Understanding through Discussion


Welcome! You are not logged in. [ Login ]
EvC Forum active members: 87 (8929 total)
Current session began: 
Page Loaded: 08-25-2019 6:17 PM
29 online now:
AZPaul3, Tangle, Tanypteryx, Theodoric (4 members, 25 visitors)
Chatting now:  Chat room empty
Newest Member: Jedothek
Post Volume:
Total: 860,450 Year: 15,486/19,786 Month: 2,209/3,058 Week: 67/516 Day: 67/31 Hour: 1/11


Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
Author Topic:   Deep Homology and Front-loading
jar
Member
Posts: 31201
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 2.6


Message 15 of 172 (665979)
06-20-2012 1:30 PM
Reply to: Message 14 by PaulK
06-20-2012 1:18 PM


Getting rid of bad stuff
Doesn't the prevailing view imply that those things that are seriously damaging to the chance of reproduction will get filtered out?

If so, doesn't the prevailing view imply that random mutations that are NOT seriously damaging to the chance of reproduction get retained?

If that is true, then doesn't the prevailing view predict that random mutations that may be useful in the future but not useful at the moment also do not get filtered out?

In that case, how does the FL model differ? How can you determine is something was intentional or just **** luck?


Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 14 by PaulK, posted 06-20-2012 1:18 PM PaulK has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 17 by Genomicus, posted 06-20-2012 1:35 PM jar has responded

  
jar
Member
Posts: 31201
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 2.6


Message 18 of 172 (665982)
06-20-2012 1:36 PM
Reply to: Message 17 by Genomicus
06-20-2012 1:35 PM


Re: Getting rid of bad stuff
LOL

And your point?


Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 17 by Genomicus, posted 06-20-2012 1:35 PM Genomicus has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 20 by Genomicus, posted 06-20-2012 1:45 PM jar has responded

  
jar
Member
Posts: 31201
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 2.6


(1)
Message 21 of 172 (665985)
06-20-2012 1:54 PM
Reply to: Message 20 by Genomicus
06-20-2012 1:45 PM


Re: Getting rid of bad stuff
It's not snarky nor does it attempt to answer my questions.

In case you missed the significant question, here it is yet again.

jar writes:

How can you determine is something was intentional or just **** luck?


Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 20 by Genomicus, posted 06-20-2012 1:45 PM Genomicus has not yet responded

  
jar
Member
Posts: 31201
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 2.6


Message 95 of 172 (666375)
06-26-2012 1:36 PM
Reply to: Message 94 by Genomicus
06-26-2012 1:29 PM


Re: The Ubiquitin Story
Is there any reason to think it is inevitable for any fold to arise?

I mean it's obvious that the trend of evolution will be towards greater complexity but beyond that, is there anything that seems inevitable?


Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 94 by Genomicus, posted 06-26-2012 1:29 PM Genomicus has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 97 by Genomicus, posted 06-26-2012 2:03 PM jar has responded
 Message 100 by New Cat's Eye, posted 06-26-2012 2:18 PM jar has acknowledged this reply

  
jar
Member
Posts: 31201
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 2.6


Message 98 of 172 (666380)
06-26-2012 2:07 PM
Reply to: Message 97 by Genomicus
06-26-2012 2:03 PM


Re: The Ubiquitin Story
But the only known initial condition is that the first life was single celled and so it was inevitable that any evolution would tend towards more complex critters.

Well, for example, I would say the evolution of anti-biotic resistance to certain drugs is pretty inevitable.

Which of course is totally irrelevant to this topic even though it is directly predicted by conventional Evolution Theories.


Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 97 by Genomicus, posted 06-26-2012 2:03 PM Genomicus has not yet responded

  
jar
Member
Posts: 31201
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 2.6


Message 110 of 172 (666449)
06-27-2012 1:17 PM
Reply to: Message 109 by Genomicus
06-27-2012 1:10 PM


I predict no front-loaders.
The universal distribution of ubiquitin among eukaryotes strongly implies that it is necessary for eukaryotic existence, does it not?

No more than the fact that the water fills the hole implies that the hole was necessary for the water. The only thing implied is that ubiquitin was just good enough to work.

True, it could be a "frozen accident." But the front-loaders aren't going to gamble their chances on accidents. It would be far better design logic just to put that protein fold into the first cells.

But there is evidence of the existence of accidents while no one has ever presented any evidence of the existence of the front-loaders.


Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 109 by Genomicus, posted 06-27-2012 1:10 PM Genomicus has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 112 by Genomicus, posted 06-27-2012 1:26 PM jar has responded

  
jar
Member
Posts: 31201
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 2.6


Message 113 of 172 (666453)
06-27-2012 1:34 PM
Reply to: Message 112 by Genomicus
06-27-2012 1:26 PM


Re: I predict no front-loaders.
Because it was just good enough to work. As you said, a "frozen accident".

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 112 by Genomicus, posted 06-27-2012 1:26 PM Genomicus has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 114 by Genomicus, posted 06-27-2012 1:37 PM jar has responded

  
jar
Member
Posts: 31201
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 2.6


Message 115 of 172 (666455)
06-27-2012 1:38 PM
Reply to: Message 114 by Genomicus
06-27-2012 1:37 PM


Re: I predict no front-loaders.
But there is evidence of accidents and no evidence of front-loaders.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 114 by Genomicus, posted 06-27-2012 1:37 PM Genomicus has not yet responded

  
jar
Member
Posts: 31201
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 2.6


Message 117 of 172 (666457)
06-27-2012 1:53 PM
Reply to: Message 116 by Genomicus
06-27-2012 1:48 PM


I predict no intended outcome
Why should anyone assume that there was ANY intended outcome?

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 116 by Genomicus, posted 06-27-2012 1:48 PM Genomicus has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 118 by Genomicus, posted 06-27-2012 1:59 PM jar has responded

  
jar
Member
Posts: 31201
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 2.6


Message 121 of 172 (666461)
06-27-2012 2:14 PM
Reply to: Message 118 by Genomicus
06-27-2012 1:59 PM


Re: I predict no intended outcome
Nonsense, and the overwhelming evidence is that there was no intended outcome.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 118 by Genomicus, posted 06-27-2012 1:59 PM Genomicus has not yet responded

  
Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2018 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.0 Beta
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2019