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Author Topic:   Phat Unplugged
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17009
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.7


Message 106 of 119 (888714)
09-29-2021 2:08 PM
Reply to: Message 104 by Percy
09-29-2021 1:21 PM


Re: Production Backs The Dollar
That’s still $378B for 2021 which is rather more than $300B

I can’t find any explanation either, but obviously there must be some factor which reduces the gross amount reported by the Treasury.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 104 by Percy, posted 09-29-2021 1:21 PM Percy has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 107 by Percy, posted 09-29-2021 2:33 PM PaulK has not yet responded

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 20334
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 4.1


(2)
Message 107 of 119 (888715)
09-29-2021 2:33 PM
Reply to: Message 106 by PaulK
09-29-2021 2:08 PM


Re: Production Backs The Dollar
PaulK writes:

That’s still $378B for 2021 which is rather more than $300B

$300 billion is clearly wrong. It seems to be a common mistake on the Internet, but I'm sorry I wasn't more thorough initially. If you type "federal debt interest 300 billion" to Google you'll get a list of sites that have it wrong, including the Committee for a Responsible Federal Budget and Mitt Romney's official Senate website.

But when Phat cited a different figure I went to the US budget to get something authoritative, and it gives $378 billion in net interest for fiscal 2021. I think net interest is a better figure figure than total interest paid for calculating the proportion of federal revenues going toward interest, and that would be 378/3860 or 9.8%.

--Percy


This message is a reply to:
 Message 106 by PaulK, posted 09-29-2021 2:08 PM PaulK has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 115 by Phat, posted 10-12-2021 4:02 PM Percy has responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 19260
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 4.4


Message 108 of 119 (888722)
09-30-2021 12:24 PM
Reply to: Message 99 by Phat
09-29-2021 7:21 AM


Re: Production Backs The Dollar
Phat writes:

Believe it or not, I'm no dummy.


Your sources are dummies - or liars with an ulterior motive.

"I call that bold talk for a one-eyed fat man!"
-- Lucky Ned Pepper

This message is a reply to:
 Message 99 by Phat, posted 09-29-2021 7:21 AM Phat has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 109 by Phat, posted 10-03-2021 10:36 AM ringo has responded

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 15652
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003


Message 109 of 119 (888754)
10-03-2021 10:36 AM
Reply to: Message 108 by ringo
09-30-2021 12:24 PM


Re: Production Backs The Dollar
It is easy to criticize my sources, but I would wager that no one in this forum understands the markets and the global money system any better than I do. If so, step up and give me *your* sources. None of you are finance majors as far as I know. (Percy you are the exception. You have some solid sources.)

Im about to start a new topic.

It will be called Testing The Financial Apologists Conmen.

As for Ringo, he will argue anything that I post, but I doubt he understands finance at all. All he knows is that Jesus told us to give it all away. Which is another argument unto itself.

Edited by Phat, : No reason given.


"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
“…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox

“The whole war between the atheist and the theist comes down to this: the atheist believes a 'what' created the universe; the theist believes a 'who' created the universe.”
- Criss Jami, Killo

“The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
(1894).


This message is a reply to:
 Message 108 by ringo, posted 09-30-2021 12:24 PM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 110 by ringo, posted 10-03-2021 11:48 AM Phat has acknowledged this reply
 Message 111 by PaulK, posted 10-03-2021 11:55 AM Phat has not yet responded
 Message 112 by Percy, posted 10-03-2021 12:47 PM Phat has acknowledged this reply
 Message 113 by Tangle, posted 10-03-2021 4:38 PM Phat has not yet responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 19260
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 4.4


(2)
Message 110 of 119 (888761)
10-03-2021 11:48 AM
Reply to: Message 109 by Phat
10-03-2021 10:36 AM


Re: Production Backs The Dollar
Phat writes:

I would wager that no one in this forum understands the markets and the global money system any better than I do.


Don't bet more than you can afford to lose.

Phat writes:

None of you are finance majors as far as I know. (Percy you are the exception. You have some solid sources.)


And yet you feel free to berate the people who agree with Percy.

Phat writes:

As for Ringo, he will argue anything that I post....


I only point out where you're wrong. If you don't want it pointed out, stop being wrong.

Phat writes:

All he knows is that Jesus told us to give it all away.


Your obsession with that point suggests to me that you feel guilty about it.

"I call that bold talk for a one-eyed fat man!"
-- Lucky Ned Pepper

This message is a reply to:
 Message 109 by Phat, posted 10-03-2021 10:36 AM Phat has acknowledged this reply

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17009
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.7


(1)
Message 111 of 119 (888762)
10-03-2021 11:55 AM
Reply to: Message 109 by Phat
10-03-2021 10:36 AM


Re: Production Backs The Dollar
quote:
It is easy to criticize my sources, but I would wager that no one in this forum understands the markets and the global money system any better than I do

I doubt that anyone here is as ignorant of basic economics as you. I might be wrong, but supply and demand is a simple concept, but you haven’t grasped it.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 109 by Phat, posted 10-03-2021 10:36 AM Phat has not yet responded

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 20334
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 4.1


(1)
Message 112 of 119 (888763)
10-03-2021 12:47 PM
Reply to: Message 109 by Phat
10-03-2021 10:36 AM


Re: Production Backs The Dollar
What an odd post. I don't know what you mean by sources, I might tend to include more links than other people, but I don't think my opinion differs from anyone else's. The only thing you know about the "global money system" is how to use words like "global" and "money" in a sentence.

You've been given accurate information about how things work over and over again and never given any indication of understanding it. You mostly ignore it. I'm becoming uncertain that you know what it feels like to comprehend something.

--Percy

Edited by Percy, : Typo.

Edited by Percy, : Grammar.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 109 by Phat, posted 10-03-2021 10:36 AM Phat has acknowledged this reply

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 8209
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.9


(3)
Message 113 of 119 (888766)
10-03-2021 4:38 PM
Reply to: Message 109 by Phat
10-03-2021 10:36 AM


Re: Production Backs The Dollar
quote:
None of you are finance majors as far as I know.

I have a Master's degree in Business and spent a half a lifetime in commercial finance. Does that count?

If so, trust me, unless Jesus actually does talk to you about gold bars, you haven't a clue.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 109 by Phat, posted 10-03-2021 10:36 AM Phat has not yet responded

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 15652
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003


Message 114 of 119 (888780)
10-05-2021 11:26 AM
Reply to: Message 105 by Percy
09-29-2021 1:46 PM


Re: Production Backs The Dollar
Lets use your sources and take this argument over to my new topic.
Message 6

"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
“…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox

“The whole war between the atheist and the theist comes down to this: the atheist believes a 'what' created the universe; the theist believes a 'who' created the universe.”
- Criss Jami, Killo

“The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
(1894).


This message is a reply to:
 Message 105 by Percy, posted 09-29-2021 1:46 PM Percy has acknowledged this reply

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 15652
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003


Message 115 of 119 (888854)
10-12-2021 4:02 PM
Reply to: Message 107 by Percy
09-29-2021 2:33 PM


Re: Production Backs The Dollar
What I'm talking about is interest on the debt outstanding. You seem to refer to interest on the yearly deficit.
This Figure Is What I Mean

"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
“…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox

“The whole war between the atheist and the theist comes down to this: the atheist believes a 'what' created the universe; the theist believes a 'who' created the universe.”
- Criss Jami, Killo

“The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
(1894).


This message is a reply to:
 Message 107 by Percy, posted 09-29-2021 2:33 PM Percy has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 116 by Percy, posted 10-13-2021 10:10 AM Phat has responded

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 20334
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 4.1


Message 116 of 119 (888855)
10-13-2021 10:10 AM
Reply to: Message 115 by Phat
10-12-2021 4:02 PM


Re: Production Backs The Dollar
Phat writes:

What I'm talking about is interest on the debt outstanding. You seem to refer to interest on the yearly deficit.

It took you two weeks to reach this impossible conclusion? Math is just a word to you, isn't it? A quick mental calculation, a sanity check, so to speak, to make sure that what you're about to say isn't completely idiotic, is a sheer impossibility. Am I right?

Here's the quick mental math you should have performed. The projected federal deficit for 2021 is $2.3 trillion. The net interest I cited from the federal budget was $378 billion. Round the numbers off to do some quick dividing to get a rough ballpark figure, i.e., divide $2400 billion into $400 billion to get 1/6, which anyone familiar with math knows off the top of their head is 16.7%. Or you could just type "378/2300" in to Google, which yields 16.4%.

Since interest rates are nowhere near 16.4% the $378 billion in net interest I mentioned could not possibly have been on the annual deficit. Please try again.

You are impossible to discuss with because posts correcting your errors are just launch points for you to make more errors.

--Percy

Edited by Percy, : Typo.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 115 by Phat, posted 10-12-2021 4:02 PM Phat has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 117 by Phat, posted 10-13-2021 6:38 PM Percy has responded

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 15652
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003


Message 117 of 119 (888857)
10-13-2021 6:38 PM
Reply to: Message 116 by Percy
10-13-2021 10:10 AM


Re: Production Backs The Dollar
The link I shared with you has $562,388,232,682.17 as the total.

Meaning Interest.

They seem like a reliable source.
Interest Expense on the Debt Outstanding.

Edited by Admin, : Fix link.


"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
“…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox

“The whole war between the atheist and the theist comes down to this: the atheist believes a 'what' created the universe; the theist believes a 'who' created the universe.”
- Criss Jami, Killo

“The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
(1894).


This message is a reply to:
 Message 116 by Percy, posted 10-13-2021 10:10 AM Percy has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 118 by Percy, posted 10-13-2021 7:35 PM Phat has not yet responded
 Message 119 by nwr, posted 10-13-2021 8:54 PM Phat has acknowledged this reply

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 20334
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 4.1


Message 118 of 119 (888858)
10-13-2021 7:35 PM
Reply to: Message 117 by Phat
10-13-2021 6:38 PM


Re: Production Backs The Dollar
There's an entire cascade of things you're just not getting. Every attempt to correct your misunderstandings just creates more of them. This is hopeless.

Give it up. You're never going to get it.

--Percy


This message is a reply to:
 Message 117 by Phat, posted 10-13-2021 6:38 PM Phat has not yet responded

  
nwr
Member
Posts: 5810
From: Geneva, Illinois
Joined: 08-08-2005
Member Rating: 5.0


Message 119 of 119 (888859)
10-13-2021 8:54 PM
Reply to: Message 117 by Phat
10-13-2021 6:38 PM


Re: Production Backs The Dollar
They seem like a reliable source.
Interest Expense on the Debt Outstanding.

Do you not know how to post links?

Using "peek" you appear to have some extraneous spaces. Presumably, it should be:
Interest Expense on the Debt Outstanding.


Fundamentalism - the anti-American, anti-Christian branch of American Christianity

This message is a reply to:
 Message 117 by Phat, posted 10-13-2021 6:38 PM Phat has acknowledged this reply

  
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