reply to:
 Message 55 by Buzsaw, posted 05-10-2012 6:15 AM Buzsaw has not replied

  
Tangle
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Posts: 9537
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 3.9


(4)
Message 95 of 415 (662101)
05-12-2012 10:11 AM
Reply to: Message 92 by Buzsaw
05-12-2012 9:09 AM


Re: Evolutionists Behaving Like Jerks
buzsaw writes:
Like I have said, you tend to tolerate newbies for a spell but mother, censor, dog and harass them by and by until they're gone looking for a more fairly moderated and balanced board.
Your other moderators tend to allow more leeway. Your evolutionist constituency, and if I remember correctly, including some moderators, voted to allow me back in the science fora. Go figure, Percy.
I don't believe there are any better moderated discussion boards Buz - despite your protests, this is an exceptionally fair place to be. When I attempted to discuss these subjects on a creationists site I was banned without warning within 48 hours.
If you keep to the rules and follow advice, you can discuss what you like here - what's your problem with that?

Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android

This message is a reply to:
 Message 92 by Buzsaw, posted 05-12-2012 9:09 AM Buzsaw has not replied

Replies to this message:
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Tangle
Member
Posts: 9537
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 3.9


Message 114 of 415 (662176)
05-13-2012 4:30 AM
Reply to: Message 113 by xongsmith
05-13-2012 3:50 AM


Re: What's the purpose here?
xongsmith writes:
So here we are, inviting Creationists to come into debate with us, provided they adhere to the rules of presenting objective repeatable calibrated scientific evidence and rephrasing the conclusions thereof in such a manner as to demonstrate they understand what they are talking about. I ask us all - how can such a constraint produce anything other than defeat for the Creationists?
Well that's obviously what we rationalists think, but I was under the impression that creationists believe that they are equally right so why would they worry about coming here and defending their position?
My personal 'belief' is that cretionists know that their arguments about nature are weak - except the extremely delusional - so prefer to discuss these things with themselves and reinforce their beliefs rather than challenge them.

Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android

This message is a reply to:
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 Message 116 by Buzsaw, posted 05-13-2012 8:19 AM Tangle has replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9537
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 3.9


(1)
Message 118 of 415 (662189)
05-13-2012 9:07 AM
Reply to: Message 116 by Buzsaw
05-13-2012 8:19 AM


Re: The Delusional Ones
Buz writes:
At least we have enough smarts to know that.....
This made me smile - it reminded of the playground squabbles we used to have where one boy would say something stinging but obviously true and the other would fluster and finally blurt out something like...
"Well at least MY sister doesn't smell of cat piss, like yours does."
There'll be a formal critical thinking fallacy for it, but if not, I'm naming it the 'but, anyway, your sister smells' fallacy.

Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android

This message is a reply to:
 Message 116 by Buzsaw, posted 05-13-2012 8:19 AM Buzsaw has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 119 by Buzsaw, posted 05-13-2012 10:29 AM Tangle has replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9537
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 3.9


(1)
Message 121 of 415 (662195)
05-13-2012 10:44 AM
Reply to: Message 119 by Buzsaw
05-13-2012 10:29 AM


Re: The Delusional Ones
Buz writes:
They're too thin skinned to take the heat that creationists get sooner or later here at this site.
You finally said something that might actually have some merit.
The question is why? Do they have so little confidence in their beliefs that they can't defend them adequately against reason? It seems so to me. Creationists prefer to preach rather than debate - it's much safer than arguing fact.

Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android

This message is a reply to:
 Message 119 by Buzsaw, posted 05-13-2012 10:29 AM Buzsaw has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 123 by nwr, posted 05-13-2012 11:31 AM Tangle has replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9537
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 3.9


(1)
Message 125 of 415 (662208)
05-13-2012 1:12 PM
Reply to: Message 123 by nwr
05-13-2012 11:31 AM


Re: The Delusional Ones
nwr writes:
The problem is that they have a huge amount of confidence in their beliefs, but they have no ability at all to communicate a basis for that confidence (probably because there is no basis).
Yes, I've never met a creationist that wasn't extremely confident in their beliefs, but their reaction to being shown evidence of things that might contradict it is often to stick their fingers in their ears and go lalalalala.
A Jehova's Witness on anther forum thinks that I am Satan - quite literally - because I try to tell him about evolution. He won't/can't read anything written about it. That doesn't strike me a someone with any real confidence - it seems more like bravado to me.

Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android

This message is a reply to:
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Tangle
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Posts: 9537
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 3.9


Message 201 of 415 (668004)
07-15-2012 2:39 PM
Reply to: Message 189 by marc9000
07-07-2012 9:00 PM


Re: What's the purpose here?
marc9000 writes:
I know that’s the politically correct mantra, but there’s plenty of evidence that shows there is. The word "evidence" isn't the exclusive property of evolutionists.
Well, if that's the case perhaps you'd like to present some of the evidence in another thread and we could discuss it. Personally, I couldn't give a toss what forum it goes into - it,s either interesting or it's not.
For what it's worth, I've never met an atheist that was 'turned' by any of the ideas the ToE contains and I've never met an evolutionist and have no idea what one might be - in your world do gravitationists exist too?

Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android

This message is a reply to:
 Message 189 by marc9000, posted 07-07-2012 9:00 PM marc9000 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 203 by marc9000, posted 07-16-2012 8:26 PM Tangle has not replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9537
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 3.9


(1)
Message 208 of 415 (668084)
07-17-2012 3:49 AM
Reply to: Message 189 by marc9000
07-07-2012 9:00 PM


Re: What's the purpose here?
marc9000 writes:
Evolutionists don’t want to discuss some things about evolution. It’s not politically healthy for them. Admin knows that a sub-forum that welcomed discussion about the atheism in evolution could very well bring in too many creationists for these forums to handle. Combined with an exodus of atheists, it could very well close the forum.
This is cobblers. Evolution is a scientific study like organic chemistry or the physics of sound. It has nothing whatsoever to do with religion. Nothing. You have a peculiarly American, parochial christian fundamentalist view of this. The rest of the world looks on you with vague puzzlement.
In Europe evolution and religion get along fine - even the Catholic church - the religion I was born into and happily practiced until my teens - accepts it. My own atheism is as a direct result of noticing that the emperor had no clothes - that it was a blindingly obvious myth.
I heard about evolution two years later and didn't even make the link to religion until my (Catholic) biology teacher when introducing the subject of eveolution pointed out that whilst it was different to the Genesis story it was an even greater proof of God's design. (A point that went straight over my teenage head.)
As for not wishing to discuss atheism in evolution, you're crazy - we're doing it now, start a thread and we'll all pile in. It might be short lived because it's silly and mistaken, but it will get discussed. Quit whining about forum headings and get on with it.

Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android

This message is a reply to:
 Message 189 by marc9000, posted 07-07-2012 9:00 PM marc9000 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 216 by marc9000, posted 07-17-2012 8:50 PM Tangle has replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9537
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 3.9


Message 221 of 415 (668182)
07-18-2012 3:35 AM
Reply to: Message 216 by marc9000
07-17-2012 8:50 PM


Re: What's the purpose here?
marc9000 writes:
so you don’t believe that evolution is EVER used as a weapon against religion? You can look at the list of books I presented, then turn right around and claim that evolution has nothing whatsoever to do with religion? The book list is actually evidence for it.
A gun can be used to bring food to the table or murder a neighbour.
Some people - a very few people - both disagree with religion and have made an excellent living at it. They write books about atheism and one of the things they write is that evolution disproves the Genesis stories. Which it does. You really have to get over that simple fact and move on.
Us atheists have had to put up with the blithering nonsense written by millions of people and practiced in our churches (several of which are planted in every town and village in my country and yours), media, street corners and schools for our entire lives. Please don't complain that a handful of individuals are now saying things YOU don't like. People are free to choose what they believe, even in the USA I think.
But don't blame it on evolution - evolution is simply a fact of our world that can't be denied by anyone that isn't opposed to it as a matter of dogma.
I can't speak for all atheists, but all the ones I know bacame atheists because they saw through the nonsense, not because they learned about evolution.
I also know few fundamantalists. Here in the UK they are fairly scarce, the majority of Christians here have a very mild kind of religious belief - what you call compromise. But on the contrary, their beliefs are in no way compromised by science's adavances.
Your use of the word 'evolutionist' is similar to earlier Christian's use of the word 'heretic' - a thought crime punishable by burning. An evolutionist, if it means anything, refers to a biologist who specialises in the study of evolution, it is not a general statement to be applied to someone who also happens to be an atheist. It's not a synonym. You may as well call atheists biochemists, plumbers or car mechanics - it makes as much sense.
It's possible to be a believer in your God and accept evolution and most of the world does. It's also possible to accept evolution and have no views about god. It's also possible to be a real evolutionist and believe in your god and it's probable that 80% of them do.
I doubt though that it's possible to be a biologist and refuse evolution - that would be like a physicist denying Newtonian gravity; simply a denial of straight facts.
Another inconvenient fact for you is that the owner of this forum, Percy, is both a Christian and what you erroniously call an evolutionist. (Though, he may actually be an evolutionist - a real biologist that is, for all I know.) This forum is built to debate exactly these issues so to claim that the forum is afraid to debate them is pretty much as wrong as it's possible to get - even for a creationist.
Don’t feel bad, compromises of Christianity with the ToE goes over lots of heads, resulting in increases in atheism. And biology teachers know that.
Don't worry, I don't feel bad about it at all - like I said, my atheism resulted from a reverse revelation, not because a biology teacher said something weird about his personal beliefs.
You are railing at evolution and as though it alone was the cause of people's rejection of your myths - it ain't it's just one of the many bullets.

Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android

This message is a reply to:
 Message 216 by marc9000, posted 07-17-2012 8:50 PM marc9000 has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 222 by Minnemooseus, posted 07-18-2012 3:50 AM Tangle has replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9537
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 3.9


Message 223 of 415 (668187)
07-18-2012 4:37 AM
Reply to: Message 222 by Minnemooseus
07-18-2012 3:50 AM


Re: The state of the Percy
I believe Percy considers himself to be a deist. Which, from my perspective, is damn close to atheist.
If true, i apologise for my appalling slander.
It changes nought much in the sentence though.....A deist believes in god(s), an atheist doesn't. This forum was created to discuss those two opposites and all the ground in between.

Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android

This message is a reply to:
 Message 222 by Minnemooseus, posted 07-18-2012 3:50 AM Minnemooseus has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 224 by Minnemooseus, posted 07-18-2012 5:04 AM Tangle has not replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9537
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 3.9


(2)
(1)
Message 227 of 415 (668195)
07-18-2012 7:36 AM
Reply to: Message 226 by Buzsaw
07-18-2012 7:04 AM


Re: Your God's Book Purposefully Deceives?
Buz writes:
What true god would inspire a manual full of falsehoods for it's intelligent created beings to live by?
You got it in one Buz.

Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android

This message is a reply to:
 Message 226 by Buzsaw, posted 07-18-2012 7:04 AM Buzsaw has seen this message but not replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9537
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 3.9


Message 256 of 415 (668288)
07-19-2012 11:57 AM


This forum IS a on a mobile platform. I'm accessing it now on an iPad from Cyprus. I quite often do drop in whilst on a train going into London. I wouldn't worry too much about the platform - content is still king.

Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android

Replies to this message:
 Message 260 by foreveryoung, posted 07-19-2012 1:44 PM Tangle has replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9537
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 3.9


Message 261 of 415 (668300)
07-19-2012 1:48 PM
Reply to: Message 260 by foreveryoung
07-19-2012 1:44 PM


foreveryoung writes:
And the content sucks.
Yet strangely, you're still here. Maybe it's the popcorn.

Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android

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Tangle
Member
Posts: 9537
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 3.9


Message 331 of 415 (669515)
07-30-2012 4:29 PM
Reply to: Message 325 by Bolder-dash
07-30-2012 9:23 AM


Re: levels and levels and levels
bolder-dash writes:
I have to admit, I can't argue with that. Its the most honest and reasonable message I have seen you write.
Perhaps you could remember this; most atheists don't object to what you believe - it puzzles us but we know that belief is 'normal' and seemingly had some evolutionary advantage.
What we DON'T appreciate is believers trying to show that their beliefs are rational and, worse, denying science's discoveries because of their irrational beliefs.

Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android

This message is a reply to:
 Message 325 by Bolder-dash, posted 07-30-2012 9:23 AM Bolder-dash has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 332 by Percy, posted 07-30-2012 5:42 PM Tangle has not replied

  
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