Why I call myself a Conservative, Republican, Christian Creationist Evolutionist

I am not jar. I am not privy to the thoughts of jar, so I cannot reply for him, but I thought I might provide a bit of defense here. I do not think that he was "picking a fight" with anyone. Asking a question of someone, regardless of beliefs is not tantamount to "picking a fight." Of course, we cannot decipher anyone's intention (regrdless of use of smilies), but asking a question should not be equated with picking a fight, especially if it simply a question (of evidence in jar's case). Yes, there are components of history scattered throughout the Bible. It is the oral (mostly) history of the Jewish people reflecting the origin of their beliefs and subsequently a semi-historical account of someone who believed he was the Jewish Messiah.Besides all of that, I can use Aesop's Fables, Greek myths,Babylonian myths, Chinese myths, Ainu myths, !Kung myths, aboriginal Australian and New Zealand myths, Norse myths and North and South American myths regarding morals and history. Why should the Bible's stories regarding a particular peoples' culture during a particular time influence my own life today any more than these other stories that regard the respect of elders, the creation of the world, the importance of self-preservation as a group, the importance of sharing, the... etc?I do recognize the impact that Judeo-Christian thought has had on the development of Western culture, but where did Judeo-Christian thought have its own influence? I propose, not your god.There are many events that transcend culture and time. For example, a quote from Ancient Greece:"The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize their teachers." - SocratesSo is Judeo-Christian morality derived from God or derived from experience?

How about "Spiritual Rationalist"?

There is a point to people like me (who completely believes the theory of evolution but am an avid Christian) using the term creationist that you might be missing, because you are not the intended audience.The fact is that discussions about evolution with the average anti-evolutionist bring immediate pictures to their minds that are very hard to root out. I had a discussion once with a FRIEND who knows very well that I am a teacher in a radical Christian community that applies the Bible's teachings literally, rejects private property, etc. Yet, when I tried to explain evolution to him, and was succeeding (amazingly enough), he interrupted me and said, "Well, I just believe in God."I had to remind him that he knew very well that I believed in God, too, but it was as though he had forgotten it, despite how well he knew me.Using the term creationist to apply to people like me and Jar (whom I suspect I disagree with on very many things about Christianity) actually helps the discussion with anti-evolutionists, because it keeps it on a more accurate plane.I say that from experience. It helps. Otherwise, they forget who they're talking to.

I would love to have a Great Discussion with you one day. Not a debate, because I really believe that both of us hold valid views of Christianity, but rather simply where each of us might present the best case in support of our particular differences.You do though, cut to the very heart of why I describe myself as a Creationist. It is to remind those I am talking with that I do NOT reject GOD or take GOD out of the picture. When I discuss evolution or abiogenesis or old earth or the Big Bang I believe we are simply looking for "How GOD did it."

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

It was easy to notice that's what you were saying, because that's what I think, too. There's a LOT of us. Including Frances Collins, who did such a superb job in his debate/discussion with Richard Dawkins that he got Dawkins to step down from atheist to agnostic for a minute! Now THAT was a victory.

Jar often tells me how I and others basically have it all wrong. And if I don't give him enough information he likes to prod by saying that creationism is dumb or fundies or dumb or whatever other thing to goad someone else into a confrontation. He's not always like that though. It seems to come and go kind of like a mood swing. Maybe we can't, but we all try to do this by picking up clues. Some clues are left intentionally. You don't have to do anything you don't want. If you choose to believe in Norse gods or flying bat-people, you are certainly more than welcome to do so. In fact, I think that most fables have some element of truth to it. Many, if not most, possibly could have derived from an actual event in human history that was slowly synthesized over time where embellishments were allowed to flourish. For instance, when we think of Cyclopes, we think of Greek mythology. And I think it was Herodotus (I'm not certain though) that claimed on his expeditions to Scythia (modern-day Russia) that a colony of large one-eyed men lived in those parts of the Northern regions. To us that sounds fanciful, and perhaps it is. However, there are known cases of a rare deformity that causes the fusion of the two occular cavities where both eyes consolidate into one large eye. This condition is known to us as being fatal in most cases, but we at least know that it is possible.Also, legends coming from Indonesian natives and even Dutch traders from around the 16^th century claimed to have come into contact with these diminutive people, only a few meters tall, whom they named the Ebu Gogo. This is seen by us pure unsubstantiated folklore, but perhaps there is a bit of truth in the legend. One thing that lends credence to the claim is that anthropologists have recently uncovered the skeletal remains of tiny people on the island of Flores, Indonesia. This creature has been named Homo Floresiensis. And as of late, there has been considerable argument amongst themselves on whether Floresiensis is fully human or a subsect of simians who remained alive due to isolation. Okay.

quote:

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"The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize their teachers."

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- Socrates Three places according to the Bible.1. Creation
2. Conscience
3. Special revelation

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"A man can no more diminish God's glory by refusing to worship Him than a lunatic can put out the sun by scribbling the word, 'darkness' on the walls of his cell." -C.S. Lewis