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Author | Topic: Evolution versus Creationism is a 'Red Herring' argument | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
PaulGL Member (Idle past 3648 days) Posts: 92 Joined: |
"You must be born anew". Obtain into your being Zoe. Not something Burroughs experienced, which explains the misery he was stuck with. BTW: both sides my family were in Texas before 1845.
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1.61803 Member (Idle past 1764 days) Posts: 2928 From: Lone Star State USA Joined: |
And obfuscation the first resort of the pseudo intellectual .
"You were not there for the beginning. You will not be there for the end. Your knowledge of what is going on can only be superficial and relative" William S. Burroughs
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PaulGL Member (Idle past 3648 days) Posts: 92 Joined: |
It cannot in any way- directly. But my inference is that man would: 1; Have to be capable of being responsible before receiving a spirit. 2. Such responsibility requires a free will. 3. Such a free will requires a certain (evolved, genetically determined) level of intelligence. 4. THAT
(3. above) IS amenable to empirical processes.
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PaulGL Member (Idle past 3648 days) Posts: 92 Joined: |
When faced with the fact of Venusian craters of recent- even potentially historic- origin, an astrophysicist refused to modify his belief in a uniformitarianism philosophy that excluded the possibility of such events. That is dogmatic, not logical or empirical. Uniformitarianism as a cosmological (pre-telescope) school of thought excluded the possibility of close interaction between planetary bodies.
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PaulGL Member (Idle past 3648 days) Posts: 92 Joined: |
Whatever else, I hope that you do arrive at the Truth..
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ringo Member (Idle past 672 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
PaulGL writes:
From what premises did you make those inferences? And how do you determine whether or not those premises are true?
But my inference is that man would: 1; Have to be capable of being responsible before receiving a spirit. 2. Such responsibility requires a free will. 3. Such a free will requires a certain (evolved, genetically determined) level of intelligence. PaulGL writes:
How, specifically? (3. above) IS amenable to empirical processes. Edited by ringo, : Spelings.
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Taq Member Posts: 10304 Joined: Member Rating: 7.3
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By 'red herring', I meant it as you found its definition to be. I meant, specifically, that the whole argument of Evolution vs. 'Creation' is a distraction from what is of genuine life and death validity. Namely, that it is NOT of primary importance to know HOW we got here. BUT it IS of crucial (both individually and as a species) importance to know WHY we are here. The answer to the first question will not in itself be of any value to answering the second, relevant issue. The answer to WHY we are here does not lie within the purview of knowledge I completely disagree. If we are here due to the impersonal, non-teleological, stochastic workings of the laws of physics then the only purpose to life that there is is what we invent for ourselves. I think that is extremely important to understand, don't you? Edited by Taq, : No reason given.
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PaulGL Member (Idle past 3648 days) Posts: 92 Joined: |
The ability to choose (or reject) freely is intrinsic and unique to humanity. God is NOT capricious (all misunderstandings and misrepresentations to the contrary). Because man was made in God's image, we can thus extrapolate that God is a God of purpose, and is not arbitrary. He would NOT entrust man with any purpose unless man is capable of being responsible. and if man's decisions (will) are solely the result of either instinct or logic, then he cannot be responsible. A will that is a free will is necessary. And that has been shown to be resultant to a requisite level of intelligence, which is genetically determined.
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ringo Member (Idle past 672 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
PaulGL writes:
I'm asking how you determine whether or not those premises are true. Anybody can rattle off empty claims - "God likes tofu." Show us the thinking behind your claims, one step at a time.
The ability to choose (or reject) freely is intrinsic and unique to humanity. God is NOT capricious (all misunderstandings and misrepresentations to the contrary). Because man was made in God's image, we can thus extrapolate that God is a God of purpose, and is not arbitrary.
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PaulGL Member (Idle past 3648 days) Posts: 92 Joined: |
Can you prove or disprove the Bible? If you think so, then you rate yourself more highly than Rousseau- which is not very likely except in your self-evaluation- which is always (for all of us) never 100% accurate. Will the validity of evolution answer the question 'What is the purpose of man?'. "Coming to a full knowledge of the Truth is a subjective experience of a living Person. NOT an objective philosophy based merely on logical proofs. If truth was obtainable through mental effort, there would be no room for faith, grace, mercy, or Love.
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PaulGL Member (Idle past 3648 days) Posts: 92 Joined: |
Read post #81. Again.
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PaulGL Member (Idle past 3648 days) Posts: 92 Joined: |
You make logical inferences. Then you draw logical extrapolations from them. Then you test those with the known, relevant facts.
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ringo Member (Idle past 672 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
PaulGL writes:
You can't make useful inferences unless your premises are true. How do you determine whether your premises are true? For example, how do you know that man would have to be capable of being responsible before receiving a spirit?
You make logical inferences.
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PaulGL Member (Idle past 3648 days) Posts: 92 Joined: |
All knowledge (except for axiomatic truths) begins with making premises, which are then tested to see whether or not they are viable theorems. I 100% (to reiterate what I have previously stated) that YES! evolution is the only viable explanation for life as we know it. Why? Was it an axiomatic truth? No. But its premises logically led to inferences, which were empirically testable. Some failed. What we have today is the explanation of the process indicated by the mechanisms which passed the tests.
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ringo Member (Idle past 672 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
PaulGL writes:
And I'm asking you how you test your premises. You keep talking about man receiving a spirit. How do you know that your premises about that spirit are true?
All knowledge (except for axiomatic truths) begins with making premises, which are then tested to see whether or not they are viable theorems.
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