While I wont yet go so far as to vilify Joel Osteen, I will point out that niceness is not a fruit of the Spirit. Comments?
I don't think you understand what "niceness" means. Niceness is acting with the fruits of the Spirit.
From your link above:
quote:One of these is unlike the others: love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, niceness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control. According to Paul’s letter to the church at Galatia, all but one of these is what he refers to as the fruit of the Spirit, which is to say, visible evidence of the presence of the Holy Spirit in the life of a Christian...
...which one is foreign to the list? Niceness.
Let's take the list and remove "niceness," we then have:
Can you actually be "nice" without any of these also describing your actions? Can you actually "seem nice" but actually act in a deceiving way that doesn't break at least one of these other virtues?
The answer to both of these questions is "no." That's because those virtues are exactly what "niceness" means. It's simply not included because it's redundant. The phrase "be cool, bro" isn't included either. That doesn't mean you can go around acting in a way that is "uncool, bro" such as littering and vandalizing and still claim to be a Christian just beause "be cool, bro" isn't on the list. You would be breaking the other virtues anyway.
I fully admit that you can "not be nice" and align yourself with a few quotes from the Bible, but there are a lot of quotes in the Bible that have nothing to do with love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness or self-control.
It is impossible to "not be nice" and also align yourself with the virtues of "love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control." That's just what being nice means.
Which is why I find his entire point about "niceness" not being in that specific list to be redundant and just a waste of words. It's not there because it doesn't need to be there. It doesn't add any value, and not having that word there doesn't take any value away. Exactly the same reason why "be cool, bro" isn't included.
The Christians also vilify same sex marriage. I will state publically that I believe that some men are attracted to their own gender, but I will also add that the purpose of such attraction is not to commune in the flesh with another man. The purpose of the attraction is, in my opinion, to minister spiritually to other men.
Yes, the link you provided makes the same mistake. Are you trying to say that being against same sex marriage may not "be nice," but it is still "with the fruits of the Spirit"? That doesn't work either. In being "against" men having sex with other men you are not acting with "kindness" or "joy" or "love." If two men love each other and want to get married, and you simply speak your own personal opinion against such a thing... you are still specifically speaking against love. It's the first virtue in the list, even...
That is between us as individuals and GOD, creator of all seen and unseen...knowable only through His Son, Jesus.
Perhaps you should consider your own advice and actually leave it to God and Jesus. When you even think (let alone actually say or write) about the idea that "the purpose of such attraction is not to commune in the flesh with another man;" then you are definitely not leaving it between those men and God. You are stuffing your thoughts of God and Jesus out into the world. Maybe your interpretation of the Bible is absolutely correct and this is exactly how God believes as well. You're still not letting it stay between those men and Jesus. You're injecting your voice.
Because you want me to watch some crap from some religious guy that has something"important" to say and I won't? Because you are continuing to be off=topic and I call you on it? If I want preaching, and I don't, I will make the effort and step into a church.
If you want to preach, start a thread called "Phat is preaching", not "Christian Radio Freakshow"
How many times are you going to break forum rules in this one thread? I count 3 so far.
Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.
What standard, if any, should Christian radio and TV be held to?
They should be held to the standards of truth and reality. Not by some governing body but by each listener. Just let them do their thing and thereby be revealed as the hucksters that they are.
I happened across some late night Dr. Creflo Dollar type guy who was peddling survival supplies for the pending apocalypse. Empty water bottles for $50 a piece and if you buy 6 of them you can miraculously stack them up and create a stylish coffee table (tablecloth not included)! But wait, that's not all. These were special apocalypse water bottles that, via the marvels of god given technology, changed the pH of the water by several thousand % and brought it up to a healthy 8.3 . Then he said 'Remember. Jesus wants you to be safe during the coming tribulations.' All the while his painted lady smiles and nods.
I have some sympathy for the little old lady who sends in half of her pension cheque but anybody who believes this kind of crap deserves to be poor and sick. Society should have protected her with a decent education and not by censoring every flake who shows up on late night TV or AM talk radio. We could even use the popularity of such programs as a counter indicator of how well our education system is working.
What you feel or believe has nothing to do with the topic, so why do you feel the need to preach?
The reason that you irritate me is that you are in a topic(faith & belief) that you yourself know nothing about. You may well possess an intellect that allows you to catch me "violating forum rules" in not strictly adhering to this topic, but might I remind you that I myself started the topic and have license to alter the direction of the topic in any manner I choose (within a faith/belief context). It is quite clear that you yourself are no fan of faith and belief, so why even venture into this territory? Stay on your side of the fence and we will get along fine.
Keep in mind that of the three posts you have contributed to this topic in, none of them have anything constructive to add to the topic either, so I wouldn't attempt throwing stones in a glass house---you might end up cutting yourself.
What standard, if any, should Christian radio and TV be held to?
dogmafood writes:
They should be held to the standards of truth and reality. Not by some governing body but by each listener. Just let them do their thing and thereby be revealed as the hucksters that they are.
Is there a way to pin faith & belief into a standard of truth and reality, seeing as how by definition neither can be measured? One mans bullshit is, in effect, another mans belief. One mans definition of huckster might not be interpreted the same by other listeners. This is the issue with faith and belief. It seemingly has no ironclad definition. I suppose majority opinion is the only standard. Even then, the minority could claim enlightenment and that the majority was deceived.
One mans bullshit is, in effect, another mans belief.
I think that believing something that can not be proven is quite different from believing things that are demonstrably wrong.
It may be that the guy actually believed that drinking water with a pH of 8.3 is healthy but 30 seconds of googling will show anyone that he is either completely misinformed or completely full of shit.
One mans definition of huckster might not be interpreted the same by other listeners.
This is why the filters need to go in at the listener level. We shouldn't be scurrying around making sure that no one says things that are not true. We should be trying harder to help people understand how to find out if things are true or not.
I suppose majority opinion is the only standard.
No, that is a fallacy known as an appeal to popularity.
The principals of logic are about the first thing that should be drummed into everyone's head. If we could just get those to be fully understood then we wouldn't need to go around marking all the hazards. A working knowledge of the main logical fallacies should be tied to citizenship or getting your licence or something. At the very least it should be a prerequisite to graduating from high school.
The reason that you irritate me is that you are in a topic(faith & belief) that you yourself know nothing about.
How the hell do you know that I know nothing about faith and belief. I wasn't raised an atheist. I spent many years with unfounded faith and belief.
but might I remind you that I myself started the topic and have license to alter the direction of the topic in any manner I choose (within a faith/belief context)
Then make a change to the OP. It is kind of sad that you have to misrepresent the topic in order to preach. Telling, too.
Stay on your side of the fence and we will get along fine.
Please point out to me where it says nonbelievers cannot participate in certain fora and topics.
Keep in mind that of the three posts you have contributed to this topic in, none of them have anything constructive to add to the topic either, so I wouldn't attempt throwing stones in a glass house---you might end up cutting yourself.
This is absolutely priceless. Not even worth a response.
In the words of G.W.B.
quote:"Brownie, you're doing a heck of a job,"
Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.
It was only a matter of time until Pastors and Guns merged!
Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. –RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." –Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith Paul was probably SO soaked in prayer nobody else has ever equaled him.~Faith :)
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. Then he said 'Remember. Jesus wants you to be safe during the coming tribulations.' All the while his painted lady smiles and nods.
